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Cars.com performs ultimate minivan shootout. Guess who won...

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Old 05-29-11, 01:41 PM
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Default Cars.com performs ultimate minivan shootout. Guess who won...

Cars.com performs ultimate minivan shootout. Guess who won...



Cars.com rounded up the year's crop of new minivans for a comparison, the rare thrill being that minivans from every major maker are completely fresh for 2011. The entrants were the Nissan Quest (pictured), Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, Chrysler Town & Country, Volkswagen Routan and Dodge Grand Caravan.

The testing format was also novel, in that Cars.com paired its own editors with reviewers from USA Today and the MotorWeek television show, plus the Weatherby family, an 'average' family of five - husband, wife and three kids.

After three days of testing and the tallying of numerous criteria, there was, of course, one 7-seater to rule them all. This review included both "It doesn't look like such a mommy car" and "Distressingly ugly in profile" categories.

It's not often you see an entire segment of the auto industry redone at the same time, but 2011 is a renaissance for minivans. All the major players in the group had some level of redesign, from new interiors to whole new vehicles debuting.

Cars.com, USA Today and "MotorWeek" put six of these new minivans to the test in Atlanta over three days, including one day with a suburban Atlanta family. The six minivans we tested were (in alphabetical order):

2011 Chrysler Town & Country
2011 Dodge Grand Caravan
2011 Honda Odyssey
2011 Nissan Quest
2011 Toyota Sienna
2011 Volkswagen Routan

We also sent two inquiries to Kia to try to include the Sedona in our tests, but the automaker did not respond to either request. We left out smaller, less-well-equipped vehicles, including the Mazda5 because the price points were different. Since this is the Ultimate Minivan Shootout, we capped the price at $45,000, not including destination charges.

Our reviewers were:

David Thomas, Cars.com senior editor
Kristin Varela, Cars.com senior editor
Jennifer Newman, Cars.com editor
James Healey, USA Today reviewer
Brian Robinson, "MotorWeek" producer and reviewer
The Weatherby family: Travis, Heather and their three kids.

We put the minivans through three days of tests:

- One-day mileage drive, which put the vans through roughly 175 miles of highway travel
- One day of round-robin expert driving, where each expert or team of experts drove the six vans over the same course for an hour
- One day of family testing and driving, where the Weatherby family compared the features and cargo space of each van, and then Travis drove each van over the same drive route to test for ride and handling, acceleration, braking and more

The experts' opinions fueled 65 percent of the final score; the Weatherby family, 25 percent. Fuel economy made up the final 10 percent of the score.
Fit for a Family

After a steep decline in the minivan market several years ago — Ford and GM pulled out of the segment altogether — minivans are making a comeback.


You can't argue with the minivan's functionality for busy families juggling life, careers, school and afterschool activities. And they're not just coming back in that retro-cool sort of way, like Converse sneakers. They're being completely redesigned and re-engineered for today's families, offering a mix of seating and cargo flexibility, high-tech entertainment features and even luxurious finishes and modern styling.

Our experts put six minivans to the test for our Ultimate Minivan Shootout in Atlanta. Of course, we asked a family to provide their unique perspective on how they take advantage of a minivan's usefulness in their daily lives.

Enter the Weatherbys. Travis and Heather Weatherby are parents to 15-year-old Colin; Loralei, 6; and Dexter, 1.

The Weatherbys used to drive a 2007 Honda Odyssey and loved it. However, for budget purposes, they traded it in for an older-model Chevy Suburban, which Travis says "fits us really well." Heather would love to get back into the ease of use of a minivan, and spending the day in the minivans in our Shootout seemed to reignite her love affair with family haulers.


When car shopping, it's important to clarify and prioritize the features most important to the family and stay focused on those. The Weatherbys have the added challenge of finding a car whose features appeal to the wide age range of their children.

When asked what family features are most important in a minivan, Travis answered, "The perfect blend of storage and seating space." What else? "Automatic everything, a third row with air vents, entertainment with rear controls to keep the kids occupied," Travis said, along with "window locks and plenty of legroom." The legroom is both for Dad and the gangly-legged teenager Colin.

However, like most of us carrying around our families daily, safety is the most important feature to the Weatherbys. After driving several of the minivans in the Shootout, Heather said, "I really liked the backup cameras and alarms for the blind spots when driving."

Beyond safety, Heather loved the keyless entry and push-button start offered in some of the minivans. "As I'm heading out, I can toss the keys in my purse or diaper bag and then not have to dig for them," she said. She also likes minivans that have seats that move or fold flat easily "so that my 6-year-old can operate them and help Mom out." Other key features for Heather? Cupholders that the kids can reach so they don't spill. "I also like the auto liftgate function," she said.

What about the cool factor? The only features of the Weatherbys' current car, an older Chevy Suburban, that have proven to be "uncool" to the whole family are the age of the vehicle and the fact that it's as big as a bus. Colin seemed unfazed by any sort of perceived status, or lack thereof, associated with being a teen and riding around in the back of a minivan, and he definitely didn't scoff at the undeniably cool technology in many of the minivans we tested.

Inside the Odyssey, Colin's eyes opened wide, and he said in a dazed tone, "Whoa — that's a huge TV. This is cool." For any teenager, that's an enthusiastic endorsement and pretty much sums up how the Weatherbys felt about the Odyssey.


After testing, Heather said, "I pretty much am in love with the Honda and want every feature it offers." However, if she could make any changes to improve it, she'd add a soundproof glass barrier "like a limousine."

If Travis had his way, he'd be driving around a "convertible minivan with four-wheel drive and zero-percent financing." Right. We won't be holding our breath for that one.
Mileage


Minivans aren't known for their frugalness at the pump. They're heavy, have the aerodynamics of a refrigerator, and they put carrying people and utility over fuel efficiency. It's clear after a 175-mile test route that one automaker put its focus on fuel efficiency.

The Honda Odyssey bested the group of six minivans with a tally of 25.9 mpg, according to the van's trip computer. That result surprised no one because the EPA highway ratings for the Odyssey are higher than the nearest competitor by a whopping 3 mpg, which is a lot in the minivan segment.

Car / EPA mileage (city/highway and combined) / Trip computer mpg
2011 Honda Odyssey Touring Elite / 19/28 (22) / 25.9
2011 Volkswagen Routan SE / 17/25 (20) / 25.1
2011 Chrysler Town & Country Limited / 17/25 (20) / 23.2
2011 Dodge Grand Caravan Crew / 17/25 (20) / 22.7
2011 Toyota Sienna XLE / 16/22 (18) / 22.0
2011 Nissan Quest SL / 19/24 (21) / 21.4

What caught our eye was the Volkswagen Routan's performance compared with its Chrysler Town & Country and Dodge Grand Caravan compadres, which share powertrains but were separated by roughly 2 mpg in the final readings. The Routan led the three at 25.1 mpg while the Town & Country measured 23.2 mpg and the Grand Caravan 22.7 mpg.

Volkswagen officials were also surprised by the results when we asked if there's any reason the VW should perform better than the Chrysler and Dodge, considering they share EPA ratings of 17/25 mpg. VW said that weight differences from the more feature-laden Dodge and Chrysler could have affected mileage.

Despite the Sienna's low EPA rating — helped by its class-exclusive all-wheel drive — the Sienna stayed above the bottom with a 22 mpg final reading, matching its highway rating. Our Sienna had the optional V-6 and all-wheel drive, the least fuel-efficient combo in the lineup. Base models have a standard four-cylinder engine with front-wheel drive that gets a 3 mpg bump in combined ratings.

Route & Methodology

We drove all six minivans from a location near the Atlanta airport to Macon, Ga., and back, mostly on two-lane highways and large four- and six-lane interstates. Six times during the drive we stopped to swap drivers, accounting for varying styles (and weight) of each driver. The route averaged 174.9 miles from the six odometer readings.

Before we departed, all tire pressures were set to manufacturer recommendations, and eco modes that changed driving characteristics for optimal fuel economy were turned off. Windows and sunroofs were closed, and air conditioning was kept on.
State of the Minivan: More Power, Improved Mileage


There has been a battle waged in the suburbs of America for the past 20 years, pitting SUVs against minivans: Would a family opt for the practicality of a minivan or the looks and performance of an SUV? Until the gas crisis of 2008, the SUV was clearly winning.

Now ... we're seeing the rise, once again, of the minivan.

Forget commercials selling swagger or even sex — we're looking at you, Honda — in this crop of modern minivans. The simple reality is, today's minivans pack as much power as their SUV counterparts with the same or better fuel economy, and they offer more comfort and room inside.

The lingering problem is the stigma of owning a minivan in the first place.

Go down any suburban street (take mine for instance) and the driveways alternate almost one to one, minivan, SUV, minivan, SUV and so on. Clearly, there's a divide, and much of it has to do with the number of kids in the family. Even with a nuclear family with two kids, transporting them and friends to school and other activities lends itself to driving one of these sliding-door-equipped modes of transport.

Sales back up this subtle shift back to the minivan. Recently, Honda has sold more of its new Odysseys than its Pilot three-row SUV. The Toyota Sienna has sold a bit slower than the company's Highlander SUV, but it's a close race. And the storied Chrysler Town & Country and Dodge Grand Caravan are leading the charge at the rebounding domestic automaker. Both models are the best-selling vehicles for their respective brands by a significant margin.


Since becoming a father, I've been given the keys to minivans in our test fleet more frequently than before my two little ones arrived. I've written reviews of the latest from Dodge, Honda and Nissan before taking part in our Ultimate Minivan Shootout. I've also been in the latest SUVs from Ford and Dodge, the popular Explorer and the just-released Durango, respectively.

What's the most surprising thing about minivans? It's not the space and utility. That's a given. It is the power and fuel efficiency, especially in the Odyssey.

The Odyssey returns 18/28 mpg city/highway with 248 horsepower, while a front-wheel-drive Explorer manages 17/25 mpg. Those are significant numbers with gas prices on the rise.

And if you're driving in the 'burbs, the vans won't underperform their heavier SUV competition in most regards. I doubt many families consider performance when shopping for a minivan, but if you think a V-6 Explorer is vastly superior to a V-6 minivan, you're wrong, unless you need foul-weather capabilities, that is.

Today's minivan also tops the SUV in the vital "spoiled kid" spec sheet. In most of today's SUVs, you don't get widescreen video players with ports for a gaming console and three spacious rows to watch them from. Or a third row that flips over for tailgate seating at soccer practice, like in the Grand Caravan, Town & Country and Volkswagen Routan. Heck, try sitting on the tailgate of the new Explorer. It's so high, only a teenager will be able to hop up there easily. And a tired mom or dad won't do that. There will also be less room for a lawn chair in an SUV — as much as 45 percent less if you opted for an Explorer over and Odyssey.


Price? Even though some minivans hit extravagant price points — like the $44,030 Honda Odyssey Touring Elite that we tested — it's easy to run up the price in a three-row crossover to that level like the Explorer I recently tested. And while it was well-equipped at $44,095, it had no DVD system at that price, let alone one with a 16-inch widescreen display and 650-watt surround sound system that rivaled any home theater I've ever encountered.

There's still that minivan stigma, though. I rattle off all the above reasons to friends and acquaintances asking my advice for a vehicle for their five-person family. I tell them how awesome these vans are. They generally want to know about three-row crossovers I recommend, and I offer my best guidance for both. Nine times out of 10, the people I talk to aren't swayed by my arguments. Perhaps it's because we live in Chicago with brutal winter snow. But as long as your suburban streets are plowed, today's vans are nearly as capable as a front-wheel-drive crossover or SUV, and they have a lower center of gravity.

Again, those advice seekers don't seem to care. They buy a Chevy Traverse, or a Mazda CX-9 or a Honda Pilot.

Somewhere out in the great American suburbia, there are savvy, practical-minded people rediscovering the best minivans to ever hit the market.
Results

No. 6: 2011 Toyota Sienna; 715.15 points


The term "disappointment" came up again and again in the comments from our expert reviewers when it came to the Sienna. Several noted that while they enjoyed the "Swagger Wagon" marketing for the redesigned minivan, in reality, it fell short of that title.

Pros: Thomas "found its performance quite good with a strong engine and exceptional handling," while Healey applauded the fact that the Sienna was the "only van available with all-wheel drive, a definite plus." Newman noted, "I like that the Sienna's exterior styling doesn't scream minivan."

Cons: The reviewers' disappointment showed itself in several ways. Many disliked the loud engine noise, while Varela noted the poor interior quality. Several commented that the "loungelike second-row seats" were "gimmicky."
"I'm just not that impressed with the Sienna," Travis Weatherby said. "I was expecting to be blown away." "It's comfortable enough," Robinson noted, "and although there are lots of ways to configure the seats, they're not the easiest or most intuitive to figure out."

Key Features

Price as tested: $41,144 (second most expensive of the six)
- 16/22 mpg; 18 mpg combined (worst in class)
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth connectivity, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- Only model with all-wheel drive
- Insurance Institute for Highway Safety Top Safety Pick
- 16.4-inch video screen in second row
- Lounge seats in second row with retractable foot rest
- Navigation
- Leather
- All windows have auto up and down
- Two 115-volt house-style power outlets
- Backup sensors

No. 5: 2011 Dodge Grand Caravan; 721.6 points


Although it wound up at No. 5 on our list, the Grand Caravan earned plenty of props for its low cost and high number of features. "Price is a big bonus," Robinson said. It's "extremely well equipped for $34,000." Still, in a field that was pretty evenly matched, it fell short. "For minivan drivers on a budget, this one is for you," Varela said, adding, "Just don't compare it to other minivans on the market."

Pros: "One of my favorite features in the Grand Caravan was the second-row cupholders that slide out of the back of the center console," Newman said. Several reviewers liked the high number of features for the lowest price among the competitors. "Say what you want about the lack of comfort to the Stow 'n Go seating, I love the under-floor storage that it provides when the seats are up," Robinson noted.

Cons: "A bit disappointing," Healey said, "given that it's so similar to the [Chrysler] Town & Country. Seemed downscale, coarser." "While powerful, the new Pentastar V-6 is noisy," Robinson said, "and fuel mileage, while better than before, is still not that great." "The cloth seats alone would make this a no-go, in my book, for families," Varela said. "If there's a poster child for competency, it's the Grand Caravan," Thomas wrote. "It's good at everything, yet excels at nothing."

Key Features

Price as tested: $34,055 (least expensive of the six)
- 17/25 mpg; 20 mpg combined
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- 9-inch video screen in second row
- Manual third row with tailgate seating
- Remote start
- Navigation
- Cloth seating
- Heated second-row seats, heated steering wheel
- Flat-folding second row
- 115-volt house-style power outlet

No. 4: 2011 Volkswagen Routan; 757 points


The Volkswagen is in an interesting place. It shares a lot with the two Chrysler minivans in this Shootout, but it retains much of the older, pre-redesigned Chrysler look and feel, though it does have the same, new V-6 engine. It has a slightly changed exterior, and it doesn't have the Stow 'n Go seats. Overall, our reviewers and family felt it was an intriguing choice, both for its value as well as for its VW background.

Pros: "I grew more fond of the Routan as the family inspected it," Thomas said. "When they saw it was priced the same as the Dodge, but added a second DVD screen and leatherette seats, it was easy to be swayed. That swayed me, too." Robinson liked the "European tuning. OK, it's probably not actually tuned in Europe, but the Chrysler vans are already pretty good handlers, and this one seems a bit better." Healey felt that the Routan "has much nicer seats than the Chryslers." "It looks like a 10 all around," Travis Weatherby said, "because of the price point." Newman called it "wonderfully quiet."

Cons: "It carries over the obnoxious center stack, rickety gearshift lever and awkward interior front-door handles of the previous version," Healey said. "It's missing VW's legendary styling," Newman added. "How can this feel cheaper than the Grand Caravan?" Robinson asked, and Varela noted that "there's no telescoping steering wheel. Wow. What year is this?" She damned it with faint praise: "The Routan looks and feels like a really well-kept and clean rental car that's not quite up to par with how other vehicles have evolved over the past couple of years."

Key Features

Price as tested: $34,750 (second least expensive of the six)
- 17/25 mpg; 20 mpg combined
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- Dual 9-inch video screens for second and third rows
- Navigation
- Leatherette seating (simulated leather)
- Tailgate seating for third row

No. 3: 2011 Nissan Quest; 769.1 points


Nissan returns to the minivan game after taking a couple of years off, and the reviewers were largely happy with the results. The combination of a high-quality interior with an extremely quiet and comfortable ride helped it score highly against the more established competition. Still, it's not without its faults.

Pros: "This is a different level," Travis Weatherby said about the Quest's interior, which said a lot since the Quest was the last van he drove for the day. "If there was a van I'd buy, this would be it," Thomas raved. "The fact that you can fold all of the seats flat in the Quest without having to remove any of them is fantastic," Varela added. "The Quest's mixture of chrome and faux wood trim was understated and looked luxurious," Newman said.

Cons: Healey was less impressed. "Odd-looking, pricey, not especially well-suited to the American market, but boy, those seats are great." Odd-looking was a common refrain. "I still don't care for its ugly squared-off rear that makes it look like a brick on wheels," Newman said. On the other hand, Robinson applauded that look: "I like that the styling is still big, boxy and minivan-looking." Still, he didn't care for "the smell of cheap leather." Both Robinson and Travis questioned why a $38,000 van wouldn't have navigation. "Navigation is almost standard today, isn't it?" Travis said.

Key Features

Price as tested: $38,040 (fourth most expensive of the six)
- 19/24 mpg; 21 mpg combined
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- 11-inch screen in second row
- Dual moonroofs
- Only model without navigation
- Crossover-SUV-like folding second row
- Leather
- Removable second-row center console
- 115-volt house-style power outlet

No. 2: 2011 Chrysler Town & Country; 822.4 points


Chrysler has long been the minivan king, with the success of both the Grand Caravan and the Town & Country. For 2011, both were redesigned extensively, with new interiors and engines. The changes to the Town & Country wore well for our reviewers and our test family, which liked not only how the interior looked, but also appreciated its smooth ride, quick engine and overall flexibility. "I liked the Honda, but I might like this better," Heather Weatherby said.

Pros: "Generally excellent," Healey raved, a thought seconded by Thomas: "I couldn't believe how upscale the Chrysler interior was versus the Dodge." "I'm not a Dodge guy," Travis Weatherby said, "but I'm impressed by this Chrysler. You can't beat the horsepower in this thing. It makes you feel fancy driving it." "The Stow 'n Go captain's chairs, combined with a power folding third row, easily make the T&C the most flexible minivan we tested," Varela said. "This might be the simplest minivan to live with."

Cons: "Like the Grand Caravan, the loud engine noise is inconsistent with the level of luxury on the interior," Robinson noted. "I felt a little claustrophobic and smooshed up against the windshield," Varela said. "The Stow 'n Go seat storage compromises comfort," Healey noted, while Newman bemoaned the lack of visibility: "Seeing out the rear window was difficult because the second-row head restraints got in the way."

Key Features

Price as tested: $40,835 (third most expensive of the six)
17/25 mpg; 20 mpg combined
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- Dual 9-inch video screens for second and third rows
- Power folding third row with tailgate seating
- Navigation
- Remote start
- Leather
- Heated front- and second-row seats, heated steering wheel
- Flat-folding second row
- 115-volt house-style power outlet
- Blind spot monitoring system
- Backup radar

And the winner is ...
No. 1: 2011 Honda Odyssey; 854.55 points


"The Odyssey has the most updated and modern exterior styling without being too strong or offensive," Varela wrote, and the others agreed. Our family may have been a little biased toward the Odyssey since they previously owned one. The combination of ride, features and handling made this one the winner for our experts and our family. And while you may think that the more expensive a van is — and the Odyssey was the priciest van in our Shootout — the better it will perform, please note that the Sienna, the second most expensive van, came in last.

Pros: "It doesn't look like such a mommy car," Heather said. "I love the smooth, powerful, nearly carlike ride," Varela chimed in. "Satisfying to drive," Healey said, and it "gets good mileage for a van." "Only two of the vans" stereos impressed me," Thomas said, "and the Odyssey did the most impressing." "The outboard seats in the second row are the comfiest seats in the Shootout, and the expandable second row seats three car seats," Newman noted. "By far the best handling of the bunch!" Robinson enthused. "It really comes down to which van fits you best as far as comfort and use of controls, and for me, it's the Honda Odyssey," he said. "One thing I think this shootout proved was just how good the Odyssey is," Thomas wrapped up. "It does everything very well."

Cons: That look. It's angular, it's different, and our reviewers either loved it or hated it. "Crossover-like styling fools no one," Robinson said. "Looks atrocious." "Distressingly ugly in profile," Healey agreed. The Weatherbys and Thomas were happy with the looks, though. For Newman, "a lot of road noise crept into the cabin." And, she noticed, "the Odyssey has floppy seat belt buckles, which are a major annoyance to older kids in booster seats." And finally, Varela pointed out, "For more than $42,000, I demand power folding third-row seats. I'm also surprised at this price point that the Odyssey doesn't have push-button start. Seriously, I have to use a key to start it? How retro."

Key Features

Price as tested: $43,250 (most expensive)
19/28 mpg; 22 mpg combined (best in class)
Features common to all vans: Bluetooth, power sliding doors, power liftgate, some form of rear entertainment, V-6 engine and a backup camera
- 16.2-inch video screen in second row with HDMI input
- Navigation
- Only minivan with room for eight occupants
- NHTSA five-star overall score (revised 2011 methodology)
- Second row has adjustable seat width and removable center seat
- Leather
- 115-volt house-style power outlet
- Blind spot monitoring system
- Backup radar

Score cards can be found here next to each minivans picture:
http://www.cars.com/go/crp/buyingGui...w&aff=national
http://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/29/c...guess-who-won/
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Old 05-29-11, 03:24 PM
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Aren't Caravan and T&C essentially the same vehicle?
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Old 05-29-11, 03:29 PM
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spwolf
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i am sorry, but calculating mileage on trip computer mpg shows them as amateurs.
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Old 05-29-11, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by spwolf
i am sorry, but calculating mileage on trip computer mpg shows them as amateurs.
I agree. But probably the way most mini van owners/drivers would do it.
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Old 05-29-11, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by LexBob2
I agree. But probably the way most mini van owners/drivers would do it.
thats like doing 0-60 by the "feeling" because thats how most drivers would experience it :-).

If you are reviewing cars, and especially family cars, make tiny bit of effort and get your readers correct MPG info. It is very important to them.
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Old 05-29-11, 05:26 PM
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If I was buying a van today it would be between the Nissan and the Toyota for me.
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Old 05-29-11, 09:45 PM
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Honda odyssey all the way, that thing grew on me a lot.
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Old 05-30-11, 01:29 AM
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seinna #6? my friend just bought one.. its a great car!
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Old 05-30-11, 05:48 AM
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Originally Posted by I8ABMR
If I was buying a van today it would be between the Nissan and the Toyota for me.
Yep, Routan 3rd.... and love our Sienna, I'd get AWD this time
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Old 05-30-11, 07:14 AM
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putting a picture of the sienna in the top of the OP with "guess who won" implies the sienna won.
edit: oh wait, that's a quest right? they all look so similar and ugly.
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Old 05-30-11, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by spwolf
i am sorry, but calculating mileage on trip computer mpg shows them as amateurs.
i think what it means is they didn't 'calculate' anything, it's just the number the car shows (mpg).
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Old 05-30-11, 07:20 AM
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dodge and chrysler models look like the originals from the 80s.
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Old 05-30-11, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by I8ABMR
If I was buying a van today it would be between the Nissan and the Toyota for me.
Agreed.

Although I'm starting to like this new Odyssey *a bit*. I've seen a few those here in the country (but mostly for employees of the US Embassy in Manila)
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Old 05-30-11, 08:21 AM
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Odyssey and Sienna have always been interchangeable for me at 1 and 2 depending on the model year, but lately Sienna has been taking more charge with its design and features.

When I moved to Mexico, the Odyssey was the minivan of choice if you had the money until the Sienna came in a few years later (a few years after Toyota had opened its doors in 2002).

Although the U.S. minivans were there, they were regarded as junk for the most part. However, there was a thriving trade (for people such as my Uncle Antonio) to bring in nationalized U.S. minivans from the U.S./Mexico border area.
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Old 05-30-11, 10:06 AM
  #15  
LexFather
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I wouldn't pay 44k for an Acura let alone a Honda. These van prices are nuts to me, I'd just get a used R-class or something.


And yes the Quest is my favorite unless it was a Sienna SE.

Last edited by LexFather; 05-30-11 at 10:12 AM.
 


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