mmarshall

Sure. Anytime.

It's not bad-looking for a 4-door...one of the sleekest-looking ones I've seen. It's almost as sleek-looking as a 2-door 911. And, (though this is subjective) it's sure better-looking, IMO, than the Mercedes CLS or VW CC....which also tried coupe-styling with a 4-door.

That slightly-bulbous rear end on the Panamera you're talking about was probably done for rear head room.....and it works. A 911-shaped rear probably wouldn't have allowed it to acomodate adults.


If you're used to driving Boxster/Caymans and 911s, the Panamera will feel larger, heavier, and more nose-heavy, which, of course, it is.


Agreed on most of your points above (as I stated in the review). I'll hold more comment on the A7 until I see it....I don't know much about it right now. As for a Lexus competitor, I'm not sure if there is a market for it right now. The GS and LS have both been quite successful, and I'm not sure Lexus would want to do something that would impact either of their sales, though, of course, neither the GS or LS is as sport-oriented as the Panamera.

mmarshall

Thanks, Russ.

Part of it depends on tires. AWD alone isn't necessarily a magic wand in bad weather if you have summer-only, ultra-high-performance rubber with little or no wet-weather traction (those tires also can wear very quickly). You'll want to go to all-season or winter tires as well.

For a daily driver, I agree with you.....I'd also probably chose an Audi Quattro over a Porsche. Audis, of course, are not cheap to own either, but Porsches can be prohibitively expensive for parts/service, when not free or the warranty expires.

mmarshall

Thanks for bringing up the Quattroporte as a potential competitor, Och...I had forgotten about that one. And, of course, expensive as it is, it is cheaper than the mega-dollar Aston Martin Rapide.

IS-SV

I'm willing to go out on a limb and speculate that Porsche will do some styling updates to partially address the ugly rear end before the total restyle scheduled for many years from now.

speedflex

no! nein! nyet!

RA40

iTrader: (6)

Thanks for the review.

I'm one of those who at first didn't like the Panamera though after seeing them up close, it has grown on me. A P-car buddy has been telling me to take one out and let him know what my impressions are. This review motivates me to set foot into a dealer. Past visits to Porsche I felt they were pretty snobbish. The sales guy warmed up a bit after talking to me about a 997 variant but overall, quite reserved as if we were both sizing each other up.

mmarshall

I agree that a total restyle will (probably) take quite some time....like it or not, that's just the way that Porsche operates. Once they introduce a new model, they tend to keep the general looks around for decades, instead of redoing it every 4 or 5 years like Honda or Toyota. Porsche, of course, is a relatively small company, and, even considering the high prices of its vehicles, simply doesn't have the extra capital tor frequent re-tooling....and much of the money it has left over goes into racing and Formula 1.

But, over and above that, it begs the question of how much the Panamera rear end really needs to be re-done. Styling, of course, is subjective...your opinion is as good as anyone else's. But, if you consider that Porsche was trying to do what is essentially a front-engined, 5-door hatchback with Cayman/911-type styling, I think they did an excellent job overall. Yes, the rear end does look a little more bloated than the Cayman/911, but we're not talking Honda Crosstour or BMW 550 GT here. And, by keeping the rear roofline higher than in the Cayman/911, with less droop-down, they not only increased cargo area in the rear (something that the 911, with its rear-engine, doesn't have at all), but rear-seat headroom as well. Even at my rather large size (6' 2"", 270 lb), I can fit in the back of the Panamera with my baseball cap with comfort......something I can't say for some other 4-doors, even those with more-conservative, SUV-type, higher rooflines.

mmarshall

Sure...anytime.

It's about as good-looking, IMO, as a 4-door Porsche can get.

Yes, Porsche dealers (along with BMW and Mercedes) were once the cream of the crop when it came to snobbishness and being aristocratic. Even today, the prices they charge for parts/repair/service can be outrageous. But the general attutude towards customers coming in, looking at new cars, has, in general, improved quite a bit in, say, the last 10 years or so. There are a few snobs left, but, in general, things are much better in that department. They are finding out, like Saturn and Lexus did did back in the 1990's, that it is easier to sell cars with honey than it is with vinegar.

I see you are in CA. Like here in the D.C. area, there should be a number of Porsche dealers to choose from, especially in SoCal, if you are in that region. SoCal and the D.C. area are the two largest new-car markets in the country. If you don't like the way one Porsche shop treats you, just try another. And, even in the same dealership, salespeople often vary quite a bit in their customer atitudes...if one doesn't meet your expectations, the one right next to him or her might.

PhilipMSPT

iTrader: (5)

Porsche went practical? Function over form? Seems odd for a brand like Porsche.

But all of the reviews that I have read about the Panamera's rear seat comfort have all been quite positive for what it is.

Does the rear 3/4 design affect sales? I don't think we can ever answer that question objectively. We know it's pretty roomy back there, but we also know that the eye can see the visual disproportion.

I guess it has to work for now...

mmarshall

After the Cayenne, some years ago, shocked everyone (including me), the notion of a Porsche 5-door hatchback with Cayman/911 styling seems almost superfluous in comparison.


And you can add my review to that, too. While not a Town-Car limo, I too, found the back seat relatively roomy, plush, and comfortable, even at my size.

RA40

iTrader: (6)

One of my initial concerns for this car was a reasonable "trunk" space. I've preferred the traditional trunk and this hatch back was not completely to my liking. As my buddy relayed, I might be quite surprised what it will hold. Folding the seats he joked with me that I go to Costco and buy a flat screen. 44 cuft I vaguely recollect so it would work as a Costco shopping car. This pales the 460 though 18 cuft is quite good.

He knows I'm a Lexus guy so he said take the 460L out first than drive the Panamera. The options really rack it up where in the 460, it is near standard. Playing with Porsche's configurator, my preferences came in just a tick from $90K usually hovering at $86K in a minimalist sense. That is a whole lot of $$ and for as long as I keep cars, this still seems like a hard swallow. I'm unsure as a long term driver.

A Panamera is doubtful but this is an amusing thought for the time being. I do have uses for the 2+3 seating in the rear which in this case the Panamera will not accommodate.

Once I build up some nerve, I'll head in and see about a test drive.

IS-SV

I found it to be roomy enough too. But I know a key trick (also used on the CLS) is to mount the rear seat cushion very low when compared to S-class, 7 series, LS.

mmarshall

Check dealer stock first, either on-line in the dealer's web-site, or by calling them. You'll want to make sure they have Panameras in stock, first.

Wear some nice clothes, look good, and go there calm and with an air of professionalism. Show them, without being arrogant or ostentatious, that you have some idea of what you are doing....and saying. Dealerships that sell expensive vehicles usually like people that look, act, talk, and drive maturely....they know that people like that can usually be trusted behind the wheel, and won't abuse their vehicles.

mmarshall

Scalloping-out the backs of the front seats also helps with knee room, but I didn't see any of that in the Panamera.

IS-SV

Most of that is not needed if you show up in a nice car. In fact on the weekends most qualified customers will not be wearing nice clothes or looking especially good. The best Porsche salespeople can see through the veneer. A bit too much stereotyping here.