EPA rates the Volt: 93 MPG-equivalent on electricity, 37 MPG gas, 60 MPG combined
10-10-10, 09:58 PM
#211
Lexus Champion
But this number, too, requires a couple of caveats. First, we’re counting (as does the EPA) all the electricity used in the charging process—which has a fair amount of inefficiencies—not just what the vehicle deploys to the wheels. In our experience, using only standard-household 120-volt power, it took about 13.4 kWh of electricity to replenish the Volt’s 9 kWh of usable energy. Using a 240-volt setup instead is more efficient and would have boosted the mileage figure.
10-11-10, 05:35 AM
#212
Lexus Champion
Here’s what we do know: GM’s recently revised electric-range claim is 25 to 50 miles, and we ended up in the low to middle of that band. Getting on the nearest highway and commuting with the 80-mph flow of traffic—basically the worst-case scenario—yielded 26 miles; a fairly spirited back-road loop netted 31; and a carefully modulated cruise below 60 mph pushed the figure into the upper 30s.
I bet I could get 50 miles electric only out of it easy....top speed on my commute is 52mph.
I bet I could get 50 miles electric only out of it easy....top speed on my commute is 52mph.
10-11-10, 06:13 AM
#213
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Sounds to me like it is worth it in the long run just to install the 240 in your garage...or get an extension cord from your laundry room.
10-11-10, 09:24 AM
#214
GM Lied: Chevy Volt is Not a True EV
http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/...a-true-ev.html
Maybe not an EV in the purest sense, but it's pretty close...
Maybe not an EV in the purest sense, but it's pretty close...
Just the Facts:
* Despite promises that the Chevy Volt will operate as an electric car at all times, it will in fact at times be directly driven in part by its internal combustion engine.
* The mechanical link between Ecotec internal combustion engine and drive wheels will be at high speed.
DETROIT — It's the big headline currently on GM's media news site:
...
Chevy Volt is a hybrid and it has more in common with conventional "parallel" hybrids like the Toyota Prius than the marketing hype led us to believe. There are circumstances in which the Volt operates with the internal combustion engine directly driving the front wheels. That's right, like a Prius.
At the heart of the Volt is the "Voltec" propulsion system and the heart of Voltec is the "4ET50" electric drive unit that contains a pair of electric motors and a "multi-mode transaxle with continuously variable capacity." This is how GM describes it:
"Unlike a conventional powertrain, there are no step gears within the unit, and no direct mechanical linkage from the engine, through the drive unit to the wheels."
The 4ET50 is, however, in fact directly bolted to the 1.4-liter, four-cylinder Ecotec internal combustion engine. When the Volt's lithium-ion battery pack runs down, clutches in the 4ET50 engage and the Ecotec engine is lashed to the generator to produce the electric power necessary to drive the car. However under certain circumstances — speeds near or above 70 mph — in fact the engine will directly drive the front wheels in conjunction with the electric motors.
As in the Prius, the Volt's drivetrain includes a planetary gear set that acts as a transmission. The intricacies of planetary gears are many, but in rough terms each element (electric engines and internal combustion engine) of the Prius or Volt drivetrains are hooked up to different elements of the gear set. In the Volt, its Ecotec engine is clutched to the outer ring gear and as the car's speed reaches the edge of efficiency for the electric motor, that ring is set from its normally rigid mounting in the 4ET50's case and allowed to spin. That has the Ecotec driving the front wheels.
* Despite promises that the Chevy Volt will operate as an electric car at all times, it will in fact at times be directly driven in part by its internal combustion engine.
* The mechanical link between Ecotec internal combustion engine and drive wheels will be at high speed.
DETROIT — It's the big headline currently on GM's media news site:
...
Chevy Volt is a hybrid and it has more in common with conventional "parallel" hybrids like the Toyota Prius than the marketing hype led us to believe. There are circumstances in which the Volt operates with the internal combustion engine directly driving the front wheels. That's right, like a Prius.
At the heart of the Volt is the "Voltec" propulsion system and the heart of Voltec is the "4ET50" electric drive unit that contains a pair of electric motors and a "multi-mode transaxle with continuously variable capacity." This is how GM describes it:
"Unlike a conventional powertrain, there are no step gears within the unit, and no direct mechanical linkage from the engine, through the drive unit to the wheels."
The 4ET50 is, however, in fact directly bolted to the 1.4-liter, four-cylinder Ecotec internal combustion engine. When the Volt's lithium-ion battery pack runs down, clutches in the 4ET50 engage and the Ecotec engine is lashed to the generator to produce the electric power necessary to drive the car. However under certain circumstances — speeds near or above 70 mph — in fact the engine will directly drive the front wheels in conjunction with the electric motors.
As in the Prius, the Volt's drivetrain includes a planetary gear set that acts as a transmission. The intricacies of planetary gears are many, but in rough terms each element (electric engines and internal combustion engine) of the Prius or Volt drivetrains are hooked up to different elements of the gear set. In the Volt, its Ecotec engine is clutched to the outer ring gear and as the car's speed reaches the edge of efficiency for the electric motor, that ring is set from its normally rigid mounting in the 4ET50's case and allowed to spin. That has the Ecotec driving the front wheels.
10-11-10, 10:33 AM
#215
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by SLegacy99
Yes, I'd be interested in an explanation as well
working with electric-utility companies to develop chargers at up to 400 volts, which will be able to do the job in as little as 20 minutes. That will allow you to, say, park your car in a shopping-center that has the 400V outlets, dump some coins in the chargers to cover the cost of the electricity, and go in and get a haircut, shop or eat dinner in a restaurant, and then come back and find your car all charged-up and ready to go. Nifty, eh? 
10-11-10, 10:45 AM
#216
Lexus Fanatic
10-11-10, 10:55 AM
#217
http://www.insideline.com/chevrolet/...a-true-ev.html
Maybe not an EV in the purest sense, but it's pretty close...
Maybe not an EV in the purest sense, but it's pretty close...
this thing will be total and complete failure.
serves them right for constantly lying to their perspective buyers... I guess GM will never change.
10-11-10, 11:14 AM
#218
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The All-Electric Range certainly isn't that impressive, but if you look at it from the total MPG standpoint, nothing on the market comes close to it - not even the king of MPG Prius:
Driven 75 miles non-stop = 75 MPG
Driven 110 miles non-stop = 55 MPG
Driven 145 miles non-stop = 48 MPG
Most people will not drive more than 40 miles without re-charging, so we're talking unlimited MPG at that point. Only in the rare case when someone drives MORE than 145 miles at a time without re-charging will a Prius deliver better gas mileage.
BTW - Reports are that the Volt will deliver better than 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode (more like 40 MPG), which would make MPG numbers look more like this:
Driven 80 miles non-stop = 80 MPG
Driven 120 miles non-stop = 60 MPG
Driven 160 miles non-stop = 53 MPG
Driven 200 miles non-stop = 50 MPG
Last edited by Sens4Miles; 10-11-10 at 11:17 AM.
10-11-10, 11:22 AM
#219
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Not surprised with the latest news at all. Delayed, overhyped, and disappointing compared to the concept and compared to GM's initial claims. This is nothing new from GM.
If you drive more than 25-30 miles a day, there really is no point in owning the Volt.
If you drive more than 25-30 miles a day, there really is no point in owning the Volt.
10-11-10, 11:22 AM
#220
It's actually nothing like the Prius. It never ever operates as a hybrid. It is an electric car the first 40 miles, then its a relatively fuel efficient ICE car beyond that range. I think to call it a "total and complete failure" before it even goes on sale is a bit premature, no?
The All-Electric Range certainly isn't that impressive, but if you look at it from the total MPG standpoint, nothing on the market comes close to it - not even the king of MPG Prius:
Driven 75 miles non-stop = 75 MPG
Driven 110 miles non-stop = 55 MPG
Driven 145 miles non-stop = 48 MPG
Most people will not drive more than 40 miles without re-charging, so we're talking unlimited MPG at that point. Only in the rare case when someone drives MORE than 145 miles at a time without re-charging will a Prius deliver better gas mileage.
BTW - Reports are that the Volt will deliver better than 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode (more like 40 MPG), which would make MPG numbers look more like this:
Driven 80 miles non-stop = 80 MPG
Driven 120 miles non-stop = 60 MPG
Driven 160 miles non-stop = 53 MPG
Driven 200 miles non-stop = 50 MPG
The All-Electric Range certainly isn't that impressive, but if you look at it from the total MPG standpoint, nothing on the market comes close to it - not even the king of MPG Prius:
Driven 75 miles non-stop = 75 MPG
Driven 110 miles non-stop = 55 MPG
Driven 145 miles non-stop = 48 MPG
Most people will not drive more than 40 miles without re-charging, so we're talking unlimited MPG at that point. Only in the rare case when someone drives MORE than 145 miles at a time without re-charging will a Prius deliver better gas mileage.
BTW - Reports are that the Volt will deliver better than 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode (more like 40 MPG), which would make MPG numbers look more like this:
Driven 80 miles non-stop = 80 MPG
Driven 120 miles non-stop = 60 MPG
Driven 160 miles non-stop = 53 MPG
Driven 200 miles non-stop = 50 MPG
You can read reports from last page where they said they noticed 35mpg average for Volt in charge sustaining mode.
GM has now confirmed, late in the game, that the Volt can, in some situations, use the ICE to power the wheels. This came to light after Motor Trend was allowed to test the car for three long drives and discovered:
However of particular interest, when going above 70 mph in charge sustaining mode, and the generator gets coupled to the drivetrain, the gas engine participates in the motive force. GM says the engine never drives the wheels all by itself, but will participate in this particular situation in the name of efficiency, which is improved by 10 to 15 percent.
This is exactly the opposite of what GM has been saying for years – most recently in June, when GM spokesman Rob Peterson told AutoblogGreen that there was no mechanism in the Volt to drive the wheels even if the engineers wanted too
However of particular interest, when going above 70 mph in charge sustaining mode, and the generator gets coupled to the drivetrain, the gas engine participates in the motive force. GM says the engine never drives the wheels all by itself, but will participate in this particular situation in the name of efficiency, which is improved by 10 to 15 percent.
This is exactly the opposite of what GM has been saying for years – most recently in June, when GM spokesman Rob Peterson told AutoblogGreen that there was no mechanism in the Volt to drive the wheels even if the engineers wanted too
10-11-10, 11:31 AM
#221
Funny part is that for all the revolutionary claims about Volt, at the end they found out that it is most efficient for engine to directly power the wheels (just like Prius) and that in mean time, Toyota was able to simply put in bigger battery in almost unmodified Prius, get 13 miles range at minimum extra $$$ and still get >50mpg when out of electricity despite heavier vehicle.
10-11-10, 11:34 AM
#222
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Worst case scenario, at 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode, the Volt will still deliver better overall MPG numbers than a Prius up to at least 145 consecutive miles non-stop without re-charging. The 35 MPG number was released by Popular Mechanics in their test drive, while driving it rather aggressively. Most normal drivers will probably be able to get 40 MPG in charge-sustaining mode. Now you have to ADD that 40 MPG AFTER the 40 miles all-electric range to determine the true MPG of the Volt (which I have already done - see above).
10-11-10, 11:36 AM
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10-11-10, 11:46 AM
#224
Did you read my post at all?
Worst case scenario, at 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode, the Volt will still deliver better overall MPG numbers than a Prius up to at least 145 consecutive miles non-stop without re-charging. The 35 MPG number was released by Popular Mechanics in their test drive, while driving it rather aggressively. Most normal drivers will probably be able to get 40 MPG in charge-sustaining mode. Now you have to ADD that 40 MPG AFTER the 40 miles all-electric range to determine the true MPG of the Volt (which I have already done - see above).
Worst case scenario, at 35 MPG in charge-sustaining mode, the Volt will still deliver better overall MPG numbers than a Prius up to at least 145 consecutive miles non-stop without re-charging. The 35 MPG number was released by Popular Mechanics in their test drive, while driving it rather aggressively. Most normal drivers will probably be able to get 40 MPG in charge-sustaining mode. Now you have to ADD that 40 MPG AFTER the 40 miles all-electric range to determine the true MPG of the Volt (which I have already done - see above).
Also big thing to note is that Volt is 20k more expensive than Prius. Prius PHEV with 13 mile range is only going to be 1.5k to 3k more expensive than Volt. And its average mpg is going to be very close to Volts due to much better out of juice mileage.
10-11-10, 11:52 AM
#225
GM's Chevy Volt Bait and Switch: Volt is a Plug-in Hybrid, Not a True BEV
GM Lied: Chevy Volt is Not a True EV
How GM "Lied" About The Electric Car