New Passat debuts (blaaaaand)
05-25-11, 12:27 PM
#46
Lexus Champion
Volkswagen has a goal of being the largest auto manufacturer. To do this, it has to conquer North America, Volkwagen's last frontier. The problems that have prevented Volkswagen from selling in great numbers in North America are:
1. High prices - The high costs of assembly in Europe, caused in part by the high value of the Euro, has meant that Volkswagen could not sell at competitive, mass-market prices in North America. To justify the high prices, Volkswagen loads up the cars it sells here with "luxury" items. Volkswagen was perceived by some here as a premium brand, further cutting into possible sales.
2. Smaller sizes - Unlike Honda and Toyota, Volkswagen's cars had not been sized right for North America. Honda sells a smaller Accord in Europe and a larger one here. Toyota sells the large Camry here but does not sell it in Western Europe, selling the smaller Avensis mid-size car instead.
Up until now, Volkswagen has essentially been ignoring North America. It can no longer afford to do so if it wants to greatly increase sales here (from 256,000 in 2010 eventually to 800,000). It has to drop prices and build right-sized cars for North America. VW can drop prices by building North American cars in North America.
They have been building Jettas in Mexico for many years now but that was not enough; it was still too European (where they are more willing to pay high prices for small cars than we in North America). They also had to "cheapen" it by decontenting it and using lower-cost components (door hinges is one example and lower-quality interior materials is another example).
The compact car market (Jetta, Civic, Corolla) has smaller margins. Margins are greater on mid-size cars (Passat, Accord, Camry) so VW can afford to increase the size of the North American Passat, drop its prices and still make a profit, without having to cheapen it too much. Let's hope that it was not cheapened too much, like the Jetta was.
1. High prices - The high costs of assembly in Europe, caused in part by the high value of the Euro, has meant that Volkswagen could not sell at competitive, mass-market prices in North America. To justify the high prices, Volkswagen loads up the cars it sells here with "luxury" items. Volkswagen was perceived by some here as a premium brand, further cutting into possible sales.
2. Smaller sizes - Unlike Honda and Toyota, Volkswagen's cars had not been sized right for North America. Honda sells a smaller Accord in Europe and a larger one here. Toyota sells the large Camry here but does not sell it in Western Europe, selling the smaller Avensis mid-size car instead.
Up until now, Volkswagen has essentially been ignoring North America. It can no longer afford to do so if it wants to greatly increase sales here (from 256,000 in 2010 eventually to 800,000). It has to drop prices and build right-sized cars for North America. VW can drop prices by building North American cars in North America.
They have been building Jettas in Mexico for many years now but that was not enough; it was still too European (where they are more willing to pay high prices for small cars than we in North America). They also had to "cheapen" it by decontenting it and using lower-cost components (door hinges is one example and lower-quality interior materials is another example).
The compact car market (Jetta, Civic, Corolla) has smaller margins. Margins are greater on mid-size cars (Passat, Accord, Camry) so VW can afford to increase the size of the North American Passat, drop its prices and still make a profit, without having to cheapen it too much. Let's hope that it was not cheapened too much, like the Jetta was.
05-25-11, 01:47 PM
#47
05-25-11, 03:14 PM
#48
Its not handsome it bland as a 1990 Camry or Impala. Its not understated, its bland and for people in the witness protection program. The new Jetta and Passat interior is cheap, stylized pics can't help it. Call a spade a spade.
If the Passat is handsome, the Camry is the greatest auto design ever
If the Passat is handsome, the Camry is the greatest auto design ever
05-26-11, 05:00 AM
#51
Price
Earlier this year Leftlane brought you the 1st official and live images of the all-new, heavily redesigned U.S. market Passat straight from the show floor of the Detroit Auto show.
The only thing missing at the time in Volkswagen’s press materials was pricing for its Camry/Accord/Fusion/Sonata/Malibu-fighting Passat. Today, we have that pricing, including the staggeringly lower than last year’s base price of $19,995 plus $770 destination (or $20,765 for all intents and purposes).
So how did VW do it? For starters the new model is packaged quite differently, following the same plan as the newer, cheaper and less sophisticated Jetta (compared to the previous generation). As a result, VW is able to grab buyer’s attention with markedly lower starting prices, along with wider price ranges across the model lineup.
The base Passat will for example take a step or 2 backwards from the standard 2.0-liter turbocharged engine and direct-shift gearbox (DSG) that came as standard equipment for the previous model year, instead starting with a naturally aspirated 2.5-liter 5-cylinder that churns out just 170 horsepower and 177 lb-ft of torque, matched to a 5-speed manual transmission.
While a directly comparable 2012 model cannot be specced out due to the total removal of the 2.0T engine, the next-closest option would come from the mid-level 2.5-liter TDI good for 140 horsepower and 236 lb-ft of torque, which starts at $28,665 – slightly more than a comparable 2010 model.
Models range from a 2.5 S base model with a manual transmission and a $20,765 sticker price (add $2,695 for an automatic), to $30,665 for the SEL Premium automatic which still has the 2.5-liter 5-cylinder engine. Stepping up to the TDI will put the base price at $26,765 for a manual, rising to $32,965 for the SEL Premium TDI. The Passat range is topped by a 3.6-liter V6, also known as the VR6, which boasts 280 horsepower and 258 lb-ft of torque, starting at $29,765, and topping out at $33,720 before individual options.
All told, Passat is available in 15 different preset package/engine combinations. VW says that the main reason it was able to bring the price down was not the change to packaging or features, but rather the switch to local production at VW’s new assembly plant in Chattanooga, Tennessee.
Compared to the outgoing model, the new Passat is considerably different and larger and it shares little more than a name with its European counterpart. The changes also continue underhood, and in total, VW believes it has found the right formula for a successful midsize sedan in the American market.
Styling
Looking much like a larger, wider Jetta, the Passat was penned by VW designer Walter de Silva. It measures in at 191.7 inches long and rides on a 110.4 inch wheelbase.
It’s what is under the hood that counts
Part of the formula that VW is banking on to move some metal comes from a new engine lineup that eschews the traditional use of a 4-cylinder engine as the base models for a 2.5-liter 5-cylinder engine, followed by a 2.0-liter TDI clean diesel and topped off with a sporty 3.6-liter VR6 engine.
The base 2.5-liter will be good for 170 horsepower and 177 lb-ft of torque, and comes standard with a 5-speed manual transmission. For those who prefer not to row their own gears, VW also has an optional 6-speed automatic available.
For those willing to drop a little more coin for a lot more fuel economy, the 2.0-liter TDI is certainly the engine of choice in the Passat. The only diesel in its segment, the Passat TDI is expected to net 43 mpg on the highway, according to VW. Combined with a fuel tank just short of 20 gallons, VW says it should have no problem driving 800 miles on a single tank of fuel. Rated at 140 horsepower and 236 lb-ft. of torque, the 4-cylinder diesel engine is seemingly ubiquitous in VW’s lineup. A 6-speed stick will be standard, while a 6-speed DSG dual clutch automatic will be optional.
Most Passats will probably be delivered with 4 or 5-cylinder engines, but VW will also offer a 3.6-liter VR6 rated at 280 horsepower and 258 lb-ft. of torque. VW estimates fuel economy at 28 mpg on the highway. The VR6 will be exclusively mated to VW’s DSG automatic transmission.
Equipment content
Although it might look and feel like a larger Jetta, VW promises that the Passat is a premium offering. Its wide doors reveal an especially spacious interior, including a huge rear seat area.
Three trim levels will be on offer – S, SE and SEL. Look for more details to arrive closer to launch, but volume SE models will be swathed in VW’s leather-like vinyl and come with switchgear used in the Jetta. Soft touch and hard plastic surfaces abound, although SELs come with richer-looking leather, synthetic suede and real wood trim.
Standard 17-inch wheels can be upgraded to 18s and the Passat will be among the 1st VWs to offer the automaker’s new Fender-developed audio system.
Look for the 2012 Passat to begin arriving in dealers this fall.
05-26-11, 08:44 AM
#53
Lexus Fanatic
I actually like the conservative exterior design.....I am not a fan of the Aero/Jelly-Bean or swept-back look. It looks far better, IMO, than its corporate CC brother.
But.....although you can't necesarily tell from the images, I hope that VW has not downgraded the interior with cheap materials like it did with the latest Jetta. The new Jetta has received a lot of criticism for both its downgraded interior and chassis in the auto press, including Consumer Reports.
But.....although you can't necesarily tell from the images, I hope that VW has not downgraded the interior with cheap materials like it did with the latest Jetta. The new Jetta has received a lot of criticism for both its downgraded interior and chassis in the auto press, including Consumer Reports.
05-26-11, 09:03 AM
#54
Guest
Posts: n/a
Yeah the only advantage I see with this car is the diesel and if someone wants one. I can totally understand someone preferring a VW to a Hyundai even if it has less content, Hyundai still has an image problem with many (as does VW).
05-26-11, 10:27 AM
#55
Lexus Champion
But.....although you can't necesarily tell from the images, I hope that VW has not downgraded the interior with cheap materials like it did with the latest Jetta. The new Jetta has received a lot of criticism for both its downgraded interior and chassis in the auto press, including Consumer Reports.
05-26-11, 11:25 AM
#56
well if you read carefully, diesel is more expensive than before actually. It starts at 29k, and honestly I would not pay 29k for that diesel over various hybrids.
05-26-11, 11:26 AM
#57
Lexus Fanatic
LOL. I have so many friends who were burned BIG TIME by VW vehicles a few years back. All of the swore they would never even look at one again. They all agreed that it was the interior design and quality that got them to buy. The VW interiors of the past just looked more refined than some of the plasticky stuff from Honda, Nissan, etc
05-26-11, 12:28 PM
#58
Lexus Champion
It’s what is under the hood that counts
Part of the formula that VW is banking on to move some metal comes from a new engine lineup that eschews the traditional use of a 4-cylinder engine as the base models for a 2.5-liter 5-cylinder engine, followed by a 2.0-liter TDI clean diesel and topped off with a sporty 3.6-liter VR6 engine.
The base 2.5-liter will be good for 170 horsepower and 177 lb-ft of torque, and comes standard with a 5-speed manual transmission. For those who prefer not to row their own gears, VW also has an optional 6-speed automatic available.
Part of the formula that VW is banking on to move some metal comes from a new engine lineup that eschews the traditional use of a 4-cylinder engine as the base models for a 2.5-liter 5-cylinder engine, followed by a 2.0-liter TDI clean diesel and topped off with a sporty 3.6-liter VR6 engine.
The base 2.5-liter will be good for 170 horsepower and 177 lb-ft of torque, and comes standard with a 5-speed manual transmission. For those who prefer not to row their own gears, VW also has an optional 6-speed automatic available.
Last edited by bagwell; 05-26-11 at 12:45 PM.
05-26-11, 03:10 PM
#60
Lexus Fanatic
[QUOTE=Sulu;6419700]
The newest Jetta may have a downgraded interior as well as a downgraded chassis (losing the independent rear suspension) but it is selling really well.
Well, yes, that may be true, but it shows that many car-buyers are not savvy like we are here on CAR CHAT, and don't really look closely at what they are getting for the money. That's why, in my own car reviews, I don't concentrate as much on performance-at-the-limit (you can get that from a number of auto-mags) as I do on trying to give a complete and accurate description of the car from stem to stern.
The newest Jetta may have a downgraded interior as well as a downgraded chassis (losing the independent rear suspension) but it is selling really well.
Well, yes, that may be true, but it shows that many car-buyers are not savvy like we are here on CAR CHAT, and don't really look closely at what they are getting for the money. That's why, in my own car reviews, I don't concentrate as much on performance-at-the-limit (you can get that from a number of auto-mags) as I do on trying to give a complete and accurate description of the car from stem to stern.