xioix

Do you remember how cheap gas was in 2001 though?

-J-P-L-

Good point.

Better point.

-J-P-L-

Wow, so only 30,000 will be built in 2011? Too bad.

For perspective, the low volume 17 MPG Acura MDX sells more than TWICE as much. The low volume Lexus LS has, at times, sold more than 30K a year.

GM is going to have to build much more than this.

Oh wait, automakers only build high volumes of the cars that nobody wants (big trucks and SUV's).

TRDFantasy

The car won't be out for a few years, and we STILL don't know what the pricing will be like.

If this was 1995 and we were talking about preliminary information about the 1st-gen Prius, I would be critical too.

The Prius deserves the recognition and credit because it has proven itself. The Prius has been on the road, in driver's hands and in real-world conditions for over a decade now. Toyota in general has proven itself time and time again that it makes good, reliable cars.

GM had a great idea with the EV-1 ... except it was too expensive ... and except that GM killed the EV-1 project and subsequently all EV-1 units.

The Volt has proven nothing really. When the Volt is on the road, and owners are driving it in real-life situations, then we'll talk. At that point we will know the price and we will start to see what problems, if any, the production car has.

STIG

I agree. It's quite disgusting, really.

Volt is brilliant Great efforts from GM.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Production volume doesn't make something revolutionary. A Camry isn't revolutionary despite being produced in vast quantities.

No Toyota ISN'T. You keep trying to equate the Prius with the Volt but they're not the same. The Prius isn't a plug-in and can run on electricity alone for barely any distance.

But I'm know I'm wasting my typing to you, as Toyota can do no wrong and GM can do no right.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

You do know the Volt's powered by Lithium Ion batteries, someone no one has on the market yet, that's part of it. Plus, the EV1 was the size of a shoe box, and was only an experiment (one that lost a pile of money).

I can understand that. Go for it.

I'd rather have a real electric plug-in car with modern batteries.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

I agree - while I don't personally like the Prius, it's a success in the market. Although I have no idea if Toyota actually makes any money on it.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

When a new anything is planned, some kind of production volume forecast has to be made. There's nothing saying that GM can't make more. They, nor you, nor anyone knows what actual demand will be.

You guys would probably still be critical if GM said they were going to make 300,000 in year one.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

It's clear some of you will NEVER, EVER buy a GM product, and probably not a Ford one either.

I'd say there's a chance that GM or Ford could end up with CHINESE ownership, although those companies would be very different then from today (most likely a good thing all around). The unions got too greedy. The management got too complacent. And now the economy and oil is clobbering them.

But all the Toyota fans here might want to look at Toyota's LOUSY stock performance in the past couple of years.

-J-P-L-

Actually, I really, really want a Volt. The problem will be the price tag. GM announced something like $35K-$40K. Unfortunately, that put's it out of range for the people who are most concerned with gas prices. I'd be on the waiting list in two years if it were no more than $25K.

That said, I understand GM still won't make any money on this car (especially early on). It's just too bad and kind of ironic that a car that is designed to "save money" will be too expensive because of it's advanced tech.

xioix

The thing is, the Volt will not be released till maybe 2011, and by then we don't know who will be out on the market with Lithium Ion batteries, because the battery issue is the reason why the Volt isn't in production right now

The next gen Prius is suppose to be out 2010 or 2011, and rumors of a plug-in version and a Lithium Ion for the Lexus version has been spreading around,

And the current Prius has been making money for Toyota since it was out or a year in its production

IS350jet

The Volt and the Prius cannot be compared. The Prius runs on gasoline AND electricity, but MOSTLY gasoline. The ICE shuts off at very low speeds only, as in slow city driving. Contrary to popular belief, the Prius runs on gasoline *most* of the time. The electric motors in the prius run very rarely by themselves. Anyone that own a Prius can tell you that. The range of the prius with just the electric motors is something like 5 or 6 miles before the engine starts up to charge the batteries. All at low speeds only. On the highway, the Prius's ICE is running 100% of the time.

The Volt runs on electricity ONLY. it does not use a gasoline engine to power the car. At all speeds, the Volt is running on electricty only. It has no other option. The ICE onboard the Volt does nothing but charge the battery pack.

The Volt travels down the highway at 60, 70, 80 MPH on electricty only, at up to 40 miles at a time,(without the engine starting) which is something the Prius cannot do. With a full tank and a full charge the volt is said to get between 60 and 75 MPG, also, something the prius can't do.

The Volt is revolutionary because it's the first car of it's kind that runs 100% on electricity, and, is self charging.

xioix

And these are all GMs predictions, we have to wait till the EPA test it out in 2011 and see what they rate it at

spwolf

ehm, yes, there are vehicles with lithium batteries on the market, just not massivly produced - in fact, wanna bet that Toyota will have lithium batteries in their vehicle before Volt start selling? Otherwise, why would they have lithium battery factory in the works that can build 100,000 batteries per year in 2010?