Fizzboy7

The brand does not need AWD. That would just add to the sticker, hurt fuel economy, and add weight. All steps backward in progress. What Acura needs to do is go back to what they once did best. That was conservative, modern styling, a dose of luxury, at a price that undercuts the higher competitors. Grab all those things the way they did in the late 80's and early 90's and they'll have sales again. The old recipe was good.

mmarshall

Many upmarket-car buyers, today, disagree. More and more of them want (or expect) AWD, especially in bad-weather areas. A good case can be made that it doen't necessarily need to be standard, but definitely should be kept on the list as an option.

Sens4Miles

Ok, but is the take rate for the AWD TL so low because customers don't want it or because they can't justify the price difference? Keep in mind, the TL already comes standard with FWD which eliminates the need for AWD in most situations. It doesn't necessarily mean only 15% of customers want AWD. I doubt many customers, if offered, would reject the AWD if it was included at the same price point. If the TL came standard with RWD, what would be the % of AWD purchases in that case? (btw, if you have the numbers for the AWD IS and AWD G37, please post them).

IMO, you're looking at the situation and dissecting it, but you're not looking at the whole picture. Sure, AWD slightly lowers mpg and adds complexity, but it's also a big selling point (all other things being equal). This thread is about whether or not Acura should be dropped or not. If not, then what they need to do to improve their image and sales. No other luxury brand offers AWD standard across their entire lineup (well, Audi comes close). IMO, Acura should focus on their strengths (dependability, simplicity, standard loaded options) and add AWD to that list of standards. Combined with fuel efficiency and wrapped up in a nice pretty package (emphasis on redesigning their current lineup of course) and they might have something that appeals to the masses.

They have their work cut out for them for sure, but all is not lost just yet.

Och

iTrader: (3)

I don't know if thats the case with TL, but AWD sometimes means heavier car and raised suspension. For instance on my wife 335, we looked at the AWD and RWD, and the AWD looked like it was at least 2" higher, creating a huge, fugly wheel gap. I wouldn't want it even if it was less money.

LexFather

Just answer this. What is the point of Acura? If Acura was dropped would anyone miss it besides a few loyal Honda fans? Be honest.

I don't have figures for the IS/G37 etc but I figure it will also likely run in a 10-15% take rate. Audi might be the only brand higher.

Look its been over a decade with the same issues with Acura. We are talking about the same things for ten years. You can't say that about most luxury brands. Honda never was truly interested in making the investment to make Acura anything more than Honda plus.

They are lying about with "smart luxury", it will be a rebadged Civic called a CSX. Well the new Odyessy gets NAV, HIDs and a 6 speed auto, pretty much everything Acura offers. So what is the point of Acura? A rebadged Civic just cements the fact they are Honda plus and not a true luxury brand.

Its not like they are even a brand anywhere but here. They flopped in China. So if Honda wants to save more money, drop Acura, save money on the badges and compete against Hyundai. Acura's market is the USA and Caddy and Buick have passed them in sales. Audi is coming. I rather Acura get dropped and Honda then bring us some damn sports cars back like the ITR, the S2000, etc.

Acura's best product and halo is a car no longer produced, the legendary NSX. That means their best is in the past, not the future. No point in the brand, we all heard the noise, we all heard the talk, we all heard the fanboi arguments and NOTHING CAME. Nothing. Here is a big fat cup of "I told you so" to everyone that wants to slap me.

In 2000 I said Acura is a joke and its 2010 and we are all laughing at the joke called Acura. By 2020 the brand will be completely irrelevant. Kill it now, put the money in producing sporty Hondas. I'm tired of fanbois getting their hopes up over and over and over only to see them dashed over and over .

IS-SV

Acura should offer AWD whenever possible, but that alone can't cure what's keeping the entire division from being competitive as a premium brand.

IS-SV

Although some upmarket car buyers disagreed, a vast majority don't (and the related sales statistic have shown a majority of premium car buyers buy something other than AWD sedans).

What makes the premium car buyer somewhat unique is that fact that they often own 1 or 2 other vehicles. Although it's a nice feature to offer, many premium car buyers already have other vehicles with AWD/4WD, usually a crossover/SUV.

syzygy

I'm sure this has already been discussed, but I'm wondering if Acura will ever stop making supposed luxury sports cars with WWD (wrong wheel drive). Most of you might be more familiar with the term FWD.

gengar

The handling of the 335ix is also atrocious compared to the 335i and is certainly not worthy of anything with a BMW badge (well I suppose the 135i isn't either in that regard). AWD has to be done right, or it's just silly.

Milla...

No they don't need to drop the Acura brand, they need to drop the design team, fire some key folks thats pushing their current mission and business plan for the brand. I remember thinking the same thing of Audi at one time they were so crappy, and now look at'em.

(Cj)

1. AWD is not that strong of a selling point when everyone else already has it. Also AWD isn't much of a differentiators for the brand since even non-premium brands have it. As has been stated Acura added an AWD option to the TL but that did nothing for sales. AWD is a nice option but it should be kept at that: an option. It's funny that you bring up Subaru. Subaru as a brand sells at 1/6th the rate of most mainstream brands. Acura's problem is not only image but dwindling sales. Making AWD standard could hurt sales. As for Audi, Audi doesn't even sell at the rate of Acura (which doesn't sell at the rate of tier one brands). Audi offers FWD on most of their cars as well (A3/A4/A6/etc).

2. The problem with that is, if the CSX (Civic rebadge) cost too much more than a Civic than it won't sell and will be seen as a joke... The CSX's price should match that of a loaded Civic just so that it can be relevant in the market. The CSX's prime competitor as of now would be the Volvo S40 which has a starting price of $26K and standard FWD. In the near future Lincoln and Buick will be coming out with small cars that will be in the same price range (low to mid 20s).

3. The new "hybrid" system Honda's coming out with will be modified IMA. It'll be more or less like what they offered in the now discontinued Accord Hybrid. It's not going to be a full hybrid system like Lexus's and Lincoln's and that's why I reiterate that they just shouldn't even try. It's far too late for Acura to do an "first" and a "first hybrid coupe" would be a non-starter since coupe buyers aren't hybrid buyers and hybrid buyers aren't coupe buyers. Besides Honda's own CR-Z claims that title

4. For the TL's market and price range it's too big. The TL is supposed to be one of Acura's performance sedans, but it's too big to be competitive against other sports sedans.

5. The RL was and is supposed to be a big comfy luxury sedan. It's problems are that it's too small and too expensive. Acura needs a nice luxurious competitor to the Lincoln MKS and Volvo S80 and the TL aint it. The RL should be but it's priced $5-7K too high.

RX300-BV

Acura and Honda is beset with inept and stubborn leadership, a serious lack of direction, and way too conservative business strategy. Much of their lineup is full of old technologies like 5AT's and VTEC engines. Even now, when they finally moving towards 6AT's other luxury makes are pushing 7 and 8 speed autos.

But fortunately for Honda and Acura, they have a lot of blind followers. Geez, there's still 3,000 or so people every month buying the dreadful looking TL. Acura is firmly committed to the beak in the current gen of Acura's. Let's see if Acura learns anything when they refresh the TL.