Toyota freezes all sales of 8 models, leaving all dealerships dead in the water
01-28-10, 07:55 PM
#183
Driver
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Texas
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Wow, sucks for Toyota. People buy them for reliability and quality - this really hurts the image they have.
01-28-10, 07:55 PM
#184
Lexus Test Driver
No one points this out or notices this, but in the history of time, every single car that has ever been produced has had some known and/or common defect across the board. Every enthusiast, follower, and car nut has been through this where they discuss how the previous model was built better, just like we are doing now. Then the next great model comes out, suddenly it's better in the beginning, and two years later a crop of problems pop up and everyone starts saying how the last model was built better. Repeat, repeat. You have to live long enough and know history to know what I am talking about. It's a trap we all fall for. In my opinion, today's Toyota and Lexi are just as reliable as the ones built ten years ago. It's just that these particular defects we are facing today can lead to death and horror so it's going to sound worse than all the past defects.
01-28-10, 08:01 PM
#185
Lexus Fanatic
Toyota itself, though, has a big army of corporate lawyers of its own....perhaps more than any other auto manufacturer. It could turn out to be the clash of the Titans.....two large opposing armies.
01-28-10, 08:20 PM
#186
Lead Lap
Join Date: Jun 2006
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01-28-10, 08:46 PM
#187
Pole Position
Anyway, it was a ghost town. Very strange to see. Never seen the place so desolate, so different from the humming madhouse it usually is.
I took a stroll thru the main sales floor. Salesmen literally sitting in their cubicles staring at the ceiling. Hope they can start selling quick.
01-29-10, 03:48 AM
#190
every news channel i watched talked about toyota and it's massive recalls. the media is abusing toyota right now.
my prediction is that toyota will no longer be #1 seller in america this year. i think both chevy and ford will outsell toyota. most likely, accord and civic will outsell camry and corolla. and the biggest threat of toyota, Hyundai will have another tremendous year because of all new sonata, elantra, and tucson.
my prediction is that toyota will no longer be #1 seller in america this year. i think both chevy and ford will outsell toyota. most likely, accord and civic will outsell camry and corolla. and the biggest threat of toyota, Hyundai will have another tremendous year because of all new sonata, elantra, and tucson.
01-29-10, 03:49 AM
#191
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/28/d...-back-in-2004/
From the "This story just keeps getting uglier" department comes a new bit of information concerning Toyota and its growing sticky pedal problem. The Detroit Free Press is reporting that Toyota and the National Highway Safety Traffic Administration were looking into the problem back in 2004, but an interesting twist led the investigation down a path that ultimately turned up nothing.
The Freep says that this early investigation was strictly limited to incidents of unintended acceleration lasting one second or less, which strikes us as odd considering prolonged periods unintended acceleration are a lot more dangerous than a blip of the throttle. And this is where the story gets a bit tricky. The Freep reports that a 2008 lawsuit stemming from an alleged unintended acceleration-related death of a woman driving a 2005 Camry says that the decision was made to limit the investigation right after a former NHTSA employee, Christopher Santucci, took a job with Toyota.
The lawsuit alleges that the new Toyota employee negotiated a deal with his former coworkers at NHTSA to limit the investigation of unintended acceleration claims to instances of one second or less. Santucci said in a deposition that the NHTSA investigation involved 2002 and 2003 Toyota Camry, Solaras and Lexus ES300 models. NHTSA had reportedly received 139 complaints in the 2004 investigation, but found no defects.
Now that Toyota has officially recalled millions of vehicles, the question remains whether these older models will eventually be recalled as well. The short answer is that we have no idea, but former NHTSA head Joan Claybrook feels that the government safety agency should have taken unintended acceleration claims more seriously in the past.
From the "This story just keeps getting uglier" department comes a new bit of information concerning Toyota and its growing sticky pedal problem. The Detroit Free Press is reporting that Toyota and the National Highway Safety Traffic Administration were looking into the problem back in 2004, but an interesting twist led the investigation down a path that ultimately turned up nothing.
The Freep says that this early investigation was strictly limited to incidents of unintended acceleration lasting one second or less, which strikes us as odd considering prolonged periods unintended acceleration are a lot more dangerous than a blip of the throttle. And this is where the story gets a bit tricky. The Freep reports that a 2008 lawsuit stemming from an alleged unintended acceleration-related death of a woman driving a 2005 Camry says that the decision was made to limit the investigation right after a former NHTSA employee, Christopher Santucci, took a job with Toyota.
The lawsuit alleges that the new Toyota employee negotiated a deal with his former coworkers at NHTSA to limit the investigation of unintended acceleration claims to instances of one second or less. Santucci said in a deposition that the NHTSA investigation involved 2002 and 2003 Toyota Camry, Solaras and Lexus ES300 models. NHTSA had reportedly received 139 complaints in the 2004 investigation, but found no defects.
Now that Toyota has officially recalled millions of vehicles, the question remains whether these older models will eventually be recalled as well. The short answer is that we have no idea, but former NHTSA head Joan Claybrook feels that the government safety agency should have taken unintended acceleration claims more seriously in the past.
01-29-10, 04:00 AM
#192
I am well aware of the issues on older Toyota engines like the MZ and ZZ. With their new engine designs Toyota has improved reliability and defects, but problems still remain.
The oil hose VVT-i problems on the GR engines are becoming more common. Internally in the company, Toyota is not satisfied with the reliability of the oil-driven VVT-i system. That is why Toyota is moving eventually to completely electric valve timing and lift. Toyota already has electric valve lift with Valvematic, and they have electric VVT-i on the intake side with VVT-iE in some of the Lexus engines.
When Toyota combines Dual VVT-iE with Valvematic, many of the remaining engine problems should dissapear. Toyota must focus right now their resources on making sure Valvematic and Dual VVT-iE are very reliable.
Did you read the big long article I posted? It clearly shows some of the decisions Toyota took 6-7 years ago that are now backfiring on them.
The decisions I am talking about include accelerating the release of new models, basically rushing out new models too quickly, and relying too much on computer simulation. These decisions are separate from the engine issues from the 90s. These decisions were first made 6-7 years ago.
Only 2-3 years ago did Toyota realize the quality problems that were happening from quick model releases and heavy reliance on computer simulations. That is why all future Toyota model releases take a bit longer, and they are back to relying on lots and lots of physical prototypes for testing.
The oil hose VVT-i problems on the GR engines are becoming more common. Internally in the company, Toyota is not satisfied with the reliability of the oil-driven VVT-i system. That is why Toyota is moving eventually to completely electric valve timing and lift. Toyota already has electric valve lift with Valvematic, and they have electric VVT-i on the intake side with VVT-iE in some of the Lexus engines.
When Toyota combines Dual VVT-iE with Valvematic, many of the remaining engine problems should dissapear. Toyota must focus right now their resources on making sure Valvematic and Dual VVT-iE are very reliable.
Did you read the big long article I posted? It clearly shows some of the decisions Toyota took 6-7 years ago that are now backfiring on them.
The decisions I am talking about include accelerating the release of new models, basically rushing out new models too quickly, and relying too much on computer simulation. These decisions are separate from the engine issues from the 90s. These decisions were first made 6-7 years ago.
Only 2-3 years ago did Toyota realize the quality problems that were happening from quick model releases and heavy reliance on computer simulations. That is why all future Toyota model releases take a bit longer, and they are back to relying on lots and lots of physical prototypes for testing.
Valvematic is a lot more complicated than VVTi. Not sure why you think it is going to be more reliable. Nevertheless, there are no known issues with Valvematic and Toyota started sales of Valvematic in Japan 2 years before introducing them in Europe. Thats Watanabe's work too.
And currently there is no single Toyota/Lexus engine with major issues unlike for the past decade. Keep in mind that at its worst, Toyota had 1 billion less warranty costs than Ford and 2 Billion less than GM ;-). And even with MZ, ZZ and AD series engines being problematic at one point of their history, Toyota has remained at the top or near the top of all reliability surveys made accross the world (which shows a lot more about other companies).
01-29-10, 04:15 AM
#194
lawyers will have better luck with mats, as they are much harder to prove after the accident. They could return to their place or anything due to the accident. On the other hand, worn assembly will not become un-worn because of the accident.
01-29-10, 04:18 AM
#195
well another local article now claims that Prius and Lexus owners will be called to checkup their cars due to the issues....
.... I wonder how did they write that article - did they pick up only cars not affected by the recall? lol... feel bad for dealers in the usa.
.... I wonder how did they write that article - did they pick up only cars not affected by the recall? lol... feel bad for dealers in the usa.