Five popular cars to avoid
#46
Just because it's reliable doesn't mean CR should automatically recommend it. There's plenty of other alternatives out there for the Smiths that, overall, including reliability, are good choices. But--the Smiths shouldn't just read a headline and buy a car based on THAT. If the Smiths read the reasons that CR doesn't like the Civic (or any of the other cars on the list), and those reasons just aren't important to them, they will go ahead and buy it anyway--and probably be perfectly happy.
It's not like CR gave it one of their "Don't Buy" warnings.
It's not like CR gave it one of their "Don't Buy" warnings.
#47
Using sales is a tactic used by amateurs decades ago. McDonalds then is champ of good burgers. Remember the 1997 Camry? It was just like this Civic, a terribly uninspired redesign that sold like hotcakes. That doesn't mean that is a great car it was not, it was average.
I think we need a sub-forum of Car Chat for enthusiasts then. B/C Bean-counters are being real vocal defending cars for non-enthusiasts and making up every reason against enthusiasts and cars they love and prefer.
#48
Great incentives or not,YTD July 186K '12 Civics were sold compared to 142K '11 Civics.A 32% increase in sales YTY.
They're out there.
I was about to buy one for my son having had a '08 with 106K trouble free miles but the family talked me into a '13 Elantra.Nicer car but I just don't have the confidence in it as I did with the Civic.
I could care less about hard plastics,interior look etc on a Civic.The reliability is important to me.
They're out there.
I was about to buy one for my son having had a '08 with 106K trouble free miles but the family talked me into a '13 Elantra.Nicer car but I just don't have the confidence in it as I did with the Civic.
I could care less about hard plastics,interior look etc on a Civic.The reliability is important to me.
The Elantra was a good purchase. Hyundai has really come along way over the years. I too don't mind the hard plastics on the Civics. Like you said, reliability is what's important.
#49
The thing is, we're not the mainstream. We're the nut job car freaks. And that applies to this board and other car boards that I go on for wildly different stuff (I have a very eclectic group of cars).
But I also work in the car business, and the extreme vast majority of the public doesn't care about what we care about. I can remember last summer when the Elantra was the hottest thing on the market and you just couldn't get them, the lease on them was competitive, but the Corolla and Civic were and are cheaper. Both are inferior cars, IMO the Corolla especially so. But what would happen? "yeah the Elantra is nice and all but the Corolla is $25 a month less". That's what it really boils down to, and why Honda is selling Civics. Is the car a failure from our standpoint? Yup. So is the insight, but my best friends father leased one for his girlfriend, $150 a month with $1000 at signing. For that kind of money the car cold have been called the Schmuckface 1000 and people will buy em.
But I also work in the car business, and the extreme vast majority of the public doesn't care about what we care about. I can remember last summer when the Elantra was the hottest thing on the market and you just couldn't get them, the lease on them was competitive, but the Corolla and Civic were and are cheaper. Both are inferior cars, IMO the Corolla especially so. But what would happen? "yeah the Elantra is nice and all but the Corolla is $25 a month less". That's what it really boils down to, and why Honda is selling Civics. Is the car a failure from our standpoint? Yup. So is the insight, but my best friends father leased one for his girlfriend, $150 a month with $1000 at signing. For that kind of money the car cold have been called the Schmuckface 1000 and people will buy em.
#50
The scorn heaped on the Honda Civic has nothing to do with the fact that it is not for "enthusiasts." The scorn comes because Honda's products, including the Civic, are frequently overrated and over-hyped and because the company has been known to treat its customers like dirt at times. There is nothing wrong with saying such things in this forum and there is a lot right about it. In my view--and it is purely my view--Honda has boring styling, mediocre performance and so-so durability. Ever see an old Honda? They don't hold up well. I think Honda has built a cult-like following because the people who originally bought its cars were mainly driven by cheapness but couldn't bring themselves to admit it in their yuppy circles. So they told the world that they bought their Honda not because it was cheap but because Hondas are great. Giving an opposing view is useful in a forum designed for people who at the very least are interested in cars. Everyone can decide which postings to believe and which to reject. And for the record, among Japanese carmakers Toyota has long been the leader in quality.
#51
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
I think we need a sub-forum of Car Chat for enthusiasts then.
Even the auto-press itself, though, to a lesser extent, varies in their view and use of the term. Take the MotorWeek TV show, for example, and John Davis, their chief auto-tester (I casually know John, BTW, but he's not a close friend of mine). John, as I see him, is every bit an "enthusiast" ...heck, he makes his living test-driving and valuating cars. But, unlike some of his contemporaries at, say, Car and Driver or Road and Track, he's not over-aggressive, pushing cars to their absolute (or beyond) their limits .
Last edited by mmarshall; 08-12-12 at 06:15 PM.
#52
How, then, would you define the term "enthusiast"? You, me, Paul, Hoovey, Ryan, Fizzboy, and any other posters in this forum probably all fit that definiton in different ways, and in how we evaluate and look at a car. I for one, to give an example, am an "enthusiast" that (also) just happens to like a number of vehicles that much of the auto-press would not consider in that category
Last edited by bitkahuna; 08-12-12 at 06:09 PM.
#53
Yes....using that definition, the SEMA show, which some CL members attend, would probably be the ultimate "enthusiast" gathering.
#54
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Enjoy your Civic's.
Last year's SEMA was very interesting with all the feedback from CL members, this year I can't wait to meet up with Lexus and some of the real leaders from Cali. Would you like the topic of discussion?
Last year's SEMA was very interesting with all the feedback from CL members, this year I can't wait to meet up with Lexus and some of the real leaders from Cali. Would you like the topic of discussion?
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