mmarshall

Several reasons for this. First, the RL has standard AWD. That, combined with a powerful V6 (close to 300HP) is going to use some gas. Second, the LS460 has an 8-speed automatic, with taller overdrive gears. Third, the LS can AFFORD to have a more complex transmission.....it costs almost 50% more than an RL. Fourth, EPA numbers are notoriously unaccurate, even with the newer, supposed more relistic ratings. I have often done better than the EPA figures myself......sometimes as much a 5-6 MPG.

IS-SV

Not to mention the RL's dated SOHC design resulting in a 3.7L engine producing only 300hp and 271 pounds of torque (lack DOHC and direct injection). Since AWD saps some performance, manufacturers usually use shorter final drive ratios than a RWD equivalent car to mask the effect, of course that has a negative impact on gas mileage.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

again, comparing epa to real life is pointless, i agree. but between cars they are comparable. they are done using the same standard.

plus awd? it affects gas mileage but still. gs350 awd epa is 18/25, 16/22 for the rl? that's just a joke by any standard. my gs400/sc430 were rated at 18/23. given new standard lowers the epa a bit, that seems like a 10 yr old technology to me.

bottom line is with today's standard, no matter how you put it, the efficiency of the rl is just horrible

Stormforge

ah, the good old days! my very first car, a 1987 4 door hatchback. brings back good modding memories!

UZ214

i agree, i bought a mdx and the gas mileage was horrible, i had to drive really slow to get even close to epa numbers, rx on the other hand beats the epa numbers. Not o mention the quality and build material on the mdx was crap and the useless top of the line Bose system... one good thing was i sold it as much i bought it for after 10k more miles on it

IS-SV

Agreed, new EPA mileage methods are improved and make for meaningful comparisons.

I8ABMR

Acura saying they are going to make Teir 1 status without a V8 or RWD is like saying you are going to the moon on a hot air ballon. There are just some physical and dynamics issues.


For now they need to work on getting customers loaner cars for ANYTHING like Lexus and Infiniti provide.

IS350jet

The SOHC design of the Honda/Acura V6 and I4's is genious, if you ask me. There's really no benefit to having Two cams on each head. 1 cam can still open and close 4 valves per cylinder just as well as two. It saves weight and decreases overall package size. They will rev as smoothe and quiet as anything on the market today. What makes SOHC defuct or outdated?

DI injection is relatively new technology. Honda doesn't have it yet, but they will, enentually. Still, bashing on Acura for having only 305 HP? I'm sorry, how much HP does Lexus's *non* DI v6 have? 272? Hmm.. I'm not defending Acura, per se, because I've come to hate them lately, but give credit where credit is due. Their engines, even today, are remakable.

mmarshall

Yes and no. You would think so, but that is not always the case. Each engine, drivetrain, and computerized fuel-injection system is different, and will sometimes give different results driving them the same way. That's why I think that the official EPA numbers (which, as you note, ARE done to the same standard) are given way too much publicity. The Government even uses them now, not only for "Gas-Guzzler" taxes but even for deciding between the $3500 and $4500 Cash-for-Clunker rebate.

mmarshall

The gas-mileage problem can be overcome, to some extent, by using more gears in the transmission (or a CVT), which can give you the benefits of both short and tall gearing (and closer ratios) in the same unit. Some transmissions, though, such as the Mercedes and Lexus 7 and 8-speeds, might be bordering on overkill.

LexBob2

The non-DI 3.5L in the Lexus is rated at 19/27 mpg while the non-DI 3.7L in the RL is 16/22 mpg. No doubt a lot of the difference is due to the AWD and weight. The 3.5L has been tested at 6.2-6.4 sec 0-60. I'm not really sure about the RL.

LexFather

Facts are bashing? Don't start flames and accuse people of bashing when they r not.
No one said the engines were bad. They r solid. They r also outmuscled and offer much less efficiency than Lexus and even Infiniti.

You also r not mentioning the 306hp engine is a 3.7 liter not a 3.5 so it's bigger but offers no more power than Lexus and less than Infiniti.

Awd hurts mpg but it should not be a cop out. The GS AWD is more efficient and a full second faster 0-60.

Now that's what I call technology and "advance".

Just for comparisons sake the ***** out 5.0 liter 416hp IS-F gets the same mpg as the 300hp 3.7 RL.

That's genius.

IS-SV

As you mentioned the different tranny scenarios only partially offset the additional drag of the AWD.

The Lexus and Mercedes 6/7/8 speed trannys are both very effective, efficient and reliable, certainly the choice of demanding enthusiasts over any CVT tranny (not just for driving performance, but also for reliability reasons).

IS-SV

SOHC (even with 4 values per cyl.) has disadvantages with complexity and valvetrain weight. The main advantage is it's cheaper to produce. Mercedes and Porsche are just 2 of the major companies to change from SOHC to DOHC configs in the last few years. I won't go into the engineering and power output advantages of DOHC here, but you can Google-up the answers easily enough.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

Disadvantage in complexity and valvetrain weight? If anything, SOHC has the advantage there. Less parts and friction is an advantage to any engine.