2012 Hyundai Genesis priced from $34,200; new 5.0 R-Spec to start at $46,500
05-31-11, 08:14 AM
#61
Lexus Champion
Who is the idiot - someone who buys a $50,000+ value car for $40,000, or the people who rag on them because they spent $40,000 on a car worth over $50,000 because it didn't have the right brand logo?
There's two types of people in this world - status *****s, and smart people. The status *****s put 50% of their paycheck towards leasing a BMW/Mercedes/Lexus, and the smart ones find good deals like the Genesis and don't overextend themselves.
But the lemmings will keep being lemmings, I suppose.
There's two types of people in this world - status *****s, and smart people. The status *****s put 50% of their paycheck towards leasing a BMW/Mercedes/Lexus, and the smart ones find good deals like the Genesis and don't overextend themselves.
But the lemmings will keep being lemmings, I suppose.
That's not what I'm saying. I oversimplified, by going totally black and white. Plenty of smart people buy BMW/Benz/Lexus/etc. My point was that those people are almost certainly not the ones flinging monkey poop at the person who bought the $40k Hyundai, simply because it was a Hyundai.
The ones who are so insecure as to overlook the car for nothing but the badge tend to be the sorts who lease a stripped-out C-class/3-series because they get a borrowed sense of superiority from having that badge. Not because they analzyed the car on its own merits. Those who can legitimately afford a MB/BMW/Lexus generally have enough going for them in life that they don't attach their self-worth to the logo on their front bumper. Those are the lemmings - the ones who judge a car solely on its badge. Plenty of people pass on a car like the Genesis on its merits (and its lack thereof relative to more expensive vehicles, in many instances), and that's perfectly fine. But they aren't the ones taunting their co-workers for making the different choice.
The ones who are so insecure as to overlook the car for nothing but the badge tend to be the sorts who lease a stripped-out C-class/3-series because they get a borrowed sense of superiority from having that badge. Not because they analzyed the car on its own merits. Those who can legitimately afford a MB/BMW/Lexus generally have enough going for them in life that they don't attach their self-worth to the logo on their front bumper. Those are the lemmings - the ones who judge a car solely on its badge. Plenty of people pass on a car like the Genesis on its merits (and its lack thereof relative to more expensive vehicles, in many instances), and that's perfectly fine. But they aren't the ones taunting their co-workers for making the different choice.
Not sure why you're getting so reved up about this car. This "poop slinging" and "taunting" hasn't been going on here. Like Mike said, most people here have been open to looking at the new Hyundais and acknowledge the improvements. As good as they are, they still have a ways to go. Maybe they'll get there, maybe they won't, but to suggest that people that buy MB/BMW and Lexus are badge wh**es or idiots is simply ridiculous.
Some of us buy them because they're better vehicles that suit our needs best. If you want to discuss "bang for the buck" you likely have a legitimate argument. Is my ML worth $30K more than the Santa Fe I helped my best friend choose? Maybe not, but I'm still content with our decision and didn't buy it to impress anyone....other than my wife. She wanted it, we bought it. 'Nuff said.
05-31-11, 09:14 AM
#62
Lexus Fanatic
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The ones who are so insecure as to overlook the car for nothing but the badge tend to be the sorts who lease a stripped-out C-class/3-series because they get a borrowed sense of superiority from having that badge. Not because they analzyed the car on its own merits. Those who can legitimately afford a MB/BMW/Lexus generally have enough going for them in life that they don't attach their self-worth to the logo on their front bumper. Those are the lemmings - the ones who judge a car solely on its badge. Plenty of people pass on a car like the Genesis on its merits (and its lack thereof relative to more expensive vehicles, in many instances), and that's perfectly fine. But they aren't the ones taunting their co-workers for making the different choice.
NO ONE, buying ANY car, is objective about it. 
we all rationalize one way or another.and conversely people who claim to not to be badge oriented and all objective-like and go buy a hyundai genesis likely look condescendingly on the 'stupid' people who paid too much for bmws and lexus, right?
05-31-11, 09:57 AM
#63
Lexus Champion
Who is the idiot - someone who buys a $50,000+ value car for $40,000, or the people who rag on them because they spent $40,000 on a car worth over $50,000 because it didn't have the right brand logo?
There's two types of people in this world - status *****s, and smart people. The status *****s put 50% of their paycheck towards leasing a BMW/Mercedes/Lexus, and the smart ones find good deals like the Genesis and don't overextend themselves.
But the lemmings will keep being lemmings, I suppose.
There's two types of people in this world - status *****s, and smart people. The status *****s put 50% of their paycheck towards leasing a BMW/Mercedes/Lexus, and the smart ones find good deals like the Genesis and don't overextend themselves.
But the lemmings will keep being lemmings, I suppose.
The Hyundai badge doesn't really promise anything, and it's such a liability that Hyundai would rather not put it on the front end of cars they sell for luxury car money.
05-31-11, 05:56 PM
#64
Lexus Champion
Just the fact that we (and I'm sure other similar forums) are talking about this car that much is a win for Hyundai. Dollar for dollar, the GS-F (if it ever makes it to production) can't touch the R-spec Genesis. Would it beat it? I'm sure it would, but for $20-40K more, it better. As far as reliability goes, I haven't really heard of these new models of Hyundai's being stranded on the side of the road and they've been out for a few years now. Who am I to talk about them having **** poor quality when I drive a 2IS and it's been in for 3 or 4 recalls and more TSIB's than I can count?? 
05-31-11, 07:14 PM
#65
I feel like everytime a hyndai topic comes up, there is always a lot of disagreement and bashing of each other. One thing everyone needs to keep in mind is that everyone has an opinion, there is no need to argue about it or tell people what to do. My opinion towards this car is that it sounds very good, will it actually be as good as it sounds when it will be available in the dealers? Thats the general question that time can only tell. Lets not jump ahead of our selfs.
05-31-11, 07:25 PM
#66
I feel like everytime a hyndai topic comes up, there is always a lot of disagreement and bashing of each other. One thing everyone needs to keep in mind is that everyone has an opinion, there is no need to argue about it or tell people what to do. My opinion towards this car is that it sounds very good, will it actually be as good as it sounds when it will be available in the dealers? Thats the general question that time can only tell. Lets not jump ahead of our selfs.
best post in here
06-06-11, 02:08 AM
#67
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Yes, talk is cheap, and hype is cheap. The 4.6L Genesis can't even keep up with a GS460 with ****. I don't expect this 5.0L Genesis R-spec to be that much faster than a GS460 with ****.
So yes, I am very confident that when the GS F does come, it will easily smoke this Genesis, not just in performance, but in almost everything else.
By whom? By much of the automotive media, by Hyundai's own doing with their obnoxious marketing, and by many shills and "ghost bloggers" working for Hyundai who posted on automotive forums. Perfect example, the other day I saw a new Kia Optima commercial that featured Peter Schreyer, and the commercial called him "the best designer in the world". Excellent example of Hyundai's arrogant attitude.
Quality surveys, the significant problems Hyundai and Kia vehicles have been recalled for or are being investigated for. Also talking with numerous mechanics who work on tons of cars everyday, and know their stuff about which brands are quality and reliable and which are not.
so was lexus when it first came out! but the cars exuded "well put together ness" and were marketed as such with champagne glasses and marbles and the public were willing to give it a try and it all worked out.
hyundai marketing hasn't been as strong, but then they weren't hinging an entire new brand on the 3 vehicles (g sedan + coupe + equus), plus of course their dealers aren't as upscale as lexus, so it wouldn't make sense to go bananas on image marketing... just try to grow slow and make dealers better over time. it seems to be working.
hyundai marketing hasn't been as strong, but then they weren't hinging an entire new brand on the 3 vehicles (g sedan + coupe + equus), plus of course their dealers aren't as upscale as lexus, so it wouldn't make sense to go bananas on image marketing... just try to grow slow and make dealers better over time. it seems to be working.
as ridiculous as saying "lexus is relying on a lot of flashy hybrid gimmicks to desparately get attention from consumers who can't do math". The cramped back seats in the Sonata and Elantra for tall people for example. The not-so-great real world fuel economy of the Sonata, compared to EPA mileage figures. Just a few examples of things you can't notice just from paper specs or from first glance.
.Just the fact that we (and I'm sure other similar forums) are talking about this car that much is a win for Hyundai. Dollar for dollar, the GS-F (if it ever makes it to production) can't touch the R-spec Genesis. Would it beat it? I'm sure it would, but for $20-40K more, it better. As far as reliability goes, I haven't really heard of these new models of Hyundai's being stranded on the side of the road and they've been out for a few years now. Who am I to talk about them having **** poor quality when I drive a 2IS and it's been in for 3 or 4 recalls and more TSIB's than I can count??
For the most part, you get what you pay for.
06-06-11, 02:09 AM
#68
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Hyundai Genesis R-Spec Delayed due to NVH problems
http://wardsautoworld.com/ar/auto_hy...genesis_rspec/
HYUNDAI MOTOR AMERICA SAYS THE '12 Genesis R-Spec equipped with the auto maker's new 5.0L Tau V-8 is being delayed due to engine noise, vibration and harshness issues.
Michael O'Brien, vice president-corporate and product planning, says the premium car was to launch in March but now is scheduled to hit dealerships in the May-June timeframe.
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The NVH issue was discovered during routine internal testing prior to serial production of the vehicle, but after a handful of cars already had been delivered to customers in California.
“We have a small issue, nothing big, but it requires a bit of a correction,” O'Brien tells Ward's at the New York auto show. “So what we had to do was stop production to get this issue taken care of.”
O'Brien declines to pinpoint the exact problem but says all will be revealed once engineers complete a fix that is under way.
Such problems are not uncommon when developing a new engine, and sometimes they are not drastic enough to warrant a stop in production, he says.
“Every manufacturer tells you they want the best product,” he says. “Yet, at the same time, there are literally thousands of tradeoffs every research and development and planning person makes every day.
“If you are the best of everything, you'd have a $300,000 car,” O'Brien adds. “So at some point, you have to say there's a standard that's set, and you have to meet that standard.”
O'Brien says he is unaware of any complaints from the few owners who took delivery of the vehicles equipped with the engine.
Consumers who did purchase the car will be contacted by Hyundai and their vehicles will be fixed.
O'Brien is not sure if dealers have been informed of the situation, but there are plans to do so.
Other Hyundai vehicles with the 5.0L, including the Equus sedan, are not affected by the NVH issue because their production launch is later than the Genesis R-Spec.
Michael O'Brien, vice president-corporate and product planning, says the premium car was to launch in March but now is scheduled to hit dealerships in the May-June timeframe.
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The NVH issue was discovered during routine internal testing prior to serial production of the vehicle, but after a handful of cars already had been delivered to customers in California.
“We have a small issue, nothing big, but it requires a bit of a correction,” O'Brien tells Ward's at the New York auto show. “So what we had to do was stop production to get this issue taken care of.”
O'Brien declines to pinpoint the exact problem but says all will be revealed once engineers complete a fix that is under way.
Such problems are not uncommon when developing a new engine, and sometimes they are not drastic enough to warrant a stop in production, he says.
“Every manufacturer tells you they want the best product,” he says. “Yet, at the same time, there are literally thousands of tradeoffs every research and development and planning person makes every day.
“If you are the best of everything, you'd have a $300,000 car,” O'Brien adds. “So at some point, you have to say there's a standard that's set, and you have to meet that standard.”
O'Brien says he is unaware of any complaints from the few owners who took delivery of the vehicles equipped with the engine.
Consumers who did purchase the car will be contacted by Hyundai and their vehicles will be fixed.
O'Brien is not sure if dealers have been informed of the situation, but there are plans to do so.
Other Hyundai vehicles with the 5.0L, including the Equus sedan, are not affected by the NVH issue because their production launch is later than the Genesis R-Spec.
06-06-11, 06:23 AM
#69
Pole Position
In my opinion, the GS-F, (currently a fantasy) and the Genesis R (currently being produced) will never be competitors, nor are they ever meant to be, by either manufacturer.
06-06-11, 09:23 AM
#72
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06-06-11, 09:26 AM
#73
p.s. I dont know why is everyone focusing on "GS-F". GS sells 5 times less than E class and 5 series. Genesis is not taking any GS sales, it is taking German sedan sales by being 40k cheaper.
06-06-11, 10:24 AM
#74
Lexus Champion
It's not taking German sedan sales. The C class and 3 series both sell very well as do the 5 series and E class. Given its price point, size, power and features the Genesis has been selling poorly. For similar or more money people have opted for smaller less powerful cars like the A4, CTS, C-class and 3 series.
06-06-11, 10:27 AM
#75
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I posted up that Ward's Auto article simply to show that the Genesis had an engine NVH issue. For such a highly praised car, that we haven't even seen thoroughly tested yet, an engine NVH issue is not promising, especially as a few cars had been delivered already.
The Genesis is selling poorly I agree, given it's value, price, features, etc. Also keep in mind Genesis sales of the sedan and coupe remain combined. Hyundai refuses to separate sales.
Genesis is not taking sales from the Germans, or from the GS. It seems to have taken some sales away from other near-luxury brands, and possibly the Infiniti M.
I agree as well. Certain members here though did make such a comparison, a comparison which is pointless IMO.
The Genesis is selling poorly I agree, given it's value, price, features, etc. Also keep in mind Genesis sales of the sedan and coupe remain combined. Hyundai refuses to separate sales.
Genesis is not taking sales from the Germans, or from the GS. It seems to have taken some sales away from other near-luxury brands, and possibly the Infiniti M.
I agree as well. Certain members here though did make such a comparison, a comparison which is pointless IMO.
Last edited by TRDFantasy; 06-06-11 at 10:30 AM.