Motor stopped working w/pics
05-16-10 | 08:44 PM
#1
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From: California
Motor stopped working w/pics
From another forum, does not look good:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=275657
Have to love it when your Wife's car does this...
Wife was on her way home last Thursday on the highway doing about 65-75MPH and suddenly the vehicle lurched and lost all power. She pulled over. I came and towed it home behind the SUV and started investigating the problem. Didn't take too long to realize that the engine was not going to turn over and that there must be some catastrophic engine damage.
Spent this morning pulling the head to see how bad it was....
I'm thrilled...
Timing belt is in-tact, tensioner appears to be working.... Either it jumped time or dropped a valve which started this chain reaction of destruction.
Kia recommended a timing belt change at 60K, and this has about double that mileage on it. Not sure if a replaced timing belt would have prevented this though. In all of the timing belts I have seen pulled from vehicles, usually far passed the recommended due date, I have yet to see one come out that didn't look pristine.
I have a bad taste in my mouth for Kia right now. Modern engines are usually the last thing to fail on a car even with **** poor maintenance.
I also can't figure out why so many engines are still being designed as interference engines.
Resale value with a working engine is half the price of a replacement engine (assuming I put it in). Not worth it... Might check to see how much it would be to have the head re-done. I'm going to inspect the cylinder walls for damage, if the valve pieces stayed lodged the way it appears they did, then the cylinder walls may not be too bad off. A quick honing and dropping some new pistons in might do the trick. Not sure yet if it's worth the time/effort/money.
Probably time to find a new used car. Would like to find her something AWD... Maybe a Subaru, they tend to be priced really well unless you start looking at the ones that come with those really nice features, like seats and steering wheels.... lol.
Wife was on her way home last Thursday on the highway doing about 65-75MPH and suddenly the vehicle lurched and lost all power. She pulled over. I came and towed it home behind the SUV and started investigating the problem. Didn't take too long to realize that the engine was not going to turn over and that there must be some catastrophic engine damage.
Spent this morning pulling the head to see how bad it was....
I'm thrilled...
Timing belt is in-tact, tensioner appears to be working.... Either it jumped time or dropped a valve which started this chain reaction of destruction.
Kia recommended a timing belt change at 60K, and this has about double that mileage on it. Not sure if a replaced timing belt would have prevented this though. In all of the timing belts I have seen pulled from vehicles, usually far passed the recommended due date, I have yet to see one come out that didn't look pristine.
I have a bad taste in my mouth for Kia right now. Modern engines are usually the last thing to fail on a car even with **** poor maintenance.
I also can't figure out why so many engines are still being designed as interference engines.
Resale value with a working engine is half the price of a replacement engine (assuming I put it in). Not worth it... Might check to see how much it would be to have the head re-done. I'm going to inspect the cylinder walls for damage, if the valve pieces stayed lodged the way it appears they did, then the cylinder walls may not be too bad off. A quick honing and dropping some new pistons in might do the trick. Not sure yet if it's worth the time/effort/money.
Probably time to find a new used car. Would like to find her something AWD... Maybe a Subaru, they tend to be priced really well unless you start looking at the ones that come with those really nice features, like seats and steering wheels.... lol.
05-16-10 | 08:53 PM
#2
Can you say exhaust cam jumped time? Ouch. Odds are the valve stems on the exhaust side cause the guides to crack the head too. I saw that in '85 and '86 Ford Escorts. I made a lot of money on Escorts...
05-16-10 | 09:26 PM
#4
I'd have to agree that the cam jumped timing. Him mentioning that he has twice the recommended mile on the belt is rather stupid, IMO. He obviously knows how to wrench, why not do it to prevent something like this? Those belts stretch over time and the root cause has to be a jumped tooth. He probably could've verified this while taking it apart.
05-17-10 | 12:18 AM
#6
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Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Van Alstyne, TX
uhh, yeah...
Time for a used motor, dont even try to rebuild. I can tell by the far right cylinder that the block will need a REALLY good honing. UNLESS he got lucky and Kia uses sleeves, which I doubt. If they did, he could re-sleeve it and it would be all gravy, with all new internals of course.
I would be willing to bet, depending on the Y/M/M he could find a Kia/Hyundai V6 engine, low miles, used, for around $1500-2000. Thats FAR cheaper than buying a new car, or paying payments on one you cant drive.
Time for a used motor, dont even try to rebuild. I can tell by the far right cylinder that the block will need a REALLY good honing. UNLESS he got lucky and Kia uses sleeves, which I doubt. If they did, he could re-sleeve it and it would be all gravy, with all new internals of course.
I would be willing to bet, depending on the Y/M/M he could find a Kia/Hyundai V6 engine, low miles, used, for around $1500-2000. Thats FAR cheaper than buying a new car, or paying payments on one you cant drive.
05-17-10 | 07:22 AM
#7
Pole Position
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,791
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From: VA
Wait...so he freely admits that he didn't change the timing belt at the recommended interval...letting it go "at least twice" the recommended interval...and then complains at how badly Kia engines are made?
Who here DOESN'T know how important it is to replace the timing belt BEFORE it fails?
Who here DOESN'T know how important it is to replace the timing belt BEFORE it fails?
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05-17-10 | 08:52 AM
#8
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,618
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From: NYC/ATL
belt went over 2x the allowed mileage, 120+ on a belt meant to go maybe 80 give or take depending on driving conditions and idiot proofing done by the manufacture/lawyers, most likely happened when his wife put the pedal to the floor, loose belt lost it's grip, end of story, always interesting to read about someone who seems to know so much but still neglect the basic maintenance
05-17-10 | 09:18 AM
#14
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: NYC/ATL
Belts stretch, they are on ridiculously tight, over time it will not keep that tight hold, think of it like this, if it was around your waist and then tightened to spec, it would cut you in half, it's how people lose fingers when they are not careful
Last edited by <VENOM>; 05-17-10 at 09:32 AM.
05-17-10 | 09:33 AM
#15
This thread makes very little sense to me. You have a person posting who has enough experience to be able to pull the head off the block, and he couldn't verify whether the timing belt was properly aligned before he started disassembly? Furthermore, he couldn't have replaced it when it was scheduled to? Something doesn't add up.
If the timing belt jumped a tooth or two this wouldn't have happened. This looks like the cam spun a good 180 degrees to cause that much damage.
As far as timing belt maintenance, I'd say it is unusual for the belt itself to break, even if its old. Usually belts break when one of the idler pulleys, or the water pump pulley seizes.
This is why this is important to replaced all the pulleys, water pump and tensioner when replacing the timing belt. Unlike the pulleys that are inside your engine, the idler pulleys are not lubricated, and they are exposed to engine heat, moisture, dirt, salt, cold and hot weather, leaking oil and antifreeze. You can't expect them to last forever.
If the timing belt jumped a tooth or two this wouldn't have happened. This looks like the cam spun a good 180 degrees to cause that much damage.
As far as timing belt maintenance, I'd say it is unusual for the belt itself to break, even if its old. Usually belts break when one of the idler pulleys, or the water pump pulley seizes.
This is why this is important to replaced all the pulleys, water pump and tensioner when replacing the timing belt. Unlike the pulleys that are inside your engine, the idler pulleys are not lubricated, and they are exposed to engine heat, moisture, dirt, salt, cold and hot weather, leaking oil and antifreeze. You can't expect them to last forever.