LexFather

I'm sorry but I completely disagree. What made "M" so special was the manual when everyone else offered automatics only. Now you guys are telling me the manual doesn't mean much and the car is too heavy anyway. So then they really lost the plot if the car is heavy as hell and the manual is not a priority. Again at this point, just get an AMG or RS car etc. I've read countless threads on the internet "OMG NO MANUAL CAR SUCKS" and now its okay to not have a manual? I assume we all have assimilated?

What made the E39 M5 kick *** in every comparo and still be loved today was its manual gearbox when everyone else had an auto. It never came close to losing. The M5 had a wonderful V-10 when everyone else had a V-8 or forced induction. THey forced SMG on people and the manual could not disable traction control. For the first time other vehicles beat the M5 in comparos and the gap closed. Now with the F10, it is like an AMG car if you don't get a manual. Twin Turbos, Automatic/SMG and even based off a heavier car.

I completely understand why, its for sales, its to save money. To me the specialness is lost.


I am sorry I completely disagree. There is a reason Porsche dominates every comparison and won Car of the Year again against pricier competition. Even if its slower around the track. Do you think these cars are mostly driven on the track? No, they are incredible cars to flaunt you bought the top of the line.

The Manual. The Connection with the vehicle. We all know an automatic is faster, every car with the auto is now faster than the manual. Its missing the point.

The world needs flawed, ****ed up, manuals as well as automatics, CVTs etc. There is nothing like getting in a car and shifting for yourself.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

Porsche admits their PDK is much quicker than their manual. To that end they made the worlds first 7-speed manual - they know whats up

rocks

DCT is not an automatic transmission, it is dual clutches that are operated electronically, huge difference. The mighty LFA uses a similar type of transmission. The DCT has been over-engineered to handle all the torque that this car can produce. I highly doubt this manual transmission will be up to that task. People hated the SMG in the e60 because it was jerky, a real hassle especially in city driving. DCT is superior in all aspects compared to the SMG system.

ISBU

^^ LFA doesn't use DCT. It uses a true manual trans and controlled electronically. Toyota don't have a DCT trans yet. They believed that they can match the speed of the DCT with their automatic trans.

Justin2JZ

I actually like the fact that BMW is offering a conventional stick option. If i had the $$$ for a F10, I'd get the stick because I'd prefer to row my own gears. Bimmer actually listened, as stated previously, all the trolls will finally shut up with the b×tching about how the car sucks with only the dct. Even if a small number of units sell, its still nice to know that they're offering a 6 speed option.

rotaryrock

Sadly this may be the last M5 model that will get manual transmission. I love dual clutch type transmissions but I hate that they're killing off manuals.

adamls2

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

eggwoll

iTrader: (9)

Quoted for the truth. Just rowing through gears on a proper manual transmission brings a huge smile to my face.

Blackraven

That is true.

But as to how far it will go, we'll have to see. On another front, the take rate for stick shift Panamera is so low that Porsche didn't bother to put one when the Panamera GTS came out a few months ago.

But point is. For purists out there, enjoy the only few stick shift vehicles that are left in the sports car/performance car category. With Ferrari and Lambo abandoning the stick as well as Mclaren, Bugatti, Koennigsegg, etc., stick shift fast cars are starting to become a decaying breed.

P.S.
On another note:
How many people even bother to buy Lexus 2IS vehicles with a stick shift these days?

rominl

iTrader: (4)

no, lexus chose single clutch for the lfa because they want the feeling of shifting, as well as weight saving. they know dct is faster

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

that's simply impossible. software beats pedals-heel-toe
ask any f1 driver.

qft, but people want what they want, and a FEW people want sticks and bmw is offering it, so not sure what the problem is for anyone.

again, qft.

as you say, subjective, but i do enjoy a stick in a small light car like my old miata! in a heavy rocket? no thanks.

of course these threads are on the internet, mostly by shrill enthusiasts who have neither the budget or the intention of actually buying an M5, manual or no.

are you saying having the manual is for sales and saving money? if so, yes it's for sales, but i'm sure it's not saving them money. it's a hassle making an additional model few will actually buy.

if you're saying NOT having the manual is for sales and saving money, then it confirms there wasn't money to be made by making one anyway.

i agree - some want that visceral stick shift they usually don't drive very well. i lol at people who have a stick Viper, good luck EVER making smooth shifts on that beast. but hey, that's what some people want. but each mfr has to decide what %age of their market wants a stick to determine if it's worth it. in the m5 case bmw obviously heard enough that they couldn't ignore it. so we have it this time around. next time, maybe not.

that's true! of course most people can't even drive a stick, let alone drive it well, but i digress.

for a car as powerful as an M5 or a Viper, there might even be a liability/safety issue as people crash, not realizing the vast rush of torque (and possibly steering impact) that happens when letting out that stiff clutch.

i like it too, but since neither you nor i have the $$$, our opinions, while scintillating, is irrelevant.

qft.

STIG

did I just read that right? 6 speed manual is going to be a no cost option? lol. Any car company ever charged for a manual trasmission?

Anyhow, kudos to BMW for still offering the proper transmission for the real drivers. Something about dancing the pedals makes that much more enjoyable to drive. 6MT for the win!

blacksc400

iTrader: (4)

Agree, Manual should be offered with lower pricing.

DustinV

A large number of Porsches delivered to customers in this day and age are equipped with the PDK transmission. And many of these customers are into serious track racing competition. The PDK offers them several advantages.

I seriously doubt that such an experience, racing a PDK-equipped Porsche on a race track, could be described as "boring" just because the car doesn't have a manual transmission.

Besides, Porsche still offers buyers the option of a manual transmission, but serious racers and even enthusiasts are opting for the PDK.



A manual transmission "connects" you with the engine only - not the rest of the vehicle.

A manual transmission has no effect on the grip qualities of the tires, the suspension setup, the steering feedback and setup and so forth. These are other important aspects which form the basis of the entire driving experience.

DustinV

You bring up an excellent point regarding torquey cars like the performance Vipers (or Mercedes AMGs). They have so much torque that launching the car, controlling the car and driving it safely is something left to the professionals.

Most people seem to think that because they can operate their 5-speed M/T Honda Civic, they can operate a torquemonster of an AMG Mercedes with a manual transmission, if it had one. Um, no.