Does It Bother You When They Say, "It's A Toyota"?
11-27-10, 11:55 AM
#31
Not so.
The ES is the same as a Camry underneath, and the RX is a dressed-up Highlander.
One of the reasons I bought my first ES is because of the legendary reliability of the Camry, and they are the same engine, drivetrain, suspension, and brakes. On the few occasions that I have needed parts, I just get the same part for a Camry, it always fits, but it's a lot cheaper. I think it's absurd that Lexus charges 20-30% more for parts that are the same exact part number, in a Toyota box.
Both my current ES and the Highlander have the same 3.3L 5MZ engine. Parked side-by-side in the garage, they are identical under the hood, the only difference I can see is the badge on the engine cover.
Our Highlander has been absolutely reliable, not a single problem so far, it's about to turn over 100K miles. But it is much noisier on the road, not particularly comfortable, and very boring. The factory audio system is terrible. When I get tired of it, it will get swapped out for an RX.
I tell people all the time that my car is really just a Toyota. They know my reputation of being a hard core Toyota fanatic. I don't believe there is any other brand that has remained at or near the top of the CR and JD Powers reliability & consumer satisfaction ratings since the first day they started producing cars.
The ES is the same as a Camry underneath, and the RX is a dressed-up Highlander.
One of the reasons I bought my first ES is because of the legendary reliability of the Camry, and they are the same engine, drivetrain, suspension, and brakes. On the few occasions that I have needed parts, I just get the same part for a Camry, it always fits, but it's a lot cheaper. I think it's absurd that Lexus charges 20-30% more for parts that are the same exact part number, in a Toyota box.
Both my current ES and the Highlander have the same 3.3L 5MZ engine. Parked side-by-side in the garage, they are identical under the hood, the only difference I can see is the badge on the engine cover.
Our Highlander has been absolutely reliable, not a single problem so far, it's about to turn over 100K miles. But it is much noisier on the road, not particularly comfortable, and very boring. The factory audio system is terrible. When I get tired of it, it will get swapped out for an RX.
I tell people all the time that my car is really just a Toyota. They know my reputation of being a hard core Toyota fanatic. I don't believe there is any other brand that has remained at or near the top of the CR and JD Powers reliability & consumer satisfaction ratings since the first day they started producing cars.
11-27-10, 06:37 PM
#32
Never bothers me. I even refer to it as a toyota at times. I am not lacking something and need some ego boost from trying to make out my car to being the most prestigious brand or something.
11-27-10, 08:34 PM
#34
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Not one bit, because i say "It's a Ford" "It's a GM" when they break down.
11-28-10, 08:37 AM
#35
I drive a Toyota GS300. Better than having to replace random freaking parts for hundreds of dollars like my friends do with their BMW's and Mercedes'. My buddy just spent 500 bucks replacing the washer fluid pump, i mean how random is that to break and 500 bucks??? Thats ridiculous. When they say nice Lexus i tell them "oh this toyota its nothing, got about 150k on it though and never gave me a problem, thats why i like Toyota they make good cars". Then i got them trying to tell me it a Lexus and not a Toyota lol. Whatever the case may be these cars last forever, i have seriously and i mean this have not had anything go wrong with any of the 4 Lexus cars i have owned in the past 6 years, besides having to do maintanance. What other cars can do this???????? Well ill tell ya - NONE, i have owned everything thats out there and they have all given me problems besides my Toyotas lol.
11-28-10, 09:46 AM
#36
Even a Mazda is better than a BMW in terms of reliability.
I drove a Mazda6 for 7-1/2 years and and nothing ever broke outside of warranty.
Even the interior leather and trim held up so good that last year when I took it in for inspections, the inspection station attendant thought that the car was 1.5 years old at best. He freaked out when he learned it was only "6 yrs" old at that time!!!!!
I drove a Mazda6 for 7-1/2 years and and nothing ever broke outside of warranty.
Even the interior leather and trim held up so good that last year when I took it in for inspections, the inspection station attendant thought that the car was 1.5 years old at best. He freaked out when he learned it was only "6 yrs" old at that time!!!!!
11-28-10, 10:57 AM
#37
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This all started when Lexus were rebadged Toyotas such as Soarer (SC), Celsior (LS), Aristo (GS), Altezza (IS), etc. Then Lexus started selling these cars under the Lexus name in Japan and asia.
It is true that Lexus is owned (and shares some parts and chassis with) Toyota but that doesn't make it any less of a vehicle. Toyota makes great, reliable cars and this is extended to their luxury division which is a positive. I don't see anything that makes a Lexus an unworthy competitor to the German luxury brands. Each brand caters to different people: BMW is driver oriented, MB is ride oriented, Lexus is ride and reliability oriented, etc.
IMO, people who say Lexus is just a Toyota are trying to deride the brand since they are probably brand whors.
It is true that Lexus is owned (and shares some parts and chassis with) Toyota but that doesn't make it any less of a vehicle. Toyota makes great, reliable cars and this is extended to their luxury division which is a positive. I don't see anything that makes a Lexus an unworthy competitor to the German luxury brands. Each brand caters to different people: BMW is driver oriented, MB is ride oriented, Lexus is ride and reliability oriented, etc.
IMO, people who say Lexus is just a Toyota are trying to deride the brand since they are probably brand whors.
11-28-10, 10:59 AM
#38
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This all started when Lexus were rebadged Toyotas such as Soarer (SC), Celsior (LS), Aristo (GS), Altezza (IS), etc. Then Lexus started selling these cars under the Lexus name in Japan and asia.
It is true that Lexus is owned (and shares some parts and chassis with) Toyota but that doesn't make it any less of a vehicle. Toyota makes great, reliable cars and this is extended to their luxury division which is a positive. I don't see anything that makes a Lexus an unworthy competitor to the German luxury brands. Each brand caters to different people: BMW is driver oriented, MB is ride oriented, Lexus is ride and reliability oriented, etc.
IMO, people who say Lexus is just a Toyota are trying to deride the brand since they are probably brand whors.
It is true that Lexus is owned (and shares some parts and chassis with) Toyota but that doesn't make it any less of a vehicle. Toyota makes great, reliable cars and this is extended to their luxury division which is a positive. I don't see anything that makes a Lexus an unworthy competitor to the German luxury brands. Each brand caters to different people: BMW is driver oriented, MB is ride oriented, Lexus is ride and reliability oriented, etc.
IMO, people who say Lexus is just a Toyota are trying to deride the brand since they are probably brand whors.
For example
-the world got a V-8 GS 400/430. Japan's Aristo got I-6 and the turbo I-6
-Europe got an IS 200 I-6, we got an IS 300 I-6, the Altezza was a high revving I-4
The original LX 450 and maybe ES 250 (that even had frameless windows though)was really the only "rebadge", nothing much changed inside and out except badges, wheels. Clearly today they share mechanical are but are different inside and out.
I completely agree a car built to a standard in most cases is a good car no matter the badge, ala a 50k Toyota Crown or Nissan Fuga for instance.
Last edited by LexFather; 11-28-10 at 11:03 AM.
11-28-10, 11:10 AM
#39
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Except they weren't rebadged Toyotas. They were Lexus vehicles sold as Toyotas in Japan due to no dealer network. Then in many cases the Toyota badged car didn't have the same engine or options.
For example
-the world got a V-8 GS 400/430. Japan's Aristo got I-6 and the turbo I-6
-Europe got an IS 200 I-6, we got an IS 300 I-6, the Altezza was a high revving I-4
The original LX 450 and maybe ES 250 (that even had frameless windows though)was really the only "rebadge", nothing much changed inside and out except badges, wheels. Clearly today they share mechanical are but are different inside and out.
I completely agree a car built to a standard in most cases is a good car no matter the badge, ala a 50k Toyota Crown or Nissan Fuga for instance.
For example
-the world got a V-8 GS 400/430. Japan's Aristo got I-6 and the turbo I-6
-Europe got an IS 200 I-6, we got an IS 300 I-6, the Altezza was a high revving I-4
The original LX 450 and maybe ES 250 (that even had frameless windows though)was really the only "rebadge", nothing much changed inside and out except badges, wheels. Clearly today they share mechanical are but are different inside and out.
I completely agree a car built to a standard in most cases is a good car no matter the badge, ala a 50k Toyota Crown or Nissan Fuga for instance.
Anyways, I also forgot about the I-6 turbo Aristo. That would have been killer in the U.S. but the U.S. market wouldn't consider it to be a legitimate E class and 5 series competitor without a V-8. I still have fond memories of my GS400; it was fast, solid, and luxurious.
Last edited by LB Lex; 11-28-10 at 11:14 AM.
11-28-10, 11:11 AM
#40
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It pisses me off sometimes when people say "It's just a Toyota", or even "Toyota sucks". But I always come back with "In what way? Reliability? Quality? The fact that my 12 year old V6 Avalon has more power and gets better MPGs than your (name POS car here)".
Most of the people who have tried to tell me Toyotas suck are people with ****ty cars. I know a girl who thinks Jeeps run forever. LMAO! Another friend thinks Chrysler makes the greatest cars in the world. Sorry buddy, there's a reason they're at the bottom of every list whether it is CR, JD Power, etc. I know people who are BMW and Audi fanboys. Well, many German makes suffer in reliability. A family friend has had constant problems with their 5-series ranging from switches going out, to oil leaks. Audi is just overpriced to hell. Good looking cars, but I would not buy one.
My family has never had a problem with our Toyotas. We have owned a late 80's Pickup with a 22r or 22re (Idr) with 5 spd manual, '89 Camry, '94 T100, '00 Celica and now the current lineup you see in my sig. Never had a problem with any of them. My Avalon needed the radiator replaced last summer due to me pushing too hard during its 11th Florida summer. Bound to happen. But 149,000 miles on the clock, it still runs strong. When I tell people about how many miles it has, they say "Wow, that's a lot", but I say "Not for a Toyota with its original engine and tranny".
They may laugh at you now (for some stupid reason), but when your Toyota outlasts whatever the hell they drive, you will have the last laugh. I'm proud to own a Toyota.
Most of the people who have tried to tell me Toyotas suck are people with ****ty cars. I know a girl who thinks Jeeps run forever. LMAO! Another friend thinks Chrysler makes the greatest cars in the world. Sorry buddy, there's a reason they're at the bottom of every list whether it is CR, JD Power, etc. I know people who are BMW and Audi fanboys. Well, many German makes suffer in reliability. A family friend has had constant problems with their 5-series ranging from switches going out, to oil leaks. Audi is just overpriced to hell. Good looking cars, but I would not buy one.
My family has never had a problem with our Toyotas. We have owned a late 80's Pickup with a 22r or 22re (Idr) with 5 spd manual, '89 Camry, '94 T100, '00 Celica and now the current lineup you see in my sig. Never had a problem with any of them. My Avalon needed the radiator replaced last summer due to me pushing too hard during its 11th Florida summer. Bound to happen. But 149,000 miles on the clock, it still runs strong. When I tell people about how many miles it has, they say "Wow, that's a lot", but I say "Not for a Toyota with its original engine and tranny".
They may laugh at you now (for some stupid reason), but when your Toyota outlasts whatever the hell they drive, you will have the last laugh. I'm proud to own a Toyota.
11-28-10, 11:34 AM
#41
Most people say it cuz they are jealous.
I know a few guys that hate the LFA cuz it's a toyota... when I took them to see the LFA in person they were all in awe and freaking out and it was revving and stuff.
I know a few guys that hate the LFA cuz it's a toyota... when I took them to see the LFA in person they were all in awe and freaking out and it was revving and stuff.
11-28-10, 11:54 AM
#42
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Thanks for the clarification, I forgot that Lexus were first released in the U.S. and then sold in Japan as Toyotas. I thought it was the other way around.
Anyways, I also forgot about the I-6 turbo Aristo. That would have been killer in the U.S. but the U.S. market wouldn't consider it to be a legitimate E class and 5 series competitor without a V-8. I still have fond memories of my GS400; it was fast, solid, and luxurious.
Anyways, I also forgot about the I-6 turbo Aristo. That would have been killer in the U.S. but the U.S. market wouldn't consider it to be a legitimate E class and 5 series competitor without a V-8. I still have fond memories of my GS400; it was fast, solid, and luxurious.
The Aristo also offered 4 wheel steering and I think even AWD in the first gen. I am glad they went with an optional V-8 but I agree with you they missed an opportunity with the turbo I-6. We now see BMW using a turbo I-6.
11-28-10, 04:04 PM
#44
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By that same token, do they dislike the GT-R/Skyline simply because it's a Nissan? 
Or the Ford GT, simply because it's a Ford?
One thing I have learned over the years is not to "love" or "hate" a vehicle until I actually go look at it, and, if possible, test-drive it. Some years ago, for instance, I had no idea that I would ever be driving either a Lexus or an AWD Subaru....but have now owned both.
Or the Ford GT, simply because it's a Ford?One thing I have learned over the years is not to "love" or "hate" a vehicle until I actually go look at it, and, if possible, test-drive it. Some years ago, for instance, I had no idea that I would ever be driving either a Lexus or an AWD Subaru....but have now owned both.
11-28-10, 04:15 PM
#45
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One thing I have learned over the years is not to "love" or "hate" a vehicle until I actually go look at it, and, if possible, test-drive it. Some years ago, for instance, I had no idea that I would ever be driving either a Lexus or an AWD Subaru....but have now owned both.
Great point. So many people rag on certain cars, and you ask them, have you driven it? No. Then why the hate?? I didn't even consider a Lexus until I drove an 04 ES..Which got me into checking out the older ones. Actually driving it is more informative than reading about it.. & You see what I ended up with
