Honda Settles Class-Action Lawsuit Over Brakes
#1
Honda Settles Class-Action Lawsuit Over Brakes
Honda has agreed to settle a class-action suit that claims the rear brakes in 750,000 late model Accords and Acura TSXs are wearing out more than twice as fast as they should.
The suit was filed in September, claiming that unreasonable wear was due to a defective design that caused “excessive force to be applied to the vehicle’s rear wheels.”
It covers 2008–9 Accords and 2009 Acura TSXs as well as a small number of 2010 models. The suit says the rear pads wear out in 15,000-20,000 miles when they should last at about 70,000 miles, that Honda has refused to provide repairs under the new-car warranty and failed to warn new buyers that the rear brakes would require such frequent repairs.
The suit attributes the problem to a new braking system that included four-wheel discs and an electronic brake distribution system that became standard on the 2008 Accord and 2009 TSX.
On its Web site, Honda described electronic brake distribution as “a more exacting method of ensuring that proportionate braking forces are applied to the brakes. In order to avoid needless ABS cycling during a nonemergency stop, E.B.D. uses the ABS sensors to detect impending rear-wheel lockup. Then it signals an additional ABS solenoid to reduce braking force to the rear and add more to the front.”
Honda has come up with a new brake pad and can make adjustments to the braking system that will “greatly increase the lifespan of those rear brake pads,” said Eric Gibbs of San Francisco, one of the lawyers who filed the case.
Chris Martin, a Honda spokesman, said the automaker did not comment on pending litigation.
The proposed settlement says that Honda denies there is a defect or that it has done anything wrong. The settlement also says neither Honda nor the plaintiffs’ lawyers have identified a safety problem.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has about 350 owner complaints about the issue on its Web site.
Jerry Ongaro of Naperville, Ill., filed his complaint with the Center for Auto Safety. Mr. Ongaro said he was charged $256 for new rear brakes on his 2008 Accord after only 26,000 miles. “Most of the miles I put on this particular car have been expressway. No stop and go. Strictly zoom, zoom. Back and forth. I was dumbfounded,” he said in an interview.
“I just got very angry at the seeming indifference Honda had with this,” he said. “I was really frustrated, this is my eighth Honda. They have been great cars.”
Judge Margaret M. Morrow of the United States District Court for the Central District of California is scheduled in May to consider whether the settlement is fair to owners and deserves preliminary approval. If she grants preliminary approval, interested parties have the opportunity to comment. She would consider final approval later this year.
Here’s what is proposed:
• Owners who had the pads replaced and rotors resurfaced before approval of the settlement would be reimbursed for one half of the cost, or a maximum of $125, “whichever is less.” That would be for repairs in which the original worn pads were replaced with pads of the same type. Owners can file claims for multiple repairs, and the work does not need to have been done at a Honda dealership.
Owners who complained on the N.H.T.S.A. Web site typically said they paid from $100 to $300 for the repair, which sometimes included the brake rotors being smoothed out.
• Owners will also be given a one-time payment of up to $150 to have the new, redesigned brake pads installed.
Mr. Gibbs said the $150 should pay for most repairs, but some consumers might have to pay an extra $10 or $20. He said that seemed like the best deal possible because there would be no guarantee that consumers would get more after a trial.
“Cases like this, when you are alleging that a wear part is defective, are extraordinarily difficult to prove and to win,” Mr. Gibbs said.
The settlement proposes that $2 million for fees and expenses be shared by Mr. Gibbs and the other lawyers in the case, including those from Berk Law of Washington.
The suit was filed in September, claiming that unreasonable wear was due to a defective design that caused “excessive force to be applied to the vehicle’s rear wheels.”
It covers 2008–9 Accords and 2009 Acura TSXs as well as a small number of 2010 models. The suit says the rear pads wear out in 15,000-20,000 miles when they should last at about 70,000 miles, that Honda has refused to provide repairs under the new-car warranty and failed to warn new buyers that the rear brakes would require such frequent repairs.
The suit attributes the problem to a new braking system that included four-wheel discs and an electronic brake distribution system that became standard on the 2008 Accord and 2009 TSX.
On its Web site, Honda described electronic brake distribution as “a more exacting method of ensuring that proportionate braking forces are applied to the brakes. In order to avoid needless ABS cycling during a nonemergency stop, E.B.D. uses the ABS sensors to detect impending rear-wheel lockup. Then it signals an additional ABS solenoid to reduce braking force to the rear and add more to the front.”
Honda has come up with a new brake pad and can make adjustments to the braking system that will “greatly increase the lifespan of those rear brake pads,” said Eric Gibbs of San Francisco, one of the lawyers who filed the case.
Chris Martin, a Honda spokesman, said the automaker did not comment on pending litigation.
The proposed settlement says that Honda denies there is a defect or that it has done anything wrong. The settlement also says neither Honda nor the plaintiffs’ lawyers have identified a safety problem.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has about 350 owner complaints about the issue on its Web site.
Jerry Ongaro of Naperville, Ill., filed his complaint with the Center for Auto Safety. Mr. Ongaro said he was charged $256 for new rear brakes on his 2008 Accord after only 26,000 miles. “Most of the miles I put on this particular car have been expressway. No stop and go. Strictly zoom, zoom. Back and forth. I was dumbfounded,” he said in an interview.
“I just got very angry at the seeming indifference Honda had with this,” he said. “I was really frustrated, this is my eighth Honda. They have been great cars.”
Judge Margaret M. Morrow of the United States District Court for the Central District of California is scheduled in May to consider whether the settlement is fair to owners and deserves preliminary approval. If she grants preliminary approval, interested parties have the opportunity to comment. She would consider final approval later this year.
Here’s what is proposed:
• Owners who had the pads replaced and rotors resurfaced before approval of the settlement would be reimbursed for one half of the cost, or a maximum of $125, “whichever is less.” That would be for repairs in which the original worn pads were replaced with pads of the same type. Owners can file claims for multiple repairs, and the work does not need to have been done at a Honda dealership.
Owners who complained on the N.H.T.S.A. Web site typically said they paid from $100 to $300 for the repair, which sometimes included the brake rotors being smoothed out.
• Owners will also be given a one-time payment of up to $150 to have the new, redesigned brake pads installed.
Mr. Gibbs said the $150 should pay for most repairs, but some consumers might have to pay an extra $10 or $20. He said that seemed like the best deal possible because there would be no guarantee that consumers would get more after a trial.
“Cases like this, when you are alleging that a wear part is defective, are extraordinarily difficult to prove and to win,” Mr. Gibbs said.
The settlement proposes that $2 million for fees and expenses be shared by Mr. Gibbs and the other lawyers in the case, including those from Berk Law of Washington.
#2
Brake pads, especially the rears, should last MUCH more than 15-20k miles. After all, these aren't race cars. I've personally had to replace the rear brakes for a friend's 2006 Honda Accord and it only had 25k at most. It's not even on the list of 'affected' cars.
#3
Lexus Champion
unless they like to leave the parking brake on and drive off....
#5
Lexus Fanatic
#6
Lexus Fanatic
Mr. Ongaro said he was charged $256 for new rear brakes on his 2008 Accord after only 26,000 miles. “Most of the miles I put on this particular car have been expressway. No stop and go.
Hondas, traditionally, have had rather weak brake performance and spongy pedal action, meaning that the pedal must be pushed harder to get the same amount of respose than in some other vehicles. That, of course, doesn't do much for brake life either.
#7
Lexus Fanatic
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: A better place
Posts: 7,285
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Agreed. I am not surprised at all regarding this bit of news. I guess it's better than having brake fade problems, but this is still an inexcusable problem.
Trending Topics
#8
Lexus Fanatic
Fade, as I understand it, does not come from wear of the lining/pad material, but from heat buildup with repeated use, causing the drums or calipers to expand to the point where you have to push the pedal harder (and generate more hydraulic pressure) to keep the linings/pads in contact with the rotor or drum. Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but I don't see where fade would be an issue with the problems that the thread topic describes.
#9
Lexus Fanatic
Sure is a bit of marginal and not very useful or accurate discussion of brakes in this thread, maybe we can have a real qualified technician chime in the the braking issue(s) with Hondas.
#10
Honda likes to undersize their brake on many of their cars. While they pose no real safety issue, they're somewhat inadequate if you plan to stop repeatedly within a short period of time. I've had lots of Honda cars before and yes they do feel spongy and weak on some cars, but never did they put me in a harmful situation.
The brakes work... just not as well as other brands out there.
The brakes work... just not as well as other brands out there.
#11
Although many pads/linings last for 40-50K miles or more, replacing them at 25 or 26K is not, IMO, considered excessive, especially since some auto manufacturers use a softer, less-durable pad/lining compound that is designed to avoid squealing/grating noise in the brakes......
#12
Lexus Fanatic
Unfortunately, technicians, regardless of the issue or amount of training, won't be making the settlements in this case. If the past is any guide, it will probably be lawyers, government officials, and company reps.
#13
Lexus Fanatic
Agreed on above statement regarding settlement. But I was talking more about the discussion of brake fade and other technical aspects of Honda's brakes.
#14
Lexus Fanatic
I don't want to take the thread off-topic, but think back to some of the Chrysler products you and I learned to drive on some 40 years ago. Their drum brakes, especially the non-power ones, had the same problem.....too small for the car's weight. Fade, short life, and poor brake performance were generally a fact of life with them.
Last edited by mmarshall; 04-07-10 at 03:06 PM.
#15
Lexus Fanatic
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: A better place
Posts: 7,285
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fade, as I understand it, does not come from wear of the lining/pad material, but from heat buildup with repeated use, causing the drums or calipers to expand to the point where you have to push the pedal harder (and generate more hydraulic pressure) to keep the linings/pads in contact with the rotor or drum. Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but I don't see where fade would be an issue with the problems that the thread topic describes.
Honda likes to undersize their brake on many of their cars. While they pose no real safety issue, they're somewhat inadequate if you plan to stop repeatedly within a short period of time. I've had lots of Honda cars before and yes they do feel spongy and weak on some cars, but never did they put me in a harmful situation.
The brakes work... just not as well as other brands out there.
The brakes work... just not as well as other brands out there.
Honda always tries to do as much as possible with the bare minimum, rather than spending the time and money to over-engineer a part and make it more robust than the minimum requirements.
I personal have experienced harmful situations with Honda brakes, one of the many reasons I am no longer a Honda fan.
It's fairly well-known, though, even outside of technician classes, that Honda tends to use smallish brakes on their vehicles, and that can cause sub-standard brake performance. Some of the most die-hard Honda fans I've come across have also had that complaint. The old CRX was a classic example, but, of course, many newer ones as well.
I don't want to take the thread off-topic, but think back to some of the Chrysler products you and I learned to drive on some 40 years ago. Their drum brakes, especially the non-power ones, had the same problem.....too small for the car's weight. Fade, short life, and poor brake performance were generally a fact of life with them.
I don't want to take the thread off-topic, but think back to some of the Chrysler products you and I learned to drive on some 40 years ago. Their drum brakes, especially the non-power ones, had the same problem.....too small for the car's weight. Fade, short life, and poor brake performance were generally a fact of life with them.