RXSF

Lets do it this way

Corolla


LS600h


15 thousand dollar car, versus 108 thousand dollar car

lets also notice the swooping design of the door panel (granted one is in leather and the other in fabric) as it meets the switchgear

another saving grace is that that the RX has the best looking window switches now.
not only do the buttons light up on top of the window switches, they light up on the inside where your finger pulls

xioix

So RSXF, you want Lexus to increase their costs because you don't want things such as buttons that are the same in a Toyota?

RXSF

these are just personal opinions. When I see a Mercedes door panel, it looks upscale. And while a Lexus door panel is light years ahead of a Toyota one material wise, the fact remains that they share parts and design elements.

you might disagree with me, but look at this E class switchgear.

and S class


these look better than the LS's switches. In part, because they are unique. I dont think I would find these in a Smart Car nor a Chrysler product.

now you might be saying, why do I keep posting window switches. But it is these small things that I notice when I look at Lexus products. Sorry if you guys disagree.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

I don't really care if the lower line Lexus and Toyota models share the same design, but the Corolla vs LS600h is definitely not what I expected. Those who are going to buy the LS are not concerned with money, obviously. Although it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, I would like the LS to have a different design. Toyota, please make it look more elegant for the next gen LS. Thank you

spwolf

they certainly look flashy, but i like the simplicity of toyota/lexus controls... and when you sit in corolla and then ls, you dont think they are the same car.

but do you know how does A class switches look like? A lot like any other MB window swich, same graphics and everything, and A class is quite way under S class... or E class... or even C class.... B class too. :-).

Sulu

I am not sure that comparing with Mercedes-Benz and BMW is fair in this circumstance.

MB does not have a lower market brand with which to share its parts and design. Neither does BMW. Although I suppose there may be those who would argue that Rolls-Royce is cheapened by its relationship with BMW.

And what is wrong with sharing a basic design if it works? To me, the basic design of the switches on the driver's-side armrest is similar in those pictures you posted of the Corolla, LS and E- and S-Class: the 4 window switches of a pull-up-to-close / push-down-to-open design, with the mirror adjustment switches ahead of it is very similar across all these vehicles. Have you looked at power-seat switches recently? MB started (I believe) with one that looks like the side-profile of the seat and now all manufacturers are headed in that direction, likely because it works and it is logical.

Have you thought about the benefits of parts-sharing?

1. A small point perhaps, but it gives each car within the brand a familiarity. Passenger aircraft manufacturers claim this all the time: if you can fly the small Airbus A320, you can fly the larger Airbus A330, because they are very similar cockpit designs.

2. Increased quality: it is easier to cut the number of defective units (and numbers of rejects) and thereby increase quality if the supplier is able to build in large numbers.

3. "Why fix what ain't broke?"

4. Tremendous cost savings: by buying in bulk, and not having to design a different outside door handle (for example) for each different car line, a lot of costs can be shaved. The effort to design even little, seemingly trivial parts, is great, so any parts sharing that can be done will be well worth the effort.

MB and BMW are going the parts-sharing route to cut design and production costs also. MB just signed an agreement with Renault-Nissan. Could future MBs be using Nissan engines? Could future small MBs be using Renault-Nissan platforms? BMW uses engines shared with Peugeot-Citroën in the MINI.

I have not mentioned the tremendous amount of parts and design sharing among the vehicles in the Volkswagen Group: Bentley with Audi; Audi with Volkswagen; Volkswagen with Skoda and SEAT; Bugatti with its unique, but very VW engine; and now Porsche with Bentley and Audi? If VW is successful in becoming the world's largest auto manufacturer by later this decade, it will be because they know how to share from the cheapest Skodas up to the most expensive Bentleys and Bugattis.

LexFather

I think RXSF has a point. While I have no problem with small things shared most won't care or notice (switchgear, cruise control stalk etc) there is a neat way the Germans have their switchgear and its not shared. It is partly why they cost more. Mercedes I think has the switchgear that looks like a seat and its a great idea. Benz has shared, some older Benz's had the same instrument panel



Lexus is not immune to cutting costs but compared to other brands that share parts they have done by far the best job masking what they share and trying to minimize it.

A lot of surprising cars do it though. The Aston Martin Vantage I believe used some Ford switchgear. The Lamborghini Diablo refresh used Nissan 300ZX headlights.


I believe the ZR1 uses a Cobalt Steering wheel. Hyundai Sonata Tailights were on the Noble M400.





I believe the old Durango and Grand Caravan used the same tailights. The Lambo Gallardo now uses the same NAV/Climate Control as Audis.

So yes, Lexus uses it as others.

GiantsFan

iTrader: (9)

I always felt the steering wheel really cheapened the vette.... why the hell do they use the same wheel as a cobalt!!!

Fizzboy7

I can top all that. Our 2005 32' Fleetwood Southwind uses the same headlamps as the 1999 VW Golf. Ha!

MR_F1

My reasoning is as simple as one word: Efficiency.


You don't think if all their cars used those engines through out the world the cost wouldn't be lower?

Just because they allow their vehicles lag behind technologically today and still sell, doesn't mean that will still be the case a year or two from now. Valvematic has been out since 2007. 4 years later, No vehicles in the US have it yet.

It's a question of complacency, and I hope Toyota is not falling into it. Quit the sand bagging.

xioix

Instead of windows switches, I'd rather Toyota/Lexus add the new advanced tech to the other cars sooner, like Mercedes.

Like the LS's 8-speed gearbox, Mercedes is putting the 7-speed in everything now (in the US)

RXSF

^^ I agree. And again, the industry is moving towards more gears. Lexus needs to start making mechanical strides so that 5 years later, they can be implemented in Toyota products

LexusMan77

A guy(arabianobsession) at the ToyotaNation.com forum claimed on Monday 3/14 he will be taking pics of the 2012 Camry so that we can see either today or tomorrow. Well, its Wednesday and no pics yet.

Here is the quote and link to the forum.
"I'll be taking them tomorrow afternoon, so you will see them Wednesday/Thursday."
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/sh...371179&page=23

spwolf

apparently Camry will have leather around the dash, like CT200h... I wonder how some of Lexus cry-babies will feel about that :-)

dunnojack

i'd rather have no leather than cheap leather on the dash.

if it ain't at least top grain, i don't want it.