Whats your car of the decade.
01-02-10, 06:19 PM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
The main problem with modern diesels, right now, is the expensive low-sulfur diesel fuel...in many areas higher-priced than 93-octane gas. Diesel sales probably won't really take off in the U.S. until that price comes down some. The Bluetec diesels also require periodic urea-solution refills.
01-02-10, 06:30 PM
#17
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the veyron is an automotive and engineering masterpiece. 
they set an incredibly difficult goal and met it, with MANY firsts in that car. it is stunning and even has a GREAT fancy interior!
i give a couple of runner up positions to the GT-R and R8, both incredible cars.
the RX deserves a definite mention because it CREATED AN ENTIRE AUTO SEGMENT (CUVs). i applaud they didn't succomb to adding a third row seat, they just kept making it better with more variants. the RX450h is really an amazing feat.
as for the prius, it's VERY impressive on the fuel economy front, but i'm with AMAlex, the car is just too weird for me to give it two thumbs up. i know... some people like weird or 'hey look at me' styling.
they set an incredibly difficult goal and met it, with MANY firsts in that car. it is stunning and even has a GREAT fancy interior!
i give a couple of runner up positions to the GT-R and R8, both incredible cars.
the RX deserves a definite mention because it CREATED AN ENTIRE AUTO SEGMENT (CUVs). i applaud they didn't succomb to adding a third row seat, they just kept making it better with more variants. the RX450h is really an amazing feat.
as for the prius, it's VERY impressive on the fuel economy front, but i'm with AMAlex, the car is just too weird for me to give it two thumbs up. i know... some people like weird or 'hey look at me' styling.
01-02-10, 06:57 PM
#18
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I can agree with people on the Bugatti... But not the Prius. Sure it is innovative and has some neat features, but I just hate the design of it and personally, would never own one. Not to offend anyone and to who ever has one, great, you like the car. As for me... Nope, not one bit.
While it has a great deal of technical innovation, the Veyron is virtually non-existant outside of car enthusiaist realms. We may see one a handful of times on the road, if that. I got to sit in one when it was introduced, because I knew one of the showgirls. It's great, but largely irrelevant. The Prius affected everyone and changed the automotive landscape.
01-02-10, 08:39 PM
#19
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The TDI will probably be more a car for the next decade than the last one....in the U.S., it just hasn't (yet) sold that well. Auto diesels have always gotten great fuel mileage...that's nothing new. What IS new, though, is that the TDI and Bluetec diesels can get that great mileage and (now) have low emissions, lots of low-RPM torque, and easy, docile, gas-engine starting/running characteristics.
01-02-10, 10:03 PM
#20
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Thread Starter
the veyron is an automotive and engineering masterpiece.
they set an incredibly difficult goal and met it, with MANY firsts in that car. it is stunning and even has a GREAT fancy interior!
i give a couple of runner up positions to the GT-R and R8, both incredible cars.
the RX deserves a definite mention because it CREATED AN ENTIRE AUTO SEGMENT (CUVs). i applaud they didn't succomb to adding a third row seat, they just kept making it better with more variants. the RX450h is really an amazing feat.
as for the prius, it's VERY impressive on the fuel economy front, but i'm with AMAlex, the car is just too weird for me to give it two thumbs up. i know... some people like weird or 'hey look at me' styling.
they set an incredibly difficult goal and met it, with MANY firsts in that car. it is stunning and even has a GREAT fancy interior!
i give a couple of runner up positions to the GT-R and R8, both incredible cars.
the RX deserves a definite mention because it CREATED AN ENTIRE AUTO SEGMENT (CUVs). i applaud they didn't succomb to adding a third row seat, they just kept making it better with more variants. the RX450h is really an amazing feat.
as for the prius, it's VERY impressive on the fuel economy front, but i'm with AMAlex, the car is just too weird for me to give it two thumbs up. i know... some people like weird or 'hey look at me' styling.
I respect the Prius but I am surprised the Veyron is not getting more love. I am not sure if people really understand the production and engineering difficulties met when creating a car like the Veyron. There has never been anything created like this thing before. It uses the same launch control system an F1 car for gods sake.
With 1001 horsepower, the Veyron is a major technical achievement. Its engine has 16 cylinders, essentially formed by joining two V8 engines at the crank.
This W16 powerplant displaces 8.0 liters and features ten radiators for everything from the engine cooling systems to the air conditioner.
The $1.3 million Veyron will reach a top speed of 253 mph - a speed it can maintain for 12 minutes before all the fuel is gone. Power is transmitted to the pavement via four-wheel-drive and a seven-speed dual-clutch automated manual transmission.
The car can hit 60 mph in just 2.5 seconds, 100 mph in 5.5 seconds, and 150 mph in 9.8 seconds. Getting to 200 mph takes 18.3 seconds, and 250 mph takes 42.3 seconds.
A special key is required to "unlock" the Veyron's top speed of 250+ mph. The car is then lowered to just 3.5 inches from the ground. A hydraulic spoiler extends at speed, and it can also serve as an air brake.
The Veyron weighs a hulking 4,160 lbs, but even its harshest critics admit its handling is surprisingly sharp. Gordon Murray, designer of the McLaren F1 was very skeptical of the Veyron during its development, but after driving the finished car, he conceded it is a "huge achievement."
Top Gear's Jeremy Clarkson also publicly stated the Veyron was ridiculous and would never be built, only to call it "best car ever made" after he drove it. He famously characterized it as "utterly, stunningly, mind blowingly, jaw droppingly brilliant."
The Prius makes power in a unique and advanced means. The bugatti does more than that in a unique and advanced way
watch this video on Bugatti Veyron production
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz59q42sIJQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk1t6S737Cs Top Gear top speed run
"The road to excess leads to the palace of wisdom" William Blake
Last edited by I8ABMR; 01-02-10 at 10:14 PM.
01-02-10, 10:17 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
What car can make an Enzo Ferrari look like its for little girls. It even makes the motors in other super cars seem pathetic and dated in the means they produce power
The Bugatti is so radical and advanced that nobody will ever make a car like that again. NOBODY. They are copying the Prius right now everywhere. Toyota is ahead but the others are all chasing. The Bugatti Veyron stretched the limits of engineering. They met with way more issues in development than I would assume they did when developing the prius. electric motors have been around for 100 years. W16 quad turbos mated to chassis that can achieve 253 mph.... not quite that long
Last edited by I8ABMR; 01-02-10 at 10:20 PM.
01-02-10, 11:30 PM
#23
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Not only was it STUNNING when it first came out, it still looks amazing. I love the look of this car, its speed [m3], and everything about the car.
I think this is the car of the decade for me.. I mean sure, Bugatti is amazing, but you rarely\never see those. Prius was a huge breakthrough in helping with the environment too and it is on my top 10 cars of the decade.
Last edited by Amini9; 01-02-10 at 11:38 PM.
01-03-10, 12:47 AM
#25
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I respect the Prius but I am surprised the Veyron is not getting more love. I am not sure if people really understand the production and engineering difficulties met when creating a car like the Veyron. There has never been anything created like this thing before. It uses the same launch control system an F1 car for gods sake.
So in an average month, how many Veyrons have you seen on the road? How many Prius?
In the greater scheme of things, the Veyron is nothing more than an automotive footnote. Same as the F40, the Enzo, the Carrera GT, 959, McClaren F1, etc. The Prius is a game changer.
01-03-10, 01:13 AM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Great. So I built a 3000 hp rocket car that goes 0-60 in 2 seconds and costs 5 million each. So what? Is any of that tech ever going to go mainstream? No. Are you ever going to see it outside of magazines and behind ropes at car shows? Nope.
So in an average month, how many Veyrons have you seen on the road? How many Prius?
In the greater scheme of things, the Veyron is nothing more than an automotive footnote. Same as the F40, the Enzo, the Carrera GT, 959, McClaren F1, etc. The Prius is a game changer.
So in an average month, how many Veyrons have you seen on the road? How many Prius?
In the greater scheme of things, the Veyron is nothing more than an automotive footnote. Same as the F40, the Enzo, the Carrera GT, 959, McClaren F1, etc. The Prius is a game changer.
To each his own.
The veyron stretched what was physically possible for a production car. The Prius is awesome. Its still my 2nd place ( even though we are only to chose one).
We are not talking sales numbers here. We are talking technology and engineering. Aesthetics as well. The Prius still loses in all categories imho. The VW/ Bugatti engineers did what was thought impossible. They built a "rocket" that seats 2 in comfort and style and is faster than any production car on earth . Oh yeah its reliable and driveable by your mom, sister, or grandmother. A 3000 hp rocket for 5 million is not. We know that because they went to the max with the Veyron.
The Veyron is the ultimate game changer in the realm of super cars. The Prius is a game changer on all other level but still doesn't represent as far of an advancement in automotive design, aerodynamics, and chassis development. They spent as much time designing the Veyron as they did designing the first 2 generations of the Prius combined. Bottom line is that imo the prius is not as unique or as special as the Veyron . Every car company has a Prius fighter in its design line up for the future . Nobody will ever make a car to compete with the Veyron. ( thats why the charge 1.7 million for it not 24k. ) The prius represents a turning point or new start in automotive history. The Bugatti represents the end of an era . Both are monumental
To each his own, but my car of the decade is the Bugatti Veyron
ps I knew this was going to get a good discussion started
Last edited by I8ABMR; 01-03-10 at 01:36 AM.
01-03-10, 01:28 AM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
here is the technical and performance info that impresses me :
Specifications
the W16 engine
A cutout of the W16 and quad turbochargers illustration released by Bugatti
The Veyron features a W16 engine—16 cylinders in 4 banks of 4 cylinders, or the equivalent of two narrow-angle V8 engines mated in a vee configuration. Each cylinder has 4 valves, for a total of 64, but the narrow V8 configuration allows two camshafts to drive two banks of cylinders so only 4 camshafts are needed. The engine is fed by four turbochargers, and it displaces 8.0 L (7,993 cc/488 in³) with a square 86 by 86 mm bore and stroke.
Putting this power to the ground is a dual-clutch DSG computer-controlled manual transmission with 7 gear ratios via shifter paddles behind the steering wheel boasting an 8 ms shift time. The Veyron can be driven by full automatic transmission. The Veyron also features full-time all-wheel drive developed by UK based Ricardo helping to transfer power to the road. It uses special Michelin run-flat tires designed specifically for the Veyron to accommodate the vehicle's top speed.
The car's wheelbase is 2710 mm (106.3 in). Overall length is 4462 mm (175.8 in). It measures 1998 mm (78.7 in) wide and 1206 mm (47.5 in) tall.
Kerb weight is estimated at 4,160 lb (1890 kg). This gives the car a power to weight ratio of 529 bhp/tonne.
The Bugatti Veyron has a total of 10 radiators[1].
3 radiators for the engine cooling system.
1 heat exchanger for the air to liquid intercoolers.
2 for the air conditioning system.
1 transmission oil radiator.
1 differential oil radiator.
1 engine oil radiator.
1 hydraulic oil radiator for the spoiler.
Performance
The key
According to Volkswagen, the final production Veyron engine produces between 1020 and 1040 metric hp (1006 to 1026 SAE net hp), so the car will be advertised as producing "1001 horsepower" in both the US and European markets. This makes it the most powerful production road-car engine in history. Peak torque is 1250 N·m (922 ft·lbf).
Top speed was initially promised to be 252 mph (406 km/h), but test versions were unstable at that speed, forcing a redesign of the aerodynamics. In May 2005, a prototype Veyron tested at a Volkswagen track near Wolfsburg, Germany, and recorded an electronically limited top speed of 400 km/h (249 mph). In October, 2005, Car and Driver magazine's editor Csaba Csere test drove the final production version of the Veyron for the November 2005 issue. This test, at Volkswagen's Ehra-Lessien test track, reached a top speed of 253.2 mph (407.5 km/h).
The Veyron is the quickest production car to reach 100 km/h (62 mph) with an estimated time of 2.5 seconds. It also reaches 200 and 300 km/h (124 and 186 mph) in 7.3 and 16.7 seconds respectively. This makes the Veyron the quickest-accelerating production car in history. It also consumes more fuel than any other production car, using 40.4 L/100 km (4.82 mpg) in city driving and 24.1 L/100 km (10 mpg) in combined cycle. At full-throttle, it uses more than 125 L/100 km (2.1 mpg)—at full throttle, the Veyron would empty its 100 L fuel tank in just 12.5 minutes. The car's everyday top speed is listed at 234 mph (377 km/h). When the car reaches 137 mph (220 km/h), hydraulics lower the car until it has a ground clearance of about 3 1/2 inches (8.9 cm). At the same time, the wing and spoiler deploy. This is the "handling" mode, in which the wing helps provide 770 pounds (3425 newtons) of downforce, holding the car to the road[1]. The driver must, using the key, toggle the lock to the left of his seat in order to use the maximum speed of 253.2 miles per hour (407.5 km/h). Theoretically it can go faster but it is electronically limited to 253.2 miles per hour (407.5 km/h) to prevent tire damage. The key functions only when the vehicle is at a stop when a checklist then establishes whether the car—and its driver—are ready to enable 'top speed' mode. If all systems are go, the rear spoiler retracts, the front air diffusers close and the ground clearance, normally 4.9 inches (12.4 cm), drops to 2.6 inches (6.6 cm).
The Veyrons' brakes utilize unique cross-drilled and turbine vented carbon rotors, which draw in cooling air to reduce fade. Each caliper has eight[1] titanium pistons. Bugatti claims maximum deceleration of 1.3 g on road tires. Prototypes have been subjected to repeated 1.0 g braking from 194 to 50 mph (312 to 80 km/h) without fade. With the car's fearsome acceleration from 50 to 194 mph (80 to 312 km/h), that test can be performed every 22 seconds. At speeds above 124 mph (200 km/h), the rear wing also acts as an airbrake, snapping to a 70-degree angle in 0.4 seconds once brakes are applied, providing 0.5 g (6 m/s²) of deceleration[1]. Bugatti claims the Veyron will brake from 252 mph (406 km/h) to a standstill in less than 10 seconds[1]. The braking is also so evenly applied that the car will not deviate from a straight path if the driver lets go of the steering wheel, even with the brakes fully applied starting from close to top speed. [13]
watch these videos for reminders of the engineering marvels that will blow your mind about the Veyron. I feel that because the Veyron is so rare people dont know enough about how it works and only about its speed and power. People should think about the physics involved. Everything from aerodynamics to heat exchange was pushed in the development
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz59q42sIJQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk1t6S737Cs
Specifications
the W16 engine
A cutout of the W16 and quad turbochargers illustration released by Bugatti
The Veyron features a W16 engine—16 cylinders in 4 banks of 4 cylinders, or the equivalent of two narrow-angle V8 engines mated in a vee configuration. Each cylinder has 4 valves, for a total of 64, but the narrow V8 configuration allows two camshafts to drive two banks of cylinders so only 4 camshafts are needed. The engine is fed by four turbochargers, and it displaces 8.0 L (7,993 cc/488 in³) with a square 86 by 86 mm bore and stroke.
Putting this power to the ground is a dual-clutch DSG computer-controlled manual transmission with 7 gear ratios via shifter paddles behind the steering wheel boasting an 8 ms shift time. The Veyron can be driven by full automatic transmission. The Veyron also features full-time all-wheel drive developed by UK based Ricardo helping to transfer power to the road. It uses special Michelin run-flat tires designed specifically for the Veyron to accommodate the vehicle's top speed.
The car's wheelbase is 2710 mm (106.3 in). Overall length is 4462 mm (175.8 in). It measures 1998 mm (78.7 in) wide and 1206 mm (47.5 in) tall.
Kerb weight is estimated at 4,160 lb (1890 kg). This gives the car a power to weight ratio of 529 bhp/tonne.
The Bugatti Veyron has a total of 10 radiators[1].
3 radiators for the engine cooling system.
1 heat exchanger for the air to liquid intercoolers.
2 for the air conditioning system.
1 transmission oil radiator.
1 differential oil radiator.
1 engine oil radiator.
1 hydraulic oil radiator for the spoiler.
Performance
The key
According to Volkswagen, the final production Veyron engine produces between 1020 and 1040 metric hp (1006 to 1026 SAE net hp), so the car will be advertised as producing "1001 horsepower" in both the US and European markets. This makes it the most powerful production road-car engine in history. Peak torque is 1250 N·m (922 ft·lbf).
Top speed was initially promised to be 252 mph (406 km/h), but test versions were unstable at that speed, forcing a redesign of the aerodynamics. In May 2005, a prototype Veyron tested at a Volkswagen track near Wolfsburg, Germany, and recorded an electronically limited top speed of 400 km/h (249 mph). In October, 2005, Car and Driver magazine's editor Csaba Csere test drove the final production version of the Veyron for the November 2005 issue. This test, at Volkswagen's Ehra-Lessien test track, reached a top speed of 253.2 mph (407.5 km/h).
The Veyron is the quickest production car to reach 100 km/h (62 mph) with an estimated time of 2.5 seconds. It also reaches 200 and 300 km/h (124 and 186 mph) in 7.3 and 16.7 seconds respectively. This makes the Veyron the quickest-accelerating production car in history. It also consumes more fuel than any other production car, using 40.4 L/100 km (4.82 mpg) in city driving and 24.1 L/100 km (10 mpg) in combined cycle. At full-throttle, it uses more than 125 L/100 km (2.1 mpg)—at full throttle, the Veyron would empty its 100 L fuel tank in just 12.5 minutes. The car's everyday top speed is listed at 234 mph (377 km/h). When the car reaches 137 mph (220 km/h), hydraulics lower the car until it has a ground clearance of about 3 1/2 inches (8.9 cm). At the same time, the wing and spoiler deploy. This is the "handling" mode, in which the wing helps provide 770 pounds (3425 newtons) of downforce, holding the car to the road[1]. The driver must, using the key, toggle the lock to the left of his seat in order to use the maximum speed of 253.2 miles per hour (407.5 km/h). Theoretically it can go faster but it is electronically limited to 253.2 miles per hour (407.5 km/h) to prevent tire damage. The key functions only when the vehicle is at a stop when a checklist then establishes whether the car—and its driver—are ready to enable 'top speed' mode. If all systems are go, the rear spoiler retracts, the front air diffusers close and the ground clearance, normally 4.9 inches (12.4 cm), drops to 2.6 inches (6.6 cm).
The Veyrons' brakes utilize unique cross-drilled and turbine vented carbon rotors, which draw in cooling air to reduce fade. Each caliper has eight[1] titanium pistons. Bugatti claims maximum deceleration of 1.3 g on road tires. Prototypes have been subjected to repeated 1.0 g braking from 194 to 50 mph (312 to 80 km/h) without fade. With the car's fearsome acceleration from 50 to 194 mph (80 to 312 km/h), that test can be performed every 22 seconds. At speeds above 124 mph (200 km/h), the rear wing also acts as an airbrake, snapping to a 70-degree angle in 0.4 seconds once brakes are applied, providing 0.5 g (6 m/s²) of deceleration[1]. Bugatti claims the Veyron will brake from 252 mph (406 km/h) to a standstill in less than 10 seconds[1]. The braking is also so evenly applied that the car will not deviate from a straight path if the driver lets go of the steering wheel, even with the brakes fully applied starting from close to top speed. [13]
watch these videos for reminders of the engineering marvels that will blow your mind about the Veyron. I feel that because the Veyron is so rare people dont know enough about how it works and only about its speed and power. People should think about the physics involved. Everything from aerodynamics to heat exchange was pushed in the development
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz59q42sIJQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jk1t6S737Cs
Last edited by I8ABMR; 01-03-10 at 01:31 AM.
01-03-10, 12:20 PM
#30
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
whats up mike??? I am just explaining. (Again). Let me make this clear. I dont care what people think I am just providing info rather than just opinion ( unlike others). I dont understand why you get upset when I back up my points when they dont line up with yours and the rest of the group, or just to provide more technical info than most. we have the right to not agree with the rest of the forum. I even stated " this is the technical and performance info that impresses me". I am an enthusiast and easily one of the most active members on this forum so excuse me if I get a little zealous and provide a lot of info.
PS notice how many times I posted "to each his own" . Also when I get a response like the one that madoka gave I am going to back it up with facts... just like you do when someone responds to your posts in the same manner
PS how was Och Rios ??? I have been there and Negril and loved it. " much respect man "
PS notice how many times I posted "to each his own" . Also when I get a response like the one that madoka gave I am going to back it up with facts... just like you do when someone responds to your posts in the same manner
PS how was Och Rios ??? I have been there and Negril and loved it. " much respect man "
Last edited by I8ABMR; 01-03-10 at 08:49 PM.