The perfect Lexus line-up?
02-03-10, 07:58 PM
#16
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NY
Posts: 3,370
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With the upcoming changes in CAFE Standards, future economic outlook, and consumer desires & tastes:
What would be your perfect Lexus lineup?
My suggestion:
IS : entry level compact sport sedan (V6, turbo I4)
Sport Cross needs to come back.
IS-C : entry level compact sport coupe (fixed top) and hardtop convertible
IS-F : high performance compact sedan
ES : midsized FWD sedan
ES-h : hybrid variant
--Lexus knows how to coddle their customers. But the ES can do well with an I4 engined hybrid variant. It will appeal to the masses because of its larger size and utilitarian design, compared to other hybrids such the Prius and HS250h.
GS : midsized RWD/AWD four-door "coupe-like" (V6) [similar to MB CLS]
GS-F (V8 Supercharged/1LR derivative)
LS : full sized RWD/AWD sedan
LS-h : full sized RWD hybrid variant
--Lexus also knows how to handle the LS flagship. It doesn't need an F model, but the Sport model is a great option. A hybrid option is a must. What the LS needs to learn is how to keep the weight down.
Would love to see a factory, V12, up armored (Think S-Guard) Type limo version.
Roadster + F : compact mid-engine RWD two-seater with turbo I4 and V6 variant. Gotta have something frivolously fun...
That or FT-86 based.
SC : midsized RWD two-door coupe and soft-top convertible (V6) [similar to Jaguar XK]
SC-F : high performance variant (Same engine options as GS), Hard top only.
--The SC needs to go back to its roots: a sporty 2+2 coupe.
LFA : exotic performance coupe/cabrio (V10)
--I wish it could stay for more than one generation. Perhaps a new (and less expensive) version will appear in the future? I do hope so...
RX : midsized FWD/AWD crossover (V6 and hybrid variants)
--The formula works now. I doubt Lexus will change it. Perhaps the reason why they haven't made a smaller compact crossover (JX/IX) is to prevent inter-brand competition from the RX.
GX : "midsized" AWD SUV (V8, turbo V6?)
--The new GX is what it should be: a competent luxurious SUV that blends eight-passenger urban functionality with towing capacity when needed. Make it more RR like, add a diesel option as well.
LX : full sized AWD SUV (V8)
--The LX (Land Cruiser) is iconic, and will live on, albeit a very small niche market. It addresses what the GX cannot: rural/off-road dominance, towing capacity, and rugged performance; all the while having tuxedo-like classiness.
Get rid of the LC in the US market and push the LX more.
Care to agree? Disagree?
DISCUSS.
What would be your perfect Lexus lineup?
My suggestion:
IS : entry level compact sport sedan (V6, turbo I4)
Sport Cross needs to come back.
IS-C : entry level compact sport coupe (fixed top) and hardtop convertible
IS-F : high performance compact sedan
ES : midsized FWD sedan
ES-h : hybrid variant
--Lexus knows how to coddle their customers. But the ES can do well with an I4 engined hybrid variant. It will appeal to the masses because of its larger size and utilitarian design, compared to other hybrids such the Prius and HS250h.
GS : midsized RWD/AWD four-door "coupe-like" (V6) [similar to MB CLS]
GS-F (V8 Supercharged/1LR derivative)
LS : full sized RWD/AWD sedan
LS-h : full sized RWD hybrid variant
--Lexus also knows how to handle the LS flagship. It doesn't need an F model, but the Sport model is a great option. A hybrid option is a must. What the LS needs to learn is how to keep the weight down.
Would love to see a factory, V12, up armored (Think S-Guard) Type limo version.
Roadster + F : compact mid-engine RWD two-seater with turbo I4 and V6 variant. Gotta have something frivolously fun...
That or FT-86 based.
SC : midsized RWD two-door coupe and soft-top convertible (V6) [similar to Jaguar XK]
SC-F : high performance variant (Same engine options as GS), Hard top only.
--The SC needs to go back to its roots: a sporty 2+2 coupe.
LFA : exotic performance coupe/cabrio (V10)
--I wish it could stay for more than one generation. Perhaps a new (and less expensive) version will appear in the future? I do hope so...
RX : midsized FWD/AWD crossover (V6 and hybrid variants)
--The formula works now. I doubt Lexus will change it. Perhaps the reason why they haven't made a smaller compact crossover (JX/IX) is to prevent inter-brand competition from the RX.
GX : "midsized" AWD SUV (V8, turbo V6?)
--The new GX is what it should be: a competent luxurious SUV that blends eight-passenger urban functionality with towing capacity when needed. Make it more RR like, add a diesel option as well.
LX : full sized AWD SUV (V8)
--The LX (Land Cruiser) is iconic, and will live on, albeit a very small niche market. It addresses what the GX cannot: rural/off-road dominance, towing capacity, and rugged performance; all the while having tuxedo-like classiness.
Get rid of the LC in the US market and push the LX more.
Care to agree? Disagree?
DISCUSS.
I think the GS and the SC are in most desperate need of a makeover, both in function and performance.
The GS needs to function like a sport saloon. The SC needs to function as a sport GT.
Right now, the GS is suffers from being smaller than the ES, not as agile as the IS, and almost priced as an LS. It needs to find a way to stand out and say "I'm better than these guys in other ways..."
The SC has nothing over the IS-C other than better quality materials and craftsmanship; the IS350-C is less expensive, faster, modification-worthy, more gas efficient, less to insure, modern, more technologically advanced, handles better, and has more usable rear seats.
The GS needs to function like a sport saloon. The SC needs to function as a sport GT.
Right now, the GS is suffers from being smaller than the ES, not as agile as the IS, and almost priced as an LS. It needs to find a way to stand out and say "I'm better than these guys in other ways..."
The SC has nothing over the IS-C other than better quality materials and craftsmanship; the IS350-C is less expensive, faster, modification-worthy, more gas efficient, less to insure, modern, more technologically advanced, handles better, and has more usable rear seats.
02-03-10, 08:12 PM
#17
I only require these few models that I've been imagining in my head for the longest time.
Hybrid aggressive saloon, long wheelbase but low height, powerful, quiet, compete with MB CLS and Fisker Karma.
SC-F, hybrid or not, I don't care but this one just has to be really fun.
Hybrid extended LX to compete with Escalade and Navigaor.
Hybrid aggressive saloon, long wheelbase but low height, powerful, quiet, compete with MB CLS and Fisker Karma.
SC-F, hybrid or not, I don't care but this one just has to be really fun.
Hybrid extended LX to compete with Escalade and Navigaor.
02-04-10, 07:03 AM
#18
Lead Lap
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 693
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This one, purportedly a derivative of the short 5-seater RAV4 sold outside of North America, has been rumored for years. What's more, my gut feeling tells me that the recently trademarked-by-Toyota TX designation is earmarked for this model.
02-04-10, 07:54 AM
#19
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: somewhere out there
Posts: 1,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Anyway if the sub-RX is based on any FWD platform big or small it shouldn't even be sold here in the US. RWD is the only thing that would make it unique enough from the RX that it wouldn't cannabalize sales.
Last edited by (Cj); 02-04-10 at 08:12 AM.
02-04-10, 08:26 AM
#20
Lead Lap
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 693
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Then again, I personally think that the spread between BMW's SAVs, especially between the upcoming X1 and X3, is ridiculously close.
Actually, some of the old rumors had TX as something they wouldn't sell in North America, making it a Japan and Europe-only deal, but, with ever-tightening CAFE laws here and CT all but certain to be sold in North America, I'd imagine we'd get TX as well, if it ever comes to fruition.
02-04-10, 10:09 AM
#21
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: somewhere out there
Posts: 1,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm assuming they'd derive TX from the SWB RAV4. Otherwise, you'd have a repeat of the current Toyota situation where North America's LWB RAV4 is too close in size to the Highlander. A LWB RAV4-derived Lexus would be, IMHO, too close for comfort to the Lexus RX.
Then again, I personally think that the spread between BMW's SAVs, especially between the upcoming X1 and X3, is ridiculously close.
Actually, some of the old rumors had TX as something they wouldn't sell in North America, making it a Japan and Europe-only deal, but, with ever-tightening CAFE laws here and CT all but certain to be sold in North America, I'd imagine we'd get TX as well, if it ever comes to fruition.
Then again, I personally think that the spread between BMW's SAVs, especially between the upcoming X1 and X3, is ridiculously close.
Actually, some of the old rumors had TX as something they wouldn't sell in North America, making it a Japan and Europe-only deal, but, with ever-tightening CAFE laws here and CT all but certain to be sold in North America, I'd imagine we'd get TX as well, if it ever comes to fruition.
Since the X1 is coming a compact TX could make its way here too, who knows. The SWB Rav4 is about the size of the 2nd gen Rav4, which sold decently here in the US from what I know.
02-04-10, 03:22 PM
#24
Lead Lap
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 693
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
02-04-10, 03:33 PM
#25
The RX needs a "smaller brother". Maybe not now, but definitely 5 years from now.
The IS sport cross didn't sell well because wagons are not popular in the U.S. At this time, crossovers simply appeal more to the masses...
02-04-10, 03:39 PM
#26
Lead Lap
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 693
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think that, ultimately, we'll see both a RAV4-derived TX and an IS T sportwagon version of the 3rd-gen IS. After all, Cadillac has the SRX and the CTS wagon, Audi the A4 Avant and Q5, BMW the X1, X3 and 3-Series wagon.
02-04-10, 04:16 PM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: somewhere out there
Posts: 1,227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I personally would prefer a larger crossover than the RX to slot between the RX and GX. Lexus had a concept of one a few years ago, and we even saw spy shots around the same time we saw spy shots of the RX and GX redesigns. But alas nothing came of it.
As of now, I would like to at least see an RX L that has a longer wheelbase and a 3rd row seat. If a sub-RX did come, then an RX-L would help bolster RX sales, and give Lexus a worthy competitor to the Acura MDX and Mercedes GL.
That sounds likely, and it would give people more options which is always a good thing.
Last edited by (Cj); 02-04-10 at 06:49 PM.
02-04-10, 05:04 PM
#28
Lead Lap
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: falling back and fading...
Posts: 720
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I'd like to see a wagon but I doubt it would sell. I guess that's more of a personal wish than anything.
I'd also like to see the GS go more along the sporty-performance route than it is currently on. Again, I have no idea if that would help the brand.
I think a mini-crossover would do well, though. At first I didn't think the GLK had much business being introduced, but now that I've seen it around I can understand its place in the market.
I'd also like to see the GS go more along the sporty-performance route than it is currently on. Again, I have no idea if that would help the brand.
I think a mini-crossover would do well, though. At first I didn't think the GLK had much business being introduced, but now that I've seen it around I can understand its place in the market.
02-04-10, 05:31 PM
#29
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NY
Posts: 3,370
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With CAFE standards to set in by 2016, we're gonna see a trend towards smaller, more gas efficient cars.
The RX needs a "smaller brother". Maybe not now, but definitely 5 years from now.
The IS sport cross didn't sell well because wagons are not popular in the U.S. At this time, crossovers simply appeal more to the masses...
The RX needs a "smaller brother". Maybe not now, but definitely 5 years from now.
The IS sport cross didn't sell well because wagons are not popular in the U.S. At this time, crossovers simply appeal more to the masses...
02-04-10, 06:35 PM
#30
Guest
Posts: n/a
I just would like to see more coupes, so an ISc, GSc, LSc, and even an ESc. I think a lot of people would want sport coupes as well as the traditional Lexus luxury in a nice big coupe.
I would like to see the 300 return, from the 2006 GS 300. Great engine, ample power and great MPG. Its a great engine that should be used (if it fits).
I would like to see an entry level GS, like BMW has with the 528. Bring back the GS 300 for those that want a GS but don't care or want power. It can help with sales.
I would like to see the SC become a Jag XK.
I would like to see a sub car below the LFA. LFC is fine
I would like to see a LFA convertible and hybrid.
The LS should have a 350 V-6 next time. The 350 makes more power than the old 400/430 with just some torque lacking. Or make a LS 400h hybrid as the entry model.
I would like to see more hybrids and not just one hybrid for a lineup. Offering multiple hybrid engines for one model (GS 250h, GS 400h etc).
I would like to see AWD on these coupes as an option.
I would like to see as CJ and others have suggested, an official F-sport package, like the LS sport or what BMW/AMG offers with their sport models. It seems like people do not want to add one part here or there. Also packages usually are cheaper and include some other items.
Of course the F lineup expanded.
I don't desire a cute ute. If Lexus feels it makes sense, they usually are right. No one wants wagons, PERIOD. Sorry. Caddy just dropped the price of the wonderful CTS wagon b/c of low sales.
I would like to see the 300 return, from the 2006 GS 300. Great engine, ample power and great MPG. Its a great engine that should be used (if it fits).
I would like to see an entry level GS, like BMW has with the 528. Bring back the GS 300 for those that want a GS but don't care or want power. It can help with sales.
I would like to see the SC become a Jag XK.
I would like to see a sub car below the LFA. LFC is fine
I would like to see a LFA convertible and hybrid. The LS should have a 350 V-6 next time. The 350 makes more power than the old 400/430 with just some torque lacking. Or make a LS 400h hybrid as the entry model.
I would like to see more hybrids and not just one hybrid for a lineup. Offering multiple hybrid engines for one model (GS 250h, GS 400h etc).
I would like to see AWD on these coupes as an option.
I would like to see as CJ and others have suggested, an official F-sport package, like the LS sport or what BMW/AMG offers with their sport models. It seems like people do not want to add one part here or there. Also packages usually are cheaper and include some other items.
Of course the F lineup expanded.
I don't desire a cute ute. If Lexus feels it makes sense, they usually are right. No one wants wagons, PERIOD. Sorry. Caddy just dropped the price of the wonderful CTS wagon b/c of low sales.