Toyota Begins Interim Notification to Owners Regarding Future Voluntary Safety Recall
10-04-09, 08:33 PM
#182
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Surely b/c it is a "cop" the investigation had to make it seem he was a hero and there was NO WAY it could be his fault. Has anyone thought of that, or too scared to say it? How the hell does a car accelerate to 120 MPH (This is an ES, not an IS-F) and you can't figure out wtf is wrong with the gas pedal? Aren't you TRAINED in panic situations? So instead, its the car's fault. Period.
Last edited by HapaVibe; 10-04-09 at 08:50 PM.
10-05-09, 04:30 AM
#183
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I've always said the police do not comprise the best and brightest of our society. I think this is just another example, only this time he took his family and himself out instead of unrelated innocents. How can a cop with enough time to make a 911 call not figure out how to deal with a stuck accelerator? Worst case, just throw it in neutral and let the engine hit the rev limiter until you can pull over and shut it down. Darwin's theory working as it's supposed to.
Last edited by DaveGS4; 10-05-09 at 11:34 AM.
10-05-09, 05:14 AM
#184
My wife has a 2008 RAV-4 with Toyota All-Weather mats which have the hooks also - look just like my IS250 AWD mats. How come these mats are not evil too? Her car is not on the list. What is special about the mats in the vehicles listed I'm curious to know.
10-05-09, 05:22 AM
#185
Lexus Test Driver
Maybe the gas pedal is longer and closer to the floor than in the other cars and can get caught if the mat shifted.
10-05-09, 05:37 AM
#186
Lexus Champion
I've always said the police do not comprise the best and brightest of our society. I think this is just another example, only this time he took his family and himself out instead of unrelated innocents. How can a cop with enough time to make a 911 call not figure out how to deal with a stuck accelerator? Worst case, just throw it in neutral and let the engine hit the rev limiter until you can pull over and shut it down. Darwin's theory working as it's supposed to.
10-05-09, 11:23 AM
#187
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First of all, have you even considered that the officer who was driving didn't make the call? It was most likely his brother-in-law who was a passenger in the vehicle. Secondly, it's easy for us to sit here in the comfort of wherever we are to talk about it AFTER THE FACT. In a situation where you quickly realize something is life and death, you begin to panic and even those trained in emergencies might not make the most rational decisions. Not to mention they were driving in a loaner vehicle that they were probably not 100% familiar with.
Let's do some thinking out loud here. Hmm, what profession is trained to work under life and death situations and spends most of his time in a car? Jeez, I just have no idea who that could be!?
Yes throwing a car into neutral does change so very much from one car to another. Let's see, in my Lexus it's right above "D." In my BMW... What do you know, it's right above "D" again. I'm sure my Subaru is different. No that one's right above "D" too. Surely my Acura is different. No, same position. I'm sure that's just a coincidence. Four different cars, four different makes and neutral is in the same place. I'm assuming an automatic since it was a loaner. It's even more obvious with a manual. I think they should have been able to figure it out.
Last edited by DaveGS4; 10-05-09 at 11:33 AM.
10-05-09, 11:31 AM
#188
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Leescape, Hapavibe: please exit this thread and do not post in it again.
Name calling and baiting is not needed to make your point, nor is it allowed on this forum (I am removing that part of your posts). Please read the Sense of Community sticky at the top of this forum before posting here again.
Name calling and baiting is not needed to make your point, nor is it allowed on this forum (I am removing that part of your posts). Please read the Sense of Community sticky at the top of this forum before posting here again.
Last edited by DaveGS4; 10-05-09 at 11:40 AM.
10-05-09, 12:51 PM
#189
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Toyota knew about potential floor mat problems, which could cause the gas pedal in certain Toyota and Lexus automobiles to get stuck and result in a serious accident, more than two and a half years before issuing a recall last week for 3.8 million vehicles.
According to a report in the New York Times, officials at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) began investigating potential problems with Toyota and Lexus floor mats as early as March 2007, after receiving complaints from Lexus ES 350 owners that their vehicles were suddenly accelerating out of control. Although a limited recall was issue for all-weather floor mats on certain Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry vehicles, millions of other vehicles could be impacted by defectively designed floor mats and gas pedals.
Following a fatal auto accident in August 2009, where an off-duty California state trooper and three family members were killed while driving a Lexus ES 350 on loan from a local dealership, NHTSA officials met with Toyota to discuss concerns about continuing complaints of uncontrollable acceleration in Toyota and Lexus vehicles.
Last week, a Toyota and Lexus recall was issued for more than 3.8 million vehicles that may experience problems with the floor mats jamming the accelerator, including 2004-2009 Toyota Prius, 2005-2010 Toyota Avalon, 2005-2010 Toyota Tacoma, 2007-2010 Toyota Camry, 2007-2010 Toyota Tundra, 2006-2010 Lexus IS 250 and IS 350, and 2007-2010 Lexus ES 350 models.
Toyota is now telling owners to immediately remove the driver’s side floor mats until a permanent fix can be found.
NHTSA officials said last week that they needed time to develop sound science and analyze the problem before they could issue a warning. Since 2007, NHTSA researchers have been testing Toyota and Lexus vehicles for the accelerator problem at a research facility in Ohio, ruling out electromagnetic and electronic interference. The floor mat problems seem to lie solely with the thickness of the anchored floor mats.
In addition to causing uncontrolled acceleration, when the gas pedal was jammed under the mat it reduced the effectiveness of the vacuum power assisted brakes, according to researchers. The reduced effectiveness of the brakes increased stopping distance from 200 feet to more than 1,000 feet, and increased the amount of force required to fully apply the brakes from 30 pounds to 150 pounds.
NHTSA regulators also noted that drivers of Lexus vehicles were not informed in earlier manuals that the car’s keyless start button ignition system could be shut off in an emergency by holding down the start button for three seconds. It also said that warnings in the manuals about proper use of the floor mats were in small print that could easily be missed.
In the aftermath of the massive recall, Toyota president Akio Toyoda held a press conference announcing that the company would experience its second straight annual loss, and saying that the company was in trouble unless it changed how it did business.
Toyoda, grandson of the company’s founder, Kiichiro Toyoda, said the company was “grasping for salvation” after the recent recession diminished demand for new cars, and was close to “capitulation to irrelevance or death” if it did not alter its approach to business, and regain consumer confidence.
“We have to listen to our customers and make better cars,” Toyoda said during the press conference.
In addition to the recall, the company faces serious allegations that officials withheld safety studies and other evidence in Toyota rollover lawsuits in recent years. The allegations come from a former Toyota attorney, Demitrios Biller, who is suing the company for forcing him out.
Biller’s claims that Toyota hid the results of crashworthiness tests and told engineers to lie on the stand, leading to the re-opening of several product liability lawsuits against Toyota. Last week, U.S. District Judge John T. Ward issued a temporary restraining order to prevent Toyota from destroying any evidence that may be related to the cases, even those records which would be destroyed normally under generally accepted company file retention
http://www.aboutlawsuits.com/toyota-...-earlier-6268/
I am little surprised the Tundra is on the list while the Seqouia is not.
It also looks like there is a big issue with the fact that nobody knew how to turn the motors off with push button start while the cars were in motion. I can't believe they didn't put this info in the cars manual.
I hope they do figure out a fix for this. I am sure they will replace all the mats with dual hooks.
According to a report in the New York Times, officials at the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) began investigating potential problems with Toyota and Lexus floor mats as early as March 2007, after receiving complaints from Lexus ES 350 owners that their vehicles were suddenly accelerating out of control. Although a limited recall was issue for all-weather floor mats on certain Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry vehicles, millions of other vehicles could be impacted by defectively designed floor mats and gas pedals.
Following a fatal auto accident in August 2009, where an off-duty California state trooper and three family members were killed while driving a Lexus ES 350 on loan from a local dealership, NHTSA officials met with Toyota to discuss concerns about continuing complaints of uncontrollable acceleration in Toyota and Lexus vehicles.
Last week, a Toyota and Lexus recall was issued for more than 3.8 million vehicles that may experience problems with the floor mats jamming the accelerator, including 2004-2009 Toyota Prius, 2005-2010 Toyota Avalon, 2005-2010 Toyota Tacoma, 2007-2010 Toyota Camry, 2007-2010 Toyota Tundra, 2006-2010 Lexus IS 250 and IS 350, and 2007-2010 Lexus ES 350 models.
Toyota is now telling owners to immediately remove the driver’s side floor mats until a permanent fix can be found.
NHTSA officials said last week that they needed time to develop sound science and analyze the problem before they could issue a warning. Since 2007, NHTSA researchers have been testing Toyota and Lexus vehicles for the accelerator problem at a research facility in Ohio, ruling out electromagnetic and electronic interference. The floor mat problems seem to lie solely with the thickness of the anchored floor mats.
In addition to causing uncontrolled acceleration, when the gas pedal was jammed under the mat it reduced the effectiveness of the vacuum power assisted brakes, according to researchers. The reduced effectiveness of the brakes increased stopping distance from 200 feet to more than 1,000 feet, and increased the amount of force required to fully apply the brakes from 30 pounds to 150 pounds.
NHTSA regulators also noted that drivers of Lexus vehicles were not informed in earlier manuals that the car’s keyless start button ignition system could be shut off in an emergency by holding down the start button for three seconds. It also said that warnings in the manuals about proper use of the floor mats were in small print that could easily be missed.
In the aftermath of the massive recall, Toyota president Akio Toyoda held a press conference announcing that the company would experience its second straight annual loss, and saying that the company was in trouble unless it changed how it did business.
Toyoda, grandson of the company’s founder, Kiichiro Toyoda, said the company was “grasping for salvation” after the recent recession diminished demand for new cars, and was close to “capitulation to irrelevance or death” if it did not alter its approach to business, and regain consumer confidence.
“We have to listen to our customers and make better cars,” Toyoda said during the press conference.
In addition to the recall, the company faces serious allegations that officials withheld safety studies and other evidence in Toyota rollover lawsuits in recent years. The allegations come from a former Toyota attorney, Demitrios Biller, who is suing the company for forcing him out.
Biller’s claims that Toyota hid the results of crashworthiness tests and told engineers to lie on the stand, leading to the re-opening of several product liability lawsuits against Toyota. Last week, U.S. District Judge John T. Ward issued a temporary restraining order to prevent Toyota from destroying any evidence that may be related to the cases, even those records which would be destroyed normally under generally accepted company file retention
http://www.aboutlawsuits.com/toyota-...-earlier-6268/
I am little surprised the Tundra is on the list while the Seqouia is not.
It also looks like there is a big issue with the fact that nobody knew how to turn the motors off with push button start while the cars were in motion. I can't believe they didn't put this info in the cars manual.
I hope they do figure out a fix for this. I am sure they will replace all the mats with dual hooks.
10-05-09, 01:06 PM
#190
Lexus Test Driver
I agree, I didnt know how to turn off the car with the push button while in motion either until I read it in the forums. I told my wife how to do it the next day. I bet more than half of the owners out there with smart keys dont know to hold down the button to shut off while in motion. The good news is that the shut off procedure is pretty similar in most of the car brands.
10-05-09, 01:18 PM
#191
Lexus Fanatic
So what makes these mats bad?
And what mats are these?
DO NOT USE THESE MATS
SSC 70F Part Number: SSC 7LB Part Number:
PT908-32070-02 (Blk)
PT908-32070-14 (Brn)
PT908-33070-02 OR PT908-33071-02 (Blk)
PT908-33070-11 OR PT908-33071-11 (Gr)
PT908-33070-14 OR PT908-33071-14 (Brn)
And what mats are these?
DO NOT USE THESE MATS
SSC 70F Part Number: SSC 7LB Part Number:
PT908-32070-02 (Blk)
PT908-32070-14 (Brn)
PT908-33070-02 OR PT908-33071-02 (Blk)
PT908-33070-11 OR PT908-33071-11 (Gr)
PT908-33070-14 OR PT908-33071-14 (Brn)
10-06-09, 05:36 PM
#192
Lexus Fanatic
Per CR blog:
"Toyota Motor Sales, USA, along with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), has announced it will recall 55,000 All-Weather Floor Mats due to a problem with the mats potentially getting stuck under the accelerator pedal in certain cars. If not secured properly using the provided retention hooks, the heavy-duty rubber mats can slide forward causing the vehicle to accelerate uncontrollably. The recall affects driver's side floor mats that were an option on 2007 and early 2008 Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry models. (Read about the September 29, 2009, Toyota and Lexus floor mat recall.)
Toyota will notify owners by mail in early October and will begin replacing the mats in November at no charge to consumers."
"Toyota Motor Sales, USA, along with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), has announced it will recall 55,000 All-Weather Floor Mats due to a problem with the mats potentially getting stuck under the accelerator pedal in certain cars. If not secured properly using the provided retention hooks, the heavy-duty rubber mats can slide forward causing the vehicle to accelerate uncontrollably. The recall affects driver's side floor mats that were an option on 2007 and early 2008 Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry models. (Read about the September 29, 2009, Toyota and Lexus floor mat recall.)
Toyota will notify owners by mail in early October and will begin replacing the mats in November at no charge to consumers."
10-06-09, 05:42 PM
#193
Lexus Champion
Per CR blog:
"Toyota Motor Sales, USA, along with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), has announced it will recall 55,000 All-Weather Floor Mats due to a problem with the mats potentially getting stuck under the accelerator pedal in certain cars. If not secured properly using the provided retention hooks, the heavy-duty rubber mats can slide forward causing the vehicle to accelerate uncontrollably. The recall affects driver's side floor mats that were an option on 2007 and early 2008 Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry models. (Read about the September 29, 2009, Toyota and Lexus floor mat recall.)
Toyota will notify owners by mail in early October and will begin replacing the mats in November at no charge to consumers."
"Toyota Motor Sales, USA, along with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), has announced it will recall 55,000 All-Weather Floor Mats due to a problem with the mats potentially getting stuck under the accelerator pedal in certain cars. If not secured properly using the provided retention hooks, the heavy-duty rubber mats can slide forward causing the vehicle to accelerate uncontrollably. The recall affects driver's side floor mats that were an option on 2007 and early 2008 Lexus ES 350 and Toyota Camry models. (Read about the September 29, 2009, Toyota and Lexus floor mat recall.)
Toyota will notify owners by mail in early October and will begin replacing the mats in November at no charge to consumers."
10-07-09, 06:31 AM
#194
Lexus Champion
So much for the recall as a marketing ploy...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33192916..._drivers_seat/
Toyota's reputation takes a pounding
Massive recall is latest evidence that vaunted quality has slipped
By Paul A. Eisenstein
msnbc.com contributor
updated 8:15 p.m. ET, Tues., Oct . 6, 2009
Paul A. Eisenstein
It can take years to build a reputation. Now Toyota has to wonder and worry how quickly an image can be shattered.
This should have been a great year for the Japanese maker, which knocked down king-of-the-hill General Motors in late 2008 to become the world’s best-selling automaker. But Toyota hasn’t had much time to celebrate. The carmaker has been plagued by a variety of setbacks, including slumping sales, under-utilized assembly lines and multibillion-dollar losses.
But perhaps most worrisome of all are signs that the company’s vaunted quality has been slipping. Long hailed as the industry benchmark, some key Toyota products have suffered quality snags in recent years. That includes the new Tundra pickup, which Toyota had hoped would finally give it a foothold in the full-size truck market, the last segment controlled by the Big Three.
...
Toyota's reputation takes a pounding
Massive recall is latest evidence that vaunted quality has slipped
By Paul A. Eisenstein
msnbc.com contributor
updated 8:15 p.m. ET, Tues., Oct . 6, 2009
Paul A. Eisenstein
It can take years to build a reputation. Now Toyota has to wonder and worry how quickly an image can be shattered.
This should have been a great year for the Japanese maker, which knocked down king-of-the-hill General Motors in late 2008 to become the world’s best-selling automaker. But Toyota hasn’t had much time to celebrate. The carmaker has been plagued by a variety of setbacks, including slumping sales, under-utilized assembly lines and multibillion-dollar losses.
But perhaps most worrisome of all are signs that the company’s vaunted quality has been slipping. Long hailed as the industry benchmark, some key Toyota products have suffered quality snags in recent years. That includes the new Tundra pickup, which Toyota had hoped would finally give it a foothold in the full-size truck market, the last segment controlled by the Big Three.
...
10-07-09, 06:47 AM
#195
Lexus Test Driver
This problem is not so much a quality problem but a engineering oversight but I agree with the article, Toyota and Lexus quality is slipping. Its a good thing that Toyota as a company recogize that in the process of rectifying the problem. Also, there seems to be more and more of these engineering oversight from Toyota and Lexus lately. Its a sign of growing too fast and not double checking everything.