Luxury buyers switching to non-luxury brands
12-25-09, 09:08 PM
#16
I agree as well . I can afford a bit more than the 40-50k for the wifes SUV but I would rather stick with an Acura MDX or even Highlander ( if I can get a loaner) and not push it. I considered the Cayanne for a while. The wife loves it but with a baby on the way and the economy the way it is ( I am up as well) I would rather have the extra cash in the bank just in case.
12-25-09, 09:18 PM
#17
Lexus Fanatic
Well, granted, the TL has problems with ugly, awkward front and rear styling, but, aside from that, and some deterioration of interior materials/trim over the last-generation model, it's a pretty solid car, especially with the SH-AWD.
12-26-09, 05:09 PM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
Think back, for example, to the cars you and I grew up with (I bring that up not to rehash old times, but only for purposes of the thread topic). A "luxury" car like a Cadillac DeVille/Fleetwood, Lincoln Continental, Imperial, Buick Electra 225, Olds 98, Mercury Marquis, etc.....was usually longer, wider, heavier, more powerful, smoother-riding, quieter, with more trim and equipment than more mundane full-size or smaller cars. And, yes, you paid more.
Today, you still pay more, but the other differences are not that obvious anymore. Many luxury cars have been downsized to where they have more or less the same dimensions as downmarket vehicles. A Camry V6 XLE (despite its cheap dash plastic) has almost the same interior plushness as a Lexus ES350....same with the Chevy Malibu and some Cadillac models. Luxury cars, because of smaller size, lighter weight, stiffer suspensions, and lower-profile tires no longer have the same magic-carpet ride that they once had....they more or less ride and handle like regular family cars do. And their seats have about the same general level of comfort.
Of course, there are still some exceptions. No other mass-produced cars in the world can equal the Lexus LS460 and Mercedes S-Class in ride/quietness, but, for luxury cars in general, that is not necessarily the case.
Last edited by mmarshall; 12-26-09 at 05:13 PM.
12-26-09, 05:24 PM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Well, as far as the thread topic goes (and I brought this up in my first post), outside of a few cosmetic features like wood paneling, brushed-aluminum, carbon-fiber, etc..... it's getting harder and harder, IMO, in general to tell today's "luxury" vehicles from non-luxury ones.
Think back, for example, to the cars you and I grew up with (I bring that up not to rehash old times, but only for purposes of the thread topic). A "luxury" car like a Cadillac DeVille/Fleetwood, Lincoln Continental, Imperial, Buick Electra 225, Olds 98, Mercury Marquis, etc.....was usually longer, wider, heavier, more powerful, smoother-riding, quieter, with more trim and equipment than more mundane full-size or smaller cars. And, yes, you paid more.
Today, you still pay more, but the other differences are not that obvious anymore. Many luxury cars have been downsized to where they have more or less the same dimensions as downmarket vehicles. A Camry V6 XLE (despite its cheap dash plastic) has almost the same interior plushness as a Lexus ES350....same with the Chevy Malibu and some Cadillac models. Luxury cars, because of smaller size, lighter weight, stiffer suspensions, and lower-profile tires no longer have the same magic-carpet ride that they once had....they more or less ride and handle like regular family cars do. And their seats have about the same general level of comfort.
Of course, there are still some exceptions. No other mass-produced cars in the world can equal the Lexus LS460 and Mercedes S-Class in ride/quietness, but, for luxury cars in general, that is not necessarily the case.
Think back, for example, to the cars you and I grew up with (I bring that up not to rehash old times, but only for purposes of the thread topic). A "luxury" car like a Cadillac DeVille/Fleetwood, Lincoln Continental, Imperial, Buick Electra 225, Olds 98, Mercury Marquis, etc.....was usually longer, wider, heavier, more powerful, smoother-riding, quieter, with more trim and equipment than more mundane full-size or smaller cars. And, yes, you paid more.
Today, you still pay more, but the other differences are not that obvious anymore. Many luxury cars have been downsized to where they have more or less the same dimensions as downmarket vehicles. A Camry V6 XLE (despite its cheap dash plastic) has almost the same interior plushness as a Lexus ES350....same with the Chevy Malibu and some Cadillac models. Luxury cars, because of smaller size, lighter weight, stiffer suspensions, and lower-profile tires no longer have the same magic-carpet ride that they once had....they more or less ride and handle like regular family cars do. And their seats have about the same general level of comfort.
Of course, there are still some exceptions. No other mass-produced cars in the world can equal the Lexus LS460 and Mercedes S-Class in ride/quietness, but, for luxury cars in general, that is not necessarily the case.
The discussion of magic carpet and vomit-inducing rides in poor handling, poor braking, low performance geezer pleazers with 75 series tires certainly fun even if very off topic.
Last edited by IS-SV; 12-26-09 at 05:27 PM.
12-26-09, 05:39 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
The TL is suffering some in the sales department, but that is (arguably) because of the front/rear styling and the (arguably) cheaper interior trim with the redesign.
The discussion of magic carpet and vomit-inducing rides in poor handling, poor braking, low performance geezer pleazers with 75 series tires certainly fun even if very off topic.
Another reason, of course, is that people don't have as much to spend on new cars as they did just a few years ago. The only reason why as many new cars sold as they did this year is because of the Cash-for-Clunkers program, where Uncle Sam subsized up to $4500 of it. And, even wth the extra $4500, that still wasn't enough to get a lot of people into upmarket brands.
12-27-09, 10:12 AM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Back to the topic at hand, soon December 2009 will close out the year and we will have a better idea if the article has some validity (are the people leaving the luxury brands or are the luxury brands pretty much on the same sales slope as the non-lux).
12-28-09, 04:48 AM
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
BMW/Benz/Lexus completely unaffected
Everyone else fighting for the rest of the pie and now with non luxury brands with luxury cars, (Buick, Hyundai etc)
Looking at sales,its not like there has been a huge mass migration to the Genesis, Lacrosse, etc. A few examples here and there should be expected but it is not the norm.
Looking at Genesis sales, flop will be the next storyline.....the Lacrosse always sold well for Buick so its not like the new version has seen sales double or anything...
Who is getting drilled? Right now Acura. They no longer offer value, their styling is all wrong for the times and sales will likely be surpassed by Buick and Caddy next year.
Who is a big winner? Audi right now, passing Lincoln and Infiniti in sales. Mind you Audi is bling now (LEDs, R8, giant grills) which kind of goes against what the article is saying.
12-28-09, 06:42 AM
#26
Lexus Test Driver
There is really not much difference in todays entry level luxury car compare to the top of the line non-luxury cars. My next car will probably be a non-luxury brand, its just kind of silly to chase a luxury name plate and pay $20000 more for almost the same car.
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