BNR34

iTrader: (1)

I know mmarshall did a review already, I hope is ok to post my review. I finally got a chance to check out an Equus thoroughly and test drove it, here is my take:

My daily driver is a 05' LS430 UL which I drove for the past 3.5 years, I know the Equus really should be compare to a LS460, but from my experiences, the LS460 feels just like the LS430 except for a few minor updates, so I pretty much see them as equal.

This is my 1st time checking out an Equus up close in person, before I did this, I always thought the Equus is a great value. After my test drive today, I no longer see it as a huge value, you are just paying less for less.

In a nutshell, it is a LS460L with the fit and finish of a ES350. I like all the latest features and amenities that I am missing in my LS430 UL, heated steering wheel, massaging driver seat, power side curtains, power trunk lid. But the fit and finish is no where near a LS430/LS460, you look at a LS, the fit and finish is world class, it looks awesome everywhere. On the Equus, you can feel it being low rent, the chrome finish on the wheel is the worst, it is rough and looks low grade.

The main thing I really dislike is the floaty feeling of the air suspension, it gave me some mild motion sickness. It is floaty in soft mode, sport mode only introduced some harshness but the floaty feeling is still there. I read this from a magazine article and I confirmed it. Body roll control is excellent though, it must have some huge sway bars, it handles pretty good, the damping of the shock just need a tad more firmness to dial out the floaty feelings.

The 2nd thing I don't like is the lack of adjustable mode for the throttle and transmission response, so they pick something right in between. On my LS430, comfort mode is fully relax and sport mode is very responsive. On the Equus being tuned for right in between, it is never fully relax and is too sluggish to be responsive. This is a no no for me.

The last thing is, it only feel as fast or powerful as my 300 hp LS430, and this Equus got 385 hp from it's 4.6L V8. The car is about 400 lbs heavier, but it shouldn't matter much at speed. Even from a roll at speed, it only feel as fast as my 300 hp LS430.

Conclusion is, the Equus is a low grade LS460L for less money. You are getting what you pay for. It is great to have a low cost alternative though. For people who don't know or care or notice how awesome a LS460L, S-Class, 7-Series, A8 are, the Equus is an awesome car. It allow people with lower budget a chance to own a full size luxury car with all the features and amenities.

There is big hope for the next generation, with the 5.0L V8 / 8-speeds, if they fix the suspension tuning, up the fit and finish a bit, it can definitely be a Lexus LS competitor. But when that happen, it will also cost about the same as a Lexus LS. As seen by the Sonata today that cost the same as a Camry and Accord.

The thing I appreciate the most is the Equus definitely give Lexus pressure to make a better future generation LS. Since Acura and Infiniti don't even try to compete on this level, I give Hyundai the credit for making the Equus.

Mr. Burns

Making an LS grade car will cost about as much as an LS to sell (if not more for a company like Hyundai), and no Hyundai would sell when buyers are given the option of a luxury brand for similar coin. The S-class has always been grossly overpriced, which is why Lexus has been able to get away with offering just a good as car for much less. But as far as large luxury sedans go the LS leaves little room for flexibility, and a cheaper Equus will always be a grade below, if not on the surface, certainly in places you cannot see.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Great review, thanks for sharing!

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

You summed it up perfectly

Yes it is not possible to make a LS grade car for any cheaper then a LS, unless the company is willing to lose money by selling it below cost.

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

You are welcome

There are many things I didn't mention, I try to keep it short.

One thing the Equus have that a Lexus LS is missing in a huge way, is the stance of the car. The Equus got a great ride height with pretty small fender gap, and the staggered size wheel/tire sit pretty flush with the fender, it is pretty much at the AMG/M/Audi RS level.

Lexus is seriously lacking in this area, even the IS-F got a pretty bad stock stance.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

before the LS, the same might have been said about the S class.

it can always be done cheaper. the LS is a great car, but it's not in the same league as an S class, just as the Equus is a great car, but not (quite) in the same league as the LS. you get what you pay for.

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

I think the Japanese have pretty much maximized the quality vs. price ratio though, where the Europeans certainly didn't. I don't know if I can agree to what you said, unless it is made by child labor in China/India/Mexico...........but then the quality won't be there.

Looks what happened with the Chevy Sonic's brakes that were assembled in Mexico?

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...rake-pads.html

rominl

iTrader: (4)

japanese probably know how to do it better, but i would not agree on the "maximized" part. there is always a way to do things better, that should always be the mentality. plus per what you say, if the ls460 is really just ls430 with some upgrades, then lexus is charging quite a bit more money for it j/k.

your review is similar to what i see on hyundai on their luxury line. people don't believe but i keep on saying it's good value for the car, but the fit and finish (and material quality) is what keeping it from the real major league.

and fwiw, i just have to say, build quality of ls430 is superior to ls460

and very nice review, short but very to the point!

spwolf

sure, in some ways, LS is league above S class.

Joeb427

iTrader: (1)

I agree on the LS vs S Class.The S Class has much more classier.The LS more reliable.
Also agree on the Equus.
I saw one at the NY car show and found the interior plastics to be a bit cheap looking.

GS3Tek

iTrader: (8)

I agree with you on the stance and (to me) it does have some presence.

I didn't get enough time to exam the car when it was the OC autoshow, but the feel of the thin leather was a turn off for me

Kudos to hyundai at least for having a V8 flagship, unlike the other 2 Japanese carmakers.

mmarshall

I actually didn't get as long or varied of a test-drive in the Equus I reviewed as I would have liked...but I did get enough for a basic review. Your test-drive may (?) have been longer than mine.

The LS460, like most new/redesigned vehicles these days, has lower-profile tires and slightly stiffer underpinnings than the LS430 it replaced. Thay usually translates into a firmer fide.....as with the 460.

You do get less in some areas......but not as much as a lot of people think. The biggest difference is probably the choice of only four exterior colors on the Equus, which, IMO, is an insult. The Equus, however, even at a lower price, counters that with a much longer warranty than Lexus, though it is not transferable outside the immediate family.


Perhaps to the fit-finish of the older (and, IMO, superior) pre-2006 ES330. The Equus fit/finish, IMO, except for possibly the paint-job, is superior to the newer ES350 models.


Exterior, I'd have to agree with you...the Lexus paint job is better. But I didn't see that as the case inside. The Equus is every bit as plush as the LS460. The LS460, though, was slightly quieter on the road.....it has a reputation, of course, for being one of the quietest cars on the road.


Look at the acres of real wood-trim in the Equus interior. It is hard, IMO, to call it low-rent.




Traditional luxury-car buyers like (and want) a soft, floating ride. As more and more so-called "luxury" cars these days are discontinued or become sport-sedans in reality, that true "luxury" soft ride is getting harder and harder to find. In my experience, it is now almost extinct.


In general, I agree, although, overall, I think you downrate the Equus a little too much in comparison to the LS and S-Class.



Thanks for your input......overall, a good review.

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

I know that precisely by heart Just never say it out loud to offend any LS460 owners

The LS430 is superior in just about everyways to the LS460, the 460 just got all the modern features and amenities, a bigger engine and 2 more speeds. That's why I call it a few updates. If I close my eyes in both cars, I can hardly tell a difference of how they feel.

This is why I love my 430 so much and never crave a 460. The 600 is cooler just because of the extra leather coverage, plus the coolness of the silent hybrid operation. But then the V8 and the car itself is so quiet already, the hybrid drive don't make a huge NVH differences as does in the harsh 4 cyls Prius.

mmarshall

Build-quality cheapening occurred in several Lexus products after about 2005, not just in the LS. The biggest letdown, I thought, was the ES350 compared to the 330 before it. Some improvements were made, however, to the ES for 2010 (without a total redesign) , and it has gained some of that quality and fit/finish back.

BNR34

iTrader: (1)

Several? From my observations, it applied to the entire line of Scion/Toyota/Lexus products, every single models from the Scion Xd to the LS600hL. Something happened within TMC that they decided to go cheap for the 06'+ model generation. I think Toyota just got arrogant by their huge success, they got relaxed, they feel they don't have to do as good anymore. That happens to everyone, MB's lowest point was from 1999-2006.

Well maybe except the LFA, but I don't really count that. There is no previous generation LFA to reference to either.

Yes the 06' ES330 is the best ES made so far.