teeteetee

Just got the March issue of C&D in the mail. The editor, Eddie Alterman, has a few choice words for Lexus:
And something specific for the IS F as well:
Ouch...

G Star

iTrader: (2)

I'm afraid the person who wrote that hasn't a clue about brand marketing and market share. Seriously...sounds like somebody has it out for Lexus' success. Honestly I can see where this type of thought would come from but you can say the same about so many other cars and brands in the industry. If you have to say something, say it about everyone or unveil your bias.

And no dynamic cohesion? does he mean BMW's kidney grills? or Benz' hood ornaments? who are we kidding here? I would really like to see this dude define dynamic cohesion because any company can have too much, too little, or none at all, everybody has a different view.

Who wrote it? was it part of the magazine editorial or a fan letter? If somebody from C&D actually wrote it, what a sorry bozo...

RXSF

garbage....

when lexus makes boring cars, everyone complains. when they make boring cars and F cars, they say this?

marshmallo

What's really killing Car and Driver is the lack of a brain.

It may look like a decent magazine, but not quite.

It's two or three grades below toilet paper...

superchan7

Um...the cars are in high demand, and they're not badge clones. What else can be said?

encore888

At first blush, this is from the school of enthusiasts that scoffed at the IS-F when it was announced, insisting that all Lexus can do is make quiet, comfortable, soft-riding luxo-barges.

...and at the same time, C&D then attacks Lexus models as being 'geriatric', use incorrect numbers to inflate buyers' average age, says "we prefer BMW and Infiniti", etc.

...also can anyone remember their 'mistake' in calculating points that relegated the IS to #2 in its debut comparo, or them putting the LS down because of its 'emphasis on quiet and comfort', or being 'shocked' that a hybrid Lexus would cost more than a regular one? Or the insistence that the HS is a rebadged Prius?

...and to the substance of that 'conviction' -- trotting out the 'ol copy/mimic bit, tell that to Jaguar XF, or the BMW 7-series, there's plenty of copying to go around.

...if Mercedes-Benz can field AMG models and luxury cars without "confusing the brand's message and scattering its resources", I'm willing to give Lexus the benefit of the doubt that they can as well.

C&D my foot. After all the experienced old-timers left and the upstart hacks came in, they have taken their driver-emphasis, which was fine, but turned it into a BMW/Honda love fest, and other brands are not given a fair shake.

flipside909

C&D is a fine publication, but they've always been anti-Toyota and it shows in their reviews. Look at the top 10 they select every year. The same cars are there year after year...even when we know there are better choices out there. Bias is key.

LexFather

I've said that over and over.

Yall know my disdain for C&D and I gladly get it for free. Makes great toilet paper for goats.

Eddie Alterman was the editor for the online site "Motive" and went to C&D b/c they are in desperate need of "change" and we see how well that is working.

(goes to check mail from the last 2 days..oh snap C&D is here in the trash stash, reads article.....)

Eddie Alterman has done nothing to get me to buy the magazine. What I do see is the same **** poor writing, rants, conclusions but a cuter chart here and there and pictures actually focused. His editorial is not on the site but trust me, for some odd reason, CAR AND DRIVER supposedly a magazine that puts sport over everything else is upset b/c Lexus has an IS-F and LFA.


Eddie if you are reading this.

Eddie you are a sad enthusiast. You do realize, BMW, Benz, Audi can also be accused of "confusing" lineups, more so than Lexus. Since you only care to rant on Lexus and didn't bother to look outside our coastline, lets review-

Audi has/had A2/A3 all the way to the R8/R10. I don't see you are anyone complaining about them. They have 100hp diesels and 450hp S6 cars. They had a RS4 sitting right along a FWD 1.4 liter A4. Did you complain about it? It is called catering to the market. Audi will have hybrids soon. Is that confusing? Is a 120hp A3 convertible next to a 500hp R8 confusing?

BMW has the 1 series 3 door hatch, tiny diesels and is the "sportiest" luxury brand. Look Eddie, slapping grills on cars and adding a Hoffmeister kink does not mean "continuity" it can also be interpreted as pretty boring. Then this "sportiest" brand has nothing to fight the R8/R10 let alone the LFA. Shouldn't you be bishing and crying about that? How can Lexus have an exotic before BMW?

Benz has everything from the A, B class to C-class hatchback to an entire AMG lineup, to the new SLS. Is there confusion? Are you bishing that Benz sells cute 80hp cars but also sells 600hp monsters? They now offer hybrids too. Are you confused?

What kind of ENTHUSIAST complains about a 416hp V-8, brembo brake, BBS wheel, 5.0 liter, sport sedan? Then I ask you what ENTHUSIAST complains about a 552hp, V-10, brembo brake, BBS wheel, exotic? What kind of person COMPLAINS about that? Every year, C&D complains Lexus needs more sport. It is finally truly provided and in the LFA, in a way only exotic brands can meet/beat. You complain?


I ask again? What kind of enthusiast, let alone an editor of the supposed magazine where "DRIVING" matters, complains about SPORTY DRIVING cars?

FYI, Lexus went after BMW with the GS 400. Since you just hate Lexus, you didn't even bother to look at your own magazines review. Do you know what it said? I remember because that is when I used to PAY for C&D and it was well worth it. Here is what the magazine that pays your salary said;

"Lexus goes BMW hunting"

This was in 1997, Car and Driver's own words. Long before the IS you said is the first Lexus that went after BMW. There is no review online but wow, here is the GS 400 a 10 best winner in 1998 for being sporty. Did it create confusion then? Nope, until 2005 it was the best selling GS EVER.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...0_2f400_page_9

This no reading thing with you continues..... The LFA is not just in existence b/c of the 599GTB. Actually Lexus mentioned the 430 ....but you don't read. It exists b/c the future is lightweight materials and they invested tens of millions in carbon fiber construction in hopes to trickle it down to other vehicles. Many experts feel whomever masters carbon fiber first and makes it cheap, will win. Did you even read your own employee's Mark Giles review? He gave it very favorable remarks.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t_drive_review

Your diss against the LFA's styling is your silly opinion. For some reason, you seriously dislike a new exotic. Hey bud, we live in a world where seemingly a car company dies every year and regulations are getting tighter and tighter against exotics. So Lexus adds to the field in a dying market and you don't like it? I don't recall one exotic I don't like or could dismiss. Maybe I'm too much of an enthusiast.

You say the BMW X6 has some "2002" magic in it? Did you SERIOUSLY write that?

You recommend Lexus sell more RX type vehicles. Why, so you can bash them? Running out of Lexus to bash since they are making interesting cars?

Let me explain something Eddie. Lexus owners DO NOT NEED all their Lexus vehicles to look the same. They don't need them to all drive the same. They don't WANT them too. The numbers cannot lie, in 10 years, post dot com boom, during the housing boom and in the recession, Lexus is #1 in America. Instead of having their LX 570, LS 460 and then jump to another brand for a sporty sedan they can stay with Lexus. That is called brilliant expansion of your lineup .

Sounds like butthurt. Funny but Lexus has sold well without HAVING to rely on sameness. What did the Germans do? Ditch sameness for differentiation among their vehicles.

You ask what does Lexus stand for. It is simple.

EXCELLENCE.

From boring RXs, to hybrids, to sporty vehicles to the LFA.

I recommend resigning and being the editor for "Woman's World" if your dumbass is going to rant about sports cars in a magazine about sports cars.

Eddie, get past the badge. It is clear your rant is just that, a rant.

gshb

given the kind of reputation lexus has earned since inception, i always wondered why they dont attack the likes of bentley and rolls royce. something the likes of a range rover or continental, real boulevard cruisers with the subtle yet unyielding power to move you and the earth underneath all the while covering your ears in a wall of silence. it would fit the image better than what the f cars are trying to change. i guess what im saying is i wish there were a lexus equivalent to a continental gt speed heh.

projectdna

iTrader: (56)

if a car isn't wearing a bavarian badge or the three-tipped star, most of their reviews will start off with something like, "it's good, but..."

G Star

iTrader: (2)

For your fantasy to come true, Toyota would need to create another higher echelon brand than Lexus. One that can cater to the most discerning clientele for some badarse luxury vehicles. I agree they should do this but I don't think right now is the right time for Toyota to be concentrating on the execution of a new ultra luxury marque, especially when they have this big recall mess on their shoulders. I'm sure there are proposals and plans for this but they're waiting for the right time.

bnizzle87

what bothers me is that this is suppose to be a reputable car magazine. Car and Driver is not suppose to be biased, rather it should take on what magazines like import tuner and PAS do. they COMPARE without bias (for the most part) and give accurate descriptions of each product. for C&D to say the IS F exists because of the M3 or C63 AMG is preposterous. didnt the C63 and IS F come out around the same time, yet it will not say the C63 exists because of the M3. No car exists because of another one. it is as simple as competition can be. if one producer can make a vehicle for a certain segment, than why cant we? so lexus did, and they made one hell of a great start with the IS F. with the F performance and the buzz around it with the LFA and LF-Ch, Lexus has that "intangible" that the biased arrogant minds of C&D speak of. sure, it doesnt have the heritage of the M or AMG, but its fresh. its only in year two of competition. M and AMG have been around for decades, and i mite add...YAWN! they're overdone! this might be a lexus forum, and i know it might seem biased on my part, but i honestly believe, as a proponent of all things luxury and performance, Lexus has the capabilities and is laying a solid foundation to continue with the success of its F line to counteract the M and AMG.

whoever writes these articles from C&D must obviously be driving bimmers or mb's, and given the spare time they have while their cars have broken down on the side of the road, i would think they'd be able to write something with more construction instead of misrepresentation for simply having a brand perception in their feeble little minds.

much props to those who can tell the true difference between fiction and reality! im surprised this magazine still exists on newsstands' shelves.

spwolf

"... but it is missing something intanglible"

;-)

LexBob2

I like to read Eddie Alterman's page in C&D. Don't always agree with his views, but I like his writing style and humor.

geko29

Exactly. Even Mercedes (which I think most would agree has a little more name cache as a luxury brand than Lexus) couldn't play in that field with their existing brand. They had to invent the Maybach brand to get into the game and have any hope at success.