April 2010 Monthly Auto Sales Thread
05-04-10 | 12:41 PM
#46
Lexus Fanatic
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From: Massachusetts
Doesn't matter. Carmy sales has always included Solara. Does it bother you that Corolla sales have always included the Matrix? If Toyota wanted to call it the Camry Venza, they could have done that.
Take away the Crosstour, the Accord nameplate still outsold the Camry nameplate. 29,311 to 27,914.
Numbers are as they are reported by the manufacturers and should be accepted as that.
Take away the Crosstour, the Accord nameplate still outsold the Camry nameplate. 29,311 to 27,914.
Numbers are as they are reported by the manufacturers and should be accepted as that.
05-04-10 | 12:44 PM
#47
I see the point on both sides, however the Camry/Solara comparison is a little different than the Accord/Accord Coupe.
If you want to break out sedan sales then I am pretty sure that the Camry outsells the Accord sedan. The Accord Coupe has always easily outsold the Solara which has now been discontinued, so that is a nice advantage for Honda when reporting sales numbers for the "Accord" name.
Really this comes down to marketing jargon, IMO. Honda might be able to claim "best selling nameplate" and Toyota might be able to claim "best selling sedan".
If you want to break out sedan sales then I am pretty sure that the Camry outsells the Accord sedan. The Accord Coupe has always easily outsold the Solara which has now been discontinued, so that is a nice advantage for Honda when reporting sales numbers for the "Accord" name.
Really this comes down to marketing jargon, IMO. Honda might be able to claim "best selling nameplate" and Toyota might be able to claim "best selling sedan".
05-04-10 | 12:54 PM
#48
Lead Lap
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From: California
I see the point on both sides, however the Camry/Solara comparison is a little different than the Accord/Accord Coupe.
If you want to break out sedan sales then I am pretty sure that the Camry outsells the Accord sedan. The Accord Coupe has always easily outsold the Solara which has now been discontinued, so that is a nice advantage for Honda when reporting sales numbers for the "Accord" name.
Really this comes down to marketing jargon, IMO. Honda might be able to claim "best selling nameplate" and Toyota might be able to claim "best selling sedan".
If you want to break out sedan sales then I am pretty sure that the Camry outsells the Accord sedan. The Accord Coupe has always easily outsold the Solara which has now been discontinued, so that is a nice advantage for Honda when reporting sales numbers for the "Accord" name.
Really this comes down to marketing jargon, IMO. Honda might be able to claim "best selling nameplate" and Toyota might be able to claim "best selling sedan".
Honda has that advantage now, but for years, Toyota got to report Solara sales with Camry sales. The Altima also has coupe sales but unless the manufacturers actually publish the break out of sedans and coupes, it is still all speculation to their actual breakdowns, but I do agree with the assumption that Camry sedan is probably greater than Accord sedan sales.
05-04-10 | 01:03 PM
#49
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From: A better place
Doesn't matter. Carmy sales has always included Solara. Does it bother you that Corolla sales have always included the Matrix? If Toyota wanted to call it the Camry Venza, they could have done that.
Take away the Crosstour, the Accord nameplate still outsold the Camry nameplate. 29,311 to 27,914.
Numbers are as they are reported by the manufacturers and should be accepted as that.
Take away the Crosstour, the Accord nameplate still outsold the Camry nameplate. 29,311 to 27,914.
Numbers are as they are reported by the manufacturers and should be accepted as that.
Numbers should simply be accepted as manufacturers report them? That's a little ridiculous.
So I should simply accept Genesis combined sales from Hyundai even though combined sales include the Genesis coupe and Genesis sedan, two totally different cars at two different price ranges and competing in two different markets?
Some numbers should be accepted as they are listed, but not all.
My point still stands: the Camry was the best-selling sedan in America in April. This is because Accord sales still include the coupe. Take away the coupe (I guarantee Honda sold more than 2,000 Accord coupes for the month) and Toyota sold more Camry sedans than Honda sold Accord sedans.
05-04-10 | 01:25 PM
#50
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From: MD
Subaru's April Sales Reach New Heights With a 48-Percent Sales Increase
-- Subaru Outback and Legacy Sales Show No Signs of Slowing Down --
CHERRY HILL, N.J., May 3 /PRNewswire/ -- Subaru of America, Inc. today announced that sales for April 2010 were up 48-percent over April 2009 with 23,198 units sold. Sales for the 2010 Subaru Outback were more than double the previous year with a 133-percent increase, while the 2010 Subaru Legacy posted a 50-percent increase over April 2009. This also marks the best-ever April for the company. The previous April record was established in 2008 with 16,771 units sold. Year-to-date sales increased 41-percent with 80,692 units sold versus 57,181 units over the same period last year.
"The Subaru brand is now consistently achieving new levels of sales, which is a tribute to our strong product line up," said Tim Colbeck, senior vice president of sales, Subaru of America, Inc. "We are significantly ahead of last year's record sales pace and expect the momentum to continue."
Apr-10 Apr-09 % chg Apr.-10 YTD Apr.-09 YTD % chg.
Legacy
3,851 2,561 50% 12,401 6,621 87%
Outback
7,688 3,293 133% 26,963 11,806 128%
Impreza
3,796 3,273 16% 13,066 12,875 1%
Forester
7,627 5,955 28% 27,352 23,897 14%
Tribeca
236 567 -58% 910 1,982 -54%
Total
23,198 1 5,649 48% 80,692 57,181 41%
"Our sales reflect the outstanding efforts of our retailers, the appeal our products represent to our customers and the recognition our vehicles continue to earn from opinion leaders," said Thomas J. Doll, executive vice president and COO, Subaru of America, Inc. "For instance, Kiplinger's Personal Finance recently awarded the 2010 Subaru Legacy and Outback vehicles with its Best vehicle awards in their categories, while Parents Magazine and Edmunds.com just named the 2010 Legacy one of the Best Family Cars for 2010."
-- Subaru Outback and Legacy Sales Show No Signs of Slowing Down --
CHERRY HILL, N.J., May 3 /PRNewswire/ -- Subaru of America, Inc. today announced that sales for April 2010 were up 48-percent over April 2009 with 23,198 units sold. Sales for the 2010 Subaru Outback were more than double the previous year with a 133-percent increase, while the 2010 Subaru Legacy posted a 50-percent increase over April 2009. This also marks the best-ever April for the company. The previous April record was established in 2008 with 16,771 units sold. Year-to-date sales increased 41-percent with 80,692 units sold versus 57,181 units over the same period last year.
"The Subaru brand is now consistently achieving new levels of sales, which is a tribute to our strong product line up," said Tim Colbeck, senior vice president of sales, Subaru of America, Inc. "We are significantly ahead of last year's record sales pace and expect the momentum to continue."
Apr-10 Apr-09 % chg Apr.-10 YTD Apr.-09 YTD % chg.
Legacy
3,851 2,561 50% 12,401 6,621 87%
Outback
7,688 3,293 133% 26,963 11,806 128%
Impreza
3,796 3,273 16% 13,066 12,875 1%
Forester
7,627 5,955 28% 27,352 23,897 14%
Tribeca
236 567 -58% 910 1,982 -54%
Total
23,198 1 5,649 48% 80,692 57,181 41%
"Our sales reflect the outstanding efforts of our retailers, the appeal our products represent to our customers and the recognition our vehicles continue to earn from opinion leaders," said Thomas J. Doll, executive vice president and COO, Subaru of America, Inc. "For instance, Kiplinger's Personal Finance recently awarded the 2010 Subaru Legacy and Outback vehicles with its Best vehicle awards in their categories, while Parents Magazine and Edmunds.com just named the 2010 Legacy one of the Best Family Cars for 2010."
05-04-10 | 02:10 PM
#51
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From: California
Doesn't matter, really? Guess what, the Solara is no longer sold. Camry sales reported *right now* by Toyota in recent times have been ONLY sedan sales. The Solara has been discontinued, and the Venza is listed separately.
Numbers should simply be accepted as manufacturers report them? That's a little ridiculous.
So I should simply accept Genesis combined sales from Hyundai even though combined sales include the Genesis coupe and Genesis sedan, two totally different cars at two different price ranges and competing in two different markets?
Some numbers should be accepted as they are listed, but not all.
My point still stands: the Camry was the best-selling sedan in America in April. This is because Accord sales still include the coupe. Take away the coupe (I guarantee Honda sold more than 2,000 Accord coupes for the month) and Toyota sold more Camry sedans than Honda sold Accord sedans.
Numbers should simply be accepted as manufacturers report them? That's a little ridiculous.
So I should simply accept Genesis combined sales from Hyundai even though combined sales include the Genesis coupe and Genesis sedan, two totally different cars at two different price ranges and competing in two different markets?
Some numbers should be accepted as they are listed, but not all.
My point still stands: the Camry was the best-selling sedan in America in April. This is because Accord sales still include the coupe. Take away the coupe (I guarantee Honda sold more than 2,000 Accord coupes for the month) and Toyota sold more Camry sedans than Honda sold Accord sedans.
Yes it's disappointing that Genesis sales aren't broken down by coupes and sedans. I agree with you that they are targeted for completely different audiences and don't have all that much in common. It certainly would be nice if manufacturers broke everything out like BMW used to with 3-series sales. BMW used to break the 3 down into xi, coupe, displacement, wagon, etc... but since the manufacturers don't, all we have left are these monthly press releases.
It's just like the breakdown of retail and fleet sales. We get little glimpses here and there but the actual fleet break down by model is not made public. Whenever the information is chanced upon, it gets tossed into the monthly sales thread.
05-04-10 | 02:23 PM
#52
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,227
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From: somewhere out there
I can't believe you guys still even talk about Accord vs Camry. It's a wash and it has been for the past few years. They both trade off top spots month by month.
And you can't only blame Honda for sales tactics (ie including Crossturd sales with sedan/coupe sales). At one point Toyota had 3 variants of Camry: sedan, Solara, and Solara convertible; while Honda only had coupe and sedan variants of the Accord. Now it's flipped and Toyota only has one variant (plus they have a hybrid) while Honda has 3 bodystyles.
Toyota still includes Matrix sales with the Corolla which is a huge advantage in sales over the Civic which only has sedan and coupe.
I'm not going to justify either companies tactics and it really doesn't matter if they provide a breakdown or not. For example plenty of fullsize sedans outsell the Genesis coupe/sedan combo month by month. So it's not always about body styles offered. It's about if the car is a good car and if the nameplate is a good nameplate. The Accord and Camry have been equally good for the past decade.
And you can't only blame Honda for sales tactics (ie including Crossturd sales with sedan/coupe sales). At one point Toyota had 3 variants of Camry: sedan, Solara, and Solara convertible; while Honda only had coupe and sedan variants of the Accord. Now it's flipped and Toyota only has one variant (plus they have a hybrid) while Honda has 3 bodystyles.
Toyota still includes Matrix sales with the Corolla which is a huge advantage in sales over the Civic which only has sedan and coupe.
I'm not going to justify either companies tactics and it really doesn't matter if they provide a breakdown or not. For example plenty of fullsize sedans outsell the Genesis coupe/sedan combo month by month. So it's not always about body styles offered. It's about if the car is a good car and if the nameplate is a good nameplate. The Accord and Camry have been equally good for the past decade.
05-04-10 | 02:42 PM
#53
^^ That is a great article. We all know the HS hasn't hit sales goals it is no secret and their best months were with CFC. I've driven it extensively and it is a nice car but it has a few things not in its favor
-styling is very ho hum at best
-pricing is very high, it starts at nearly $35,000 and hits 40k then 45k with options! It is not cheap!
-MPG is best for a luxury car but I think a 40 MPG rating would have gotten more attention.
-Gas prices still are not at levels where people will jump to more fuel efficient cars
-the interior is different and people might not want that in a Lexus
-it drives remarkably well but Lexus marketing is not showing that, just talking about tech instead.
What is stated is true though, the HS is incremental in sales so its really just adding to the bottom line and adding additional volume which is good. As gas prices continue to rise I expect sales to rise as well.
-styling is very ho hum at best
-pricing is very high, it starts at nearly $35,000 and hits 40k then 45k with options! It is not cheap!
-MPG is best for a luxury car but I think a 40 MPG rating would have gotten more attention.
-Gas prices still are not at levels where people will jump to more fuel efficient cars
-the interior is different and people might not want that in a Lexus
-it drives remarkably well but Lexus marketing is not showing that, just talking about tech instead.
What is stated is true though, the HS is incremental in sales so its really just adding to the bottom line and adding additional volume which is good. As gas prices continue to rise I expect sales to rise as well.
since the very beginning i have been saying the HS is a stupid car, from design to execution. i don't know where that car should be positioned at, for the price it's almost scary to get.
i am more interested to see how the ct will do
05-04-10 | 02:50 PM
#54
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Posts: n/a
I can't believe you guys still even talk about Accord vs Camry. It's a wash and it has been for the past few years. They both trade off top spots month by month.
And you can't only blame Honda for sales tactics (ie including Crossturd sales with sedan/coupe sales). At one point Toyota had 3 variants of Camry: sedan, Solara, and Solara convertible; while Honda only had coupe and sedan variants of the Accord. Now it's flipped and Toyota only has one variant (plus they have a hybrid) while Honda has 3 bodystyles.
Toyota still includes Matrix sales with the Corolla which is a huge advantage in sales over the Civic which only has sedan and coupe.
I'm not going to justify either companies tactics and it really doesn't matter if they provide a breakdown or not. For example plenty of fullsize sedans outsell the Genesis coupe/sedan combo month by month. So it's not always about body styles offered. It's about if the car is a good car and if the nameplate is a good nameplate. The Accord and Camry have been equally good for the past decade.
And you can't only blame Honda for sales tactics (ie including Crossturd sales with sedan/coupe sales). At one point Toyota had 3 variants of Camry: sedan, Solara, and Solara convertible; while Honda only had coupe and sedan variants of the Accord. Now it's flipped and Toyota only has one variant (plus they have a hybrid) while Honda has 3 bodystyles.
Toyota still includes Matrix sales with the Corolla which is a huge advantage in sales over the Civic which only has sedan and coupe.
I'm not going to justify either companies tactics and it really doesn't matter if they provide a breakdown or not. For example plenty of fullsize sedans outsell the Genesis coupe/sedan combo month by month. So it's not always about body styles offered. It's about if the car is a good car and if the nameplate is a good nameplate. The Accord and Camry have been equally good for the past decade.
if gas prices increase i will see myself in the es before i see the hs.
since the very beginning i have been saying the HS is a stupid car, from design to execution. i don't know where that car should be positioned at, for the price it's almost scary to get.
i am more interested to see how the ct will do
since the very beginning i have been saying the HS is a stupid car, from design to execution. i don't know where that car should be positioned at, for the price it's almost scary to get.
i am more interested to see how the ct will do
I had no counter
Its not a looker. That said gas is climbing so the car might just be a brilliant move in a couple of years. We all have to remember new Cafe standards are coming FAST.
To me the HS is a car for tomorrow, not today.
05-04-10 | 03:54 PM
#55
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,227
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From: somewhere out there
if gas prices increase i will see myself in the es before i see the hs.
since the very beginning i have been saying the HS is a stupid car, from design to execution. i don't know where that car should be positioned at, for the price it's almost scary to get.
i am more interested to see how the ct will do
since the very beginning i have been saying the HS is a stupid car, from design to execution. i don't know where that car should be positioned at, for the price it's almost scary to get.
i am more interested to see how the ct will do
As has been said countless times the HS isn't a bad car, it's just an oddball in a crowded segment. It's slow, pricey, has so-so styling, and the hwy mileage is only 3-4 mpg better than some of the competition. Not good qualities for a dedicated hybrid.
05-04-10 | 03:55 PM
#56
I agree with this.
We had one for almost a week as I've reviewed it and in our case we also would not get it over the IS or ES. I even threw around the idea of me driving it as a beater and she drive the GSh and she was like "I don't like how it looks".
I had no counter Its not a looker. That said gas is climbing so the car might just be a brilliant move in a couple of years. We all have to remember new Cafe standards are coming FAST. To me the HS is a car for tomorrow, not today.
We had one for almost a week as I've reviewed it and in our case we also would not get it over the IS or ES. I even threw around the idea of me driving it as a beater and she drive the GSh and she was like "I don't like how it looks".
I had no counter
Its not a looker. That said gas is climbing so the car might just be a brilliant move in a couple of years. We all have to remember new Cafe standards are coming FAST. To me the HS is a car for tomorrow, not today.
05-04-10 | 04:26 PM
#57
Guest
Posts: n/a
i don't doubt the concept / intention of the HS, maybe it will work. but not in the current form and price. if it's a car for tomorrow, it should come tomorrow. it's kind of like the previous generation 7 series, bangle kept on saying it's a car for the future. well yeah, it was ugly too
CJ as for the CT when does it debut again this fall? It better be priced significantly lower than the HS and get at LEAST 40-42 MPG. I can't wait to drive it.
