LexFather

^^^ And its only one vehicle. I've checked Autotrader and you can find quite a few right under 30k. Not sure if they are all Premium or not and what options they have. For example a HS listed at 35k base that is now 30k is about right after a year. A HS listed at 40-45k should not be 30k after a year.

Would require some more research on our end.

UDel

Your Camry is also a bigger roomier car that shares the platform with the larger more upscale ES in the Lexus line so having a little overlap between the larger roomier Camry hybrid and the smaller but more upscale HS in price would not be too out of the ordinary, loaded Camry's are not exactly cheap either and can get pretty expensive. There has always been some overlap in Toyota/Lexus pricing with certain models, not every Lexus vehicle is more expensive then a Toyota vehicle.

I think the HS starting at around 29 and maxing out around 36 would certainly sell much better and receive more interest. Looking at what it is and the specs I don't see a car that should cost much over 35K and certainly not in the 40's. I don't think the HS is a bad effort, it is just priced way too high for what you get.

dunnojack

i bet if they sold the HS at that low price, they'd still make a profit.

other than the camry hybrid powertrain, what else is expensive in the HS?

LexFather

This has been explained in multiple threads that you have posted in about the HS about a car not liked. So simply search and you will find the answer.

I doubt the Camry hybrid powertrain contributes to it's price. If anything sharing an existing setup helps with the cost.

The YEN is trading at around 82-83 vs the dollar. That is why Japanese car prices exported from Japan has an eroding price advantage.

The HS was not aimed for most people. Lexus seemed to bet that gas prices would rise AND there was a larger market for this techy car priced where it was. Clearly there is not.

97-SC300

iTrader: (17)

Why exactly does the HS not sell? Why did it flop? What's the problem?

LexFather

^^^ Please see the first page of this thread or do a search, its been discussed. Simple breakdown;
Price
Looks
Recall
Interior is weird for a Lexus
Not enough market for it
Gas price relatively low
Thick competition in the 30-40k segment

IS-SV

Deep discounting combined with low demand when new = low resale value as expected.

And the current gen Prius being a much stronger seller makes more sense to me because I (like most actual buyers) prefer the sleek styling and value.

Mister Two

Double-wishbone rear suspension vs. MacPherson struts?

Personally I think the HS250h pretty much fails in looks and looks alone. It is a pretty nice car otherwise and has been praised for its interior quality, interior room, ride & handling, and the high level of its standard and optional luxury amenities. Even its fuel economy, while not spectacular for a hybrid, still beats the lighter Camry Hybrid.

shyguy16

uh, i don't think the employees manning the acura booths are in any position to cancel products.

shyguy16

the problem is that it looks like a corolla with lexus badges.
as if that weren't bad enough, they get to the sticker on the window and you can kiss any sale goodbye.
the prius at $15k less and better gas mileage is a no-brainer.

mmarshall

They write post-show reports (which is part of the job-description of the product-specialists there)....then take those reports back to marketers and senior-managers. Sometimes their superiors listen....sometimes they don't.

I saw both Saturn and Oldsmobile go down the tubes, partly because they didn't listen to what people at the shows were telling them about the design of their products, and what needed to be changed. Saturn, for example, started on the downhill track after 2000, when they forgot their successful bread-and-butter formula (plastic-bodied compact cars) and tried to expand and be just another GM division. The refusal to listen cost them dearly.


Back on the thread topic (HS250), it should be selling in its present formula, but clearly isn't. Lexus management must accept the fact that it isn't find out why, and take appropriate action.

Personally, as to why it isn't selling, though I feel that it is a good alternative to the geekily-styled Prius (and the decline of the sheet metal/interior-materials quality from the 2Gen to the 3Gen Prius), I agree with other posters that it is probably priced too high, even considering the higher-cost of producing a hybrid over a convebntional-powertrain vehicle.

IS-SV

The people manning the booths at car show are worthless from automotive business and knowledge standpoints. I can't be bothered to talk to them, not worth the effort.

No surprise the low-demand HS has low resale value to me, back OT.

mmarshall

I don't want to get too far off-topic here, but the quality/competence of the employees at the auto shows varies tremendously. At the D.C. Show, for instance, I've dealt with everything from people that do nothing but read off of cue-cards/teleprompters and show off their flashy costumes to actual vehicle-engineers and zone-managers.

One of the girls I dealt with there each year (a nice-looking blonde who seemed to take a liking to me, and ended up working at three different companies....Saab, Isuzu, and Cadillac) came to me several times, on her breaks, for advice on new vehicles for herself and her friends. She knew the vehicles she was representing at the show pretty well, but little of the auto market outside of that. She, at the time, was driving a Chevy Trail Blazer, and, of course, was stuck with that vehicle's typical reliability problems.

While I respect your opinion, though the HS interior is certainly not ugly or cheap, I don't find it that impressive, compared to other Lexus products. Its trim level, inside, clearly reflects its position as one of the Lexus entry-level vehicles, and, IMO, is equalled or outclassed by its IS and ES brothers....though its back seat is clearly more usable than that of the IS.

PhilipMSPT

iTrader: (5)

I'm the guy who usually talks about a car at a car show, then everyone comes to me for info...

mmarshall

Yep...a good point. A lot of people, at the shows, seem more interested in the flashy female models, up on the turntables, or in the visiting celebrities at the show, than in the actual vehicles themselves.