after 7 years of owning my accord, i realize the dealer was not totally honest...
07-23-10, 12:45 PM
#16
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I've heard many people give advice to negotiate the trade separately from the purchase. It sound good in practice, but try it sometime. AIN"T GONNA HAPPEN!! The 4-square has one purpose, and one purpose only. It's designed to create smoke and mirrors to the consumer. A good salesman can make it appear (by use of the 4-square) that you are getting a great deal on your purchase and your trade. It's laughable, really, because even some very shrewd, knowledgeable people get suckered. I'm intimately aware of all the tricks these guys use. The last time I purchased a new car, I was fully aware of every tactic he was using, from the initial handshake, to the signing on the dotted line.
Here is an excellent article by Edmunds. It's called "Confessions of a Car Salesman". It's a long read but it is absolutely invaluable if you're going to buy a new car. If you've purchased and traded a few cars in your life, you'll recognize every tactic in the article.
Happy reading.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html
Last edited by IS350jet; 07-23-10 at 12:52 PM.
07-23-10, 12:57 PM
#18
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The paint on the hood could be thicker cause the hood is subjected to more extreme heat changes from your engine
Those paint readers are not that great, but the tried and true way to check a car is with your eyes
Those paint readers are not that great, but the tried and true way to check a car is with your eyes
07-23-10, 01:09 PM
#19
It is certainly good advice but it's easier said than done. The salesman will always drill you for a trade. If you tell them you're not negotiating a trade and then spring it on them after the price of the car is negotiated, the deal will more than likely become null and void. They absolutely MUST include the trade in the negotiations. They use the usual 4-square. You've seen it, the 8 1/2 x 11 blank sheet of paper they scribble all over. Top left goes the price of the new car, top right goes your down payment, bottom left goes your trade, and bottom right goes the monthly payment. If you have a trade, they must include it.
I've heard many people give advice to negotiate the trade separately from the purchase. It sound good in practice, but try it sometime. AIN"T GONNA HAPPEN!! The 4-square has one purpose, and one purpose only. It's designed to create smoke and mirrors to the consumer. A good salesman can make it appear (by use of the 4-square) that you are getting a great deal on your purchase and your trade. It's laughable, really, because even some very shrewd, knowledgeable people get suckered. I'm intimately aware of all the tricks these guys use. The last time I purchased a new car, I was fully aware of every tactic he was using, from the initial handshake, to the signing on the dotted line.
Here is an excellent article by Edmunds. It's called "Confessions of a Car Salesman". It's a long read but it is absolutely invaluable if you're going to buy a new car. If you've purchased and traded a few cars in your life, you'll recognize every tactic in the article.
Happy reading.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html
I've heard many people give advice to negotiate the trade separately from the purchase. It sound good in practice, but try it sometime. AIN"T GONNA HAPPEN!! The 4-square has one purpose, and one purpose only. It's designed to create smoke and mirrors to the consumer. A good salesman can make it appear (by use of the 4-square) that you are getting a great deal on your purchase and your trade. It's laughable, really, because even some very shrewd, knowledgeable people get suckered. I'm intimately aware of all the tricks these guys use. The last time I purchased a new car, I was fully aware of every tactic he was using, from the initial handshake, to the signing on the dotted line.
Here is an excellent article by Edmunds. It's called "Confessions of a Car Salesman". It's a long read but it is absolutely invaluable if you're going to buy a new car. If you've purchased and traded a few cars in your life, you'll recognize every tactic in the article.
Happy reading.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html
I've read that article in the past and it's good but I've always felt I do well with my own negotiating skill and I love to play the game.It's a rush for me.
I haven't seen the box thing done in front of me in awhile.After showing interest in a model,usually the first question a salesman will ask is do you have a trade.I never ever say yes.I say no then hit him with it after a cash price is agreed to.Been doing this for years and feel I do well.
The key is know the invoice price,market to dealer incentives and and know your trade's actual book value.
In my area,dealers use the Galves book which can be the same in a few cases or mostly 5%- 10% less than KBB or Edmunds.Got to get that trade in number up.
Two questions I hate are 'how much do you want to pay for the vehicle?
I say $3.The other question is "If you're financing,how much of a payment do you want?
I usually tell the saleman don't ask me those questions before he does.
I'm civil but not too friendly.My wife never wants to go with me when buying a vehicle.
I do have a sales manager friend at a Toyota dealer I get my Toyota's from and sadly don't have to play the game.
Last edited by Joeb427; 07-23-10 at 01:22 PM.
07-23-10, 01:28 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
I dont think its just me but I have never met a decent and honest car sales person. They are usually BS liars who want to screw you on the trade and screw you on the new car if possible. I have come in with edmunds.com regional trade values for a car and they will still tell you they want to give you 2-3k less for your trade . Now that the market sucks for car sales they are out to screw you more. The deals are only on the new cars and even then they will still try to jack the price up any way they can to make up for the dismal sales they are dealing with.
07-23-10, 01:36 PM
#23
Lexus Champion
It is certainly good advice but it's easier said than done. The salesman will always drill you for a trade. If you tell them you're not negotiating a trade and then spring it on them after the price of the car is negotiated, the deal will more than likely become null and void. They absolutely MUST include the trade in the negotiations. They use the usual 4-square. You've seen it, the 8 1/2 x 11 blank sheet of paper they scribble all over. Top left goes the price of the new car, top right goes your down payment, bottom left goes your trade, and bottom right goes the monthly payment. If you have a trade, they must include it.
I've heard many people give advice to negotiate the trade separately from the purchase. It sound good in practice, but try it sometime. AIN"T GONNA HAPPEN!! The 4-square has one purpose, and one purpose only. It's designed to create smoke and mirrors to the consumer. A good salesman can make it appear (by use of the 4-square) that you are getting a great deal on your purchase and your trade. It's laughable, really, because even some very shrewd, knowledgeable people get suckered. I'm intimately aware of all the tricks these guys use. The last time I purchased a new car, I was fully aware of every tactic he was using, from the initial handshake, to the signing on the dotted line.
Here is an excellent article by Edmunds. It's called "Confessions of a Car Salesman". It's a long read but it is absolutely invaluable if you're going to buy a new car. If you've purchased and traded a few cars in your life, you'll recognize every tactic in the article.
Happy reading.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html
I've heard many people give advice to negotiate the trade separately from the purchase. It sound good in practice, but try it sometime. AIN"T GONNA HAPPEN!! The 4-square has one purpose, and one purpose only. It's designed to create smoke and mirrors to the consumer. A good salesman can make it appear (by use of the 4-square) that you are getting a great deal on your purchase and your trade. It's laughable, really, because even some very shrewd, knowledgeable people get suckered. I'm intimately aware of all the tricks these guys use. The last time I purchased a new car, I was fully aware of every tactic he was using, from the initial handshake, to the signing on the dotted line.
Here is an excellent article by Edmunds. It's called "Confessions of a Car Salesman". It's a long read but it is absolutely invaluable if you're going to buy a new car. If you've purchased and traded a few cars in your life, you'll recognize every tactic in the article.
Happy reading.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying...2/article.html
07-23-10, 02:55 PM
#24
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It all comes down to how bad you want that new car. If they take back the deal they offered because you spring the trade on them after the fact (or totally low ball you on the trade as a result), then you walk out. Or--you be straight with your bottom line price. If your bottom line is TRULY your bottom line, then if they jerk you around, you aren't buying.
07-23-10, 10:36 PM
#25
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07-23-10, 10:37 PM
#26
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07-24-10, 12:43 AM
#27
Like what was already mentioned, new cars get damaged all the time during transport and repaired/repainted and sold as new legally. Well, depending on how bad the damage actually was. Anyway, I bet if you did trade the car in, the dealer who pointed out the hood probably was repainted and will give you less money for it WILL NOT the next potential buyer that the hood was repainted so he is discounting the price of the used car.
07-24-10, 05:21 AM
#28
The paint thickness thing is just a club to try to justify a lower trade-in value for your car. You can be assured that when the car goes to auction or gets sold on their used car lot, there will not be a disclaimer that the hood was repainted.
Get a quote on the new car, a quote on the trade, and a quote on the financing. Then go to other dealerships and get the same. Also get a financing quote from your bank and see if you can sell your car privately. You can usually get the best financing rates from a credit union, unless there is a sales incentive. Dealers will often match a higher trade in value or lower vehicle price to get your business.
I used to get worked up about the process, but don't anymore. They want to get the maximum profit out of the deal that each buyer is willing to pay. If the profit drops below a certain point, they will wait and sell to someone else. As a buyer, try not to be rushed, try not to be locked into a certain brand / model / color, and be willing to do the legwork of visiting multiple dealerships, selling your car on your own, and finding your own financing. If you want or need to buy a particular car RIGHT NOW, be prepared to pay extra for that savings of your time and trouble.
Get a quote on the new car, a quote on the trade, and a quote on the financing. Then go to other dealerships and get the same. Also get a financing quote from your bank and see if you can sell your car privately. You can usually get the best financing rates from a credit union, unless there is a sales incentive. Dealers will often match a higher trade in value or lower vehicle price to get your business.
I used to get worked up about the process, but don't anymore. They want to get the maximum profit out of the deal that each buyer is willing to pay. If the profit drops below a certain point, they will wait and sell to someone else. As a buyer, try not to be rushed, try not to be locked into a certain brand / model / color, and be willing to do the legwork of visiting multiple dealerships, selling your car on your own, and finding your own financing. If you want or need to buy a particular car RIGHT NOW, be prepared to pay extra for that savings of your time and trouble.
07-24-10, 05:54 AM
#29
in addition to all that's been said...
paint thicknesses on all cars have variations depending on which panel it is, with some panels supposed to be thicker/thinner than others. how did the guy with the tester know what the factory specified thickness for the hood of your '03 accord was? tell him to stuff it.
paint thicknesses on all cars have variations depending on which panel it is, with some panels supposed to be thicker/thinner than others. how did the guy with the tester know what the factory specified thickness for the hood of your '03 accord was? tell him to stuff it.
07-24-10, 06:50 AM
#30
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in addition to all that's been said...
paint thicknesses on all cars have variations depending on which panel it is, with some panels supposed to be thicker/thinner than others. how did the guy with the tester know what the factory specified thickness for the hood of your '03 accord was? tell him to stuff it.
paint thicknesses on all cars have variations depending on which panel it is, with some panels supposed to be thicker/thinner than others. how did the guy with the tester know what the factory specified thickness for the hood of your '03 accord was? tell him to stuff it.
And as far as the other topic points, its a GAME you should always win... if they try to change a deal after you mention you'd like to see your trade added in...WALK