BMW Dealer Crashes M5, Tries Screwing Owner Out Of $27K
09-04-10, 12:41 AM
#47
I agree completely. It is beyond ridiculous to think b/c you own a certain car that allows people to maybe drive it how they please without your consent.
That is preposterous.
Doesn't matter what you own. It could be a basic Sentra it should be treated with respect by the employees.
They are trained and employees sign paperwork where there are consequences for breaking rules.
As you stated this dealership seems to be one of those that think they are above customers and can do as they please.
That is preposterous. Doesn't matter what you own. It could be a basic Sentra it should be treated with respect by the employees.
They are trained and employees sign paperwork where there are consequences for breaking rules.
As you stated this dealership seems to be one of those that think they are above customers and can do as they please.
09-04-10, 07:29 AM
#48
Out of Warranty
Whether legitimate consumer complaints have any effect when delivered at the regional or national level depends entirely on the culture of service within the organization. When the national rep claims not to be able to do anything about his franchisees, he is either a poor manager or is lying.
Case in point: In 1974 I purchased a new boat - a 24' SeaRay with a large Mercruiser V8. The warranty included a 50-hour inspection of both the engine and the outdrive that included compression tests and a complete teardown of the outdrive and gearbox, inspection and re-shimming to set gear lash. I had a plastic card provided by the manufacturer - about the size of a credit card - that was keyed to the SN of my engine and drive. At the 50-hour mark, I was to return to the dealer, present the card, and get my free service.
At the time I had been an active member of the Houston Power Squadron, and an instructor in seamanship and mechanics classes - about a dozen friends in HPS had similar SeaRays with the Mercruiser powerplants, and we knew service was an issue locally. With a circle of friends with the same combination of manufacturers, plus another member over in Louisiana from whom I actually purchased the boat, I was fortunate to be surrounded by a large cadre of experts. We had discovered a great independent mechanic who did all of our service here in Houston, but only an authorized dealer could honor the 50-hour inspection card. Because the service was worth about $500, I took the boat to a large local dealer - after being instructed by several of my friends to mark every bolt that was to be removed for the inspection process with a file.
When I picked up my boat three days later, the first thing I noticed was a huge oil stain on the teak portion of the cockpit sole, there was oil in my spotless bilge, and it was apparent that whoever changed the oil and filter simply dumped the oil in the bilge and tried to remove it through the transom drain. There were even oily footprints all over the cockpit - but that wasn't all.
A quick inspection of my file marks revealed the lower unit had never been touched. Every file mark on the drive's castle nuts lined up perfectly with the one on each stud. The dealer was going to turn in my card to Mercruiser for a nice fat $500 check having done nothing but change my oil. Now Mercruiser builds a top-notch outdrive, but it is as finicky as a Ferrari for maintenance. It has the tolerances of a Swiss watch and any out-of-spec clearances will quickly produce the dreaded $5000 graunch that is so much worse when you hear it 30 miles offshore.
Very long story short, after calls both to SeaRay's and Mercruiser's corporate offices, I had the work performed by the mechanic of my choice for which Mercruiser paid the tab, and the dealer who did such shoddy work was forced to replace the center (teak) section of my cockpit sole (provided by SeaRay) and scrub the bilges clean and bright to my satisfaction.
Then that big dealer lost their Mercruiser franchise. Now this was a big deal because the dealer had been a Mercury/Mercruiser distributor for nearly thirty years and was a major vendor for them in the Houston area. It seems I wasn't alone in my complaint - this dealer had been in hot water for years with the companies he represented, and a handful of complaints like mine within a couple of months finally got his ticket yanked. A couple of well-funded dealerships moved in to take up the slack, and although the dealer moved out of town, he never got his franchise back, ending up selling locally made boats on consignment before mercifully going out of business a few years later.
The point of the story is this: Keep a watchful eye on your dealer's performance, be sure you are getting the warranty and service work you paid for, and don't just complain, DOCUMENT every transaction, especially with a shady dealer or suspicious service department. Don't start a fight, don't make threats, just be pleasant and professional, but also be wary. THEN if there is a problem, go to the zone or national office with enough irrefutable evidence to support your claim. If you just call them up to complain, you may get shuffled aside, but if you can show documentary and photographic evidence to back your story, offices up the chain of command will pay attention. After all, they can't afford a cheating dealer whose work may end up in a series of big warranty claims. That's too expensive for them and often it is best from a business standpoint to either correct the problem or cut their losses.
Case in point: In 1974 I purchased a new boat - a 24' SeaRay with a large Mercruiser V8. The warranty included a 50-hour inspection of both the engine and the outdrive that included compression tests and a complete teardown of the outdrive and gearbox, inspection and re-shimming to set gear lash. I had a plastic card provided by the manufacturer - about the size of a credit card - that was keyed to the SN of my engine and drive. At the 50-hour mark, I was to return to the dealer, present the card, and get my free service.
At the time I had been an active member of the Houston Power Squadron, and an instructor in seamanship and mechanics classes - about a dozen friends in HPS had similar SeaRays with the Mercruiser powerplants, and we knew service was an issue locally. With a circle of friends with the same combination of manufacturers, plus another member over in Louisiana from whom I actually purchased the boat, I was fortunate to be surrounded by a large cadre of experts. We had discovered a great independent mechanic who did all of our service here in Houston, but only an authorized dealer could honor the 50-hour inspection card. Because the service was worth about $500, I took the boat to a large local dealer - after being instructed by several of my friends to mark every bolt that was to be removed for the inspection process with a file.
When I picked up my boat three days later, the first thing I noticed was a huge oil stain on the teak portion of the cockpit sole, there was oil in my spotless bilge, and it was apparent that whoever changed the oil and filter simply dumped the oil in the bilge and tried to remove it through the transom drain. There were even oily footprints all over the cockpit - but that wasn't all.
A quick inspection of my file marks revealed the lower unit had never been touched. Every file mark on the drive's castle nuts lined up perfectly with the one on each stud. The dealer was going to turn in my card to Mercruiser for a nice fat $500 check having done nothing but change my oil. Now Mercruiser builds a top-notch outdrive, but it is as finicky as a Ferrari for maintenance. It has the tolerances of a Swiss watch and any out-of-spec clearances will quickly produce the dreaded $5000 graunch that is so much worse when you hear it 30 miles offshore.
Very long story short, after calls both to SeaRay's and Mercruiser's corporate offices, I had the work performed by the mechanic of my choice for which Mercruiser paid the tab, and the dealer who did such shoddy work was forced to replace the center (teak) section of my cockpit sole (provided by SeaRay) and scrub the bilges clean and bright to my satisfaction.
Then that big dealer lost their Mercruiser franchise. Now this was a big deal because the dealer had been a Mercury/Mercruiser distributor for nearly thirty years and was a major vendor for them in the Houston area. It seems I wasn't alone in my complaint - this dealer had been in hot water for years with the companies he represented, and a handful of complaints like mine within a couple of months finally got his ticket yanked. A couple of well-funded dealerships moved in to take up the slack, and although the dealer moved out of town, he never got his franchise back, ending up selling locally made boats on consignment before mercifully going out of business a few years later.
The point of the story is this: Keep a watchful eye on your dealer's performance, be sure you are getting the warranty and service work you paid for, and don't just complain, DOCUMENT every transaction, especially with a shady dealer or suspicious service department. Don't start a fight, don't make threats, just be pleasant and professional, but also be wary. THEN if there is a problem, go to the zone or national office with enough irrefutable evidence to support your claim. If you just call them up to complain, you may get shuffled aside, but if you can show documentary and photographic evidence to back your story, offices up the chain of command will pay attention. After all, they can't afford a cheating dealer whose work may end up in a series of big warranty claims. That's too expensive for them and often it is best from a business standpoint to either correct the problem or cut their losses.
09-04-10, 03:02 PM
#50
Lexus Champion
I feel bad for the owner of the M5 and I hope they make it right for him.
.
I'm in car business for 20 years, 7 years with Toyota and 13 years with Lexus. I've test drive about 10 customer cars a day with zero accident. I don't care if it's a Toyota Tercel, ES250, IS-F or LS600h, I always drive them like they're my own cars and respected to the owner of the vehicles.
A simple rule of thump when get into the customer car are, turn off the radio,leave all the personal belonging the way they are, only opened the trunk,glove box or center console if I have to. You will not believe the stuff customers leave inside their cars when they dropped it off for service. For example, pistol, computer, $$$$ I mean thousand dollar in cash or car title. I have to tell the lady to keep the car title at home,not in the car.
It's all about respect and it's o.k to drive a very expensive car because not all of the dealer employee are "stupid *** kids".
.
I'm in car business for 20 years, 7 years with Toyota and 13 years with Lexus. I've test drive about 10 customer cars a day with zero accident. I don't care if it's a Toyota Tercel, ES250, IS-F or LS600h, I always drive them like they're my own cars and respected to the owner of the vehicles.
A simple rule of thump when get into the customer car are, turn off the radio,leave all the personal belonging the way they are, only opened the trunk,glove box or center console if I have to. You will not believe the stuff customers leave inside their cars when they dropped it off for service. For example, pistol, computer, $$$$ I mean thousand dollar in cash or car title. I have to tell the lady to keep the car title at home,not in the car.
It's all about respect and it's o.k to drive a very expensive car because not all of the dealer employee are "stupid *** kids".
09-04-10, 04:06 PM
#51
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
09-04-10, 05:43 PM
#52
Lexus Champion
Whether legitimate consumer complaints have any effect when delivered at the regional or national level depends entirely on the culture of service within the organization. When the national rep claims not to be able to do anything about his franchisees, he is either a poor manager or is lying.
Case in point: In 1974 I purchased a new boat - a 24' SeaRay with a large Mercruiser V8. The warranty included a 50-hour inspection of both the engine and the outdrive that included compression tests and a complete teardown of the outdrive and gearbox, inspection and re-shimming to set gear lash. I had a plastic card provided by the manufacturer - about the size of a credit card - that was keyed to the SN of my engine and drive. At the 50-hour mark, I was to return to the dealer, present the card, and get my free service.
At the time I had been an active member of the Houston Power Squadron, and an instructor in seamanship and mechanics classes - about a dozen friends in HPS had similar SeaRays with the Mercruiser powerplants, and we knew service was an issue locally. With a circle of friends with the same combination of manufacturers, plus another member over in Louisiana from whom I actually purchased the boat, I was fortunate to be surrounded by a large cadre of experts. We had discovered a great independent mechanic who did all of our service here in Houston, but only an authorized dealer could honor the 50-hour inspection card. Because the service was worth about $500, I took the boat to a large local dealer - after being instructed by several of my friends to mark every bolt that was to be removed for the inspection process with a file.
When I picked up my boat three days later, the first thing I noticed was a huge oil stain on the teak portion of the cockpit sole, there was oil in my spotless bilge, and it was apparent that whoever changed the oil and filter simply dumped the oil in the bilge and tried to remove it through the transom drain. There were even oily footprints all over the cockpit - but that wasn't all.
A quick inspection of my file marks revealed the lower unit had never been touched. Every file mark on the drive's castle nuts lined up perfectly with the one on each stud. The dealer was going to turn in my card to Mercruiser for a nice fat $500 check having done nothing but change my oil. Now Mercruiser builds a top-notch outdrive, but it is as finicky as a Ferrari for maintenance. It has the tolerances of a Swiss watch and any out-of-spec clearances will quickly produce the dreaded $5000 graunch that is so much worse when you hear it 30 miles offshore.
Very long story short, after calls both to SeaRay's and Mercruiser's corporate offices, I had the work performed by the mechanic of my choice for which Mercruiser paid the tab, and the dealer who did such shoddy work was forced to replace the center (teak) section of my cockpit sole (provided by SeaRay) and scrub the bilges clean and bright to my satisfaction.
Then that big dealer lost their Mercruiser franchise. Now this was a big deal because the dealer had been a Mercury/Mercruiser distributor for nearly thirty years and was a major vendor for them in the Houston area. It seems I wasn't alone in my complaint - this dealer had been in hot water for years with the companies he represented, and a handful of complaints like mine within a couple of months finally got his ticket yanked. A couple of well-funded dealerships moved in to take up the slack, and although the dealer moved out of town, he never got his franchise back, ending up selling locally made boats on consignment before mercifully going out of business a few years later.
The point of the story is this: Keep a watchful eye on your dealer's performance, be sure you are getting the warranty and service work you paid for, and don't just complain, DOCUMENT every transaction, especially with a shady dealer or suspicious service department. Don't start a fight, don't make threats, just be pleasant and professional, but also be wary. THEN if there is a problem, go to the zone or national office with enough irrefutable evidence to support your claim. If you just call them up to complain, you may get shuffled aside, but if you can show documentary and photographic evidence to back your story, offices up the chain of command will pay attention. After all, they can't afford a cheating dealer whose work may end up in a series of big warranty claims. That's too expensive for them and often it is best from a business standpoint to either correct the problem or cut their losses.
Case in point: In 1974 I purchased a new boat - a 24' SeaRay with a large Mercruiser V8. The warranty included a 50-hour inspection of both the engine and the outdrive that included compression tests and a complete teardown of the outdrive and gearbox, inspection and re-shimming to set gear lash. I had a plastic card provided by the manufacturer - about the size of a credit card - that was keyed to the SN of my engine and drive. At the 50-hour mark, I was to return to the dealer, present the card, and get my free service.
At the time I had been an active member of the Houston Power Squadron, and an instructor in seamanship and mechanics classes - about a dozen friends in HPS had similar SeaRays with the Mercruiser powerplants, and we knew service was an issue locally. With a circle of friends with the same combination of manufacturers, plus another member over in Louisiana from whom I actually purchased the boat, I was fortunate to be surrounded by a large cadre of experts. We had discovered a great independent mechanic who did all of our service here in Houston, but only an authorized dealer could honor the 50-hour inspection card. Because the service was worth about $500, I took the boat to a large local dealer - after being instructed by several of my friends to mark every bolt that was to be removed for the inspection process with a file.
When I picked up my boat three days later, the first thing I noticed was a huge oil stain on the teak portion of the cockpit sole, there was oil in my spotless bilge, and it was apparent that whoever changed the oil and filter simply dumped the oil in the bilge and tried to remove it through the transom drain. There were even oily footprints all over the cockpit - but that wasn't all.
A quick inspection of my file marks revealed the lower unit had never been touched. Every file mark on the drive's castle nuts lined up perfectly with the one on each stud. The dealer was going to turn in my card to Mercruiser for a nice fat $500 check having done nothing but change my oil. Now Mercruiser builds a top-notch outdrive, but it is as finicky as a Ferrari for maintenance. It has the tolerances of a Swiss watch and any out-of-spec clearances will quickly produce the dreaded $5000 graunch that is so much worse when you hear it 30 miles offshore.
Very long story short, after calls both to SeaRay's and Mercruiser's corporate offices, I had the work performed by the mechanic of my choice for which Mercruiser paid the tab, and the dealer who did such shoddy work was forced to replace the center (teak) section of my cockpit sole (provided by SeaRay) and scrub the bilges clean and bright to my satisfaction.
Then that big dealer lost their Mercruiser franchise. Now this was a big deal because the dealer had been a Mercury/Mercruiser distributor for nearly thirty years and was a major vendor for them in the Houston area. It seems I wasn't alone in my complaint - this dealer had been in hot water for years with the companies he represented, and a handful of complaints like mine within a couple of months finally got his ticket yanked. A couple of well-funded dealerships moved in to take up the slack, and although the dealer moved out of town, he never got his franchise back, ending up selling locally made boats on consignment before mercifully going out of business a few years later.
The point of the story is this: Keep a watchful eye on your dealer's performance, be sure you are getting the warranty and service work you paid for, and don't just complain, DOCUMENT every transaction, especially with a shady dealer or suspicious service department. Don't start a fight, don't make threats, just be pleasant and professional, but also be wary. THEN if there is a problem, go to the zone or national office with enough irrefutable evidence to support your claim. If you just call them up to complain, you may get shuffled aside, but if you can show documentary and photographic evidence to back your story, offices up the chain of command will pay attention. After all, they can't afford a cheating dealer whose work may end up in a series of big warranty claims. That's too expensive for them and often it is best from a business standpoint to either correct the problem or cut their losses.
09-05-10, 09:17 AM
#55
Pole Position
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: TX
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Looks like it is starting to make mainstream news:
http://www.bmwblog.com/2010/09/03/bm...r-for-service/
http://www.bmwblog.com/2010/09/03/bm...r-for-service/
09-17-10, 08:35 AM
#56
Guest
Posts: n/a
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...ml#post1906512
Originally Posted by Owner of wrecked M5
As you probably guessed the car has been written off as totaled. There is still no response from the crash dealership and I don't expect there to be one. They never did the right thing from the beginning so why would they now. Really bothers me how someone can not care about destroying your your property and then expect you to be happy with a low ball insurance settlement. There has not been a settlement by the way. I would like to say that BMWNA is extremely unhappy with the crash dealership and have been very supportive. However the extent of their support is not clear at this time. BMWNA has stated to me that they are doing an internal investigation into the accident and this dealerships practices. I will let you know more when I know.
Thank you for all the support!
Tommy
As you probably guessed the car has been written off as totaled. There is still no response from the crash dealership and I don't expect there to be one. They never did the right thing from the beginning so why would they now. Really bothers me how someone can not care about destroying your your property and then expect you to be happy with a low ball insurance settlement. There has not been a settlement by the way. I would like to say that BMWNA is extremely unhappy with the crash dealership and have been very supportive. However the extent of their support is not clear at this time. BMWNA has stated to me that they are doing an internal investigation into the accident and this dealerships practices. I will let you know more when I know.
Thank you for all the support!
Tommy
09-17-10, 10:17 AM
#59
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
It's not surprising. BMW NAs lack of control over their dealerships is the reason I left BMW after 4 consecutive BMWs and switched to Lexus. Braman BMW in Miami really sucked during my experience.
http://www.yelp.com/biz/braman-bmw-a...t_by=date_desc
The only reason people buy BMWs is the cars are so good. The appalling dealerships, the poor long-term reliability, and the high depreciation are the things you have too put up with to be behind the wheel of the ultimate driving machine!
http://www.yelp.com/biz/braman-bmw-a...t_by=date_desc
The only reason people buy BMWs is the cars are so good. The appalling dealerships, the poor long-term reliability, and the high depreciation are the things you have too put up with to be behind the wheel of the ultimate driving machine!
09-17-10, 10:54 AM
#60
It's not surprising. BMW NAs lack of control over their dealerships is the reason I left BMW after 4 consecutive BMWs and switched to Lexus. Braman BMW in Miami really sucked during my experience.
http://www.yelp.com/biz/braman-bmw-a...t_by=date_desc
The only reason people buy BMWs is the cars are so good. The appalling dealerships, the poor long-term reliability, and the high depreciation are the things you have too put up with to be behind the wheel of the ultimate driving machine!
http://www.yelp.com/biz/braman-bmw-a...t_by=date_desc
The only reason people buy BMWs is the cars are so good. The appalling dealerships, the poor long-term reliability, and the high depreciation are the things you have too put up with to be behind the wheel of the ultimate driving machine!