Cars with Soul
08-09-12, 11:00 PM
#1
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Cars with Soul
So I was watching this video
http://vimeo.com/44666145
I got to thinking; when talking with auto enthusiasts you often hear the term "soul" being mentioned. Some might say a BMW E30 M3 has soul but a GT-R does not. But what is "soul", what defines whether a car has this much soul or that much soul? Is it racing pedigree, heritage, beauty, driving experience or tech specs?
Of course soul is probably a subjective feeling, but is it possible to define the essence of car having soul?
What cars do you consider to have soul?
List 1 modern example (current production).
Some cars that come to mind
Porsche 911(930,993), 550 Spyder
Benz 770 K
1st gen Viper
1970 skyline
vw Beetle
2012....I cant think of one at the moment. So is age another factor???
http://vimeo.com/44666145
I got to thinking; when talking with auto enthusiasts you often hear the term "soul" being mentioned. Some might say a BMW E30 M3 has soul but a GT-R does not. But what is "soul", what defines whether a car has this much soul or that much soul? Is it racing pedigree, heritage, beauty, driving experience or tech specs?
Of course soul is probably a subjective feeling, but is it possible to define the essence of car having soul?
What cars do you consider to have soul?
List 1 modern example (current production).
Some cars that come to mind
Porsche 911(930,993), 550 Spyder
Benz 770 K
1st gen Viper
1970 skyline
vw Beetle
2012....I cant think of one at the moment. So is age another factor???
Last edited by shoehead; 08-09-12 at 11:05 PM.
08-10-12, 12:29 AM
#3
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To me "soul" and "personality" are just traits that stand out on a given car. Similar to a car that is completely incompetent, a car that is totally competent and predictable in all areas will not strike a deep impression on people, and therefore are not perceived as quirky and memorable.
Sports cars (particularly Italian and English ones) tend to stand out because they force significant compromises (practicality, cost, reliability) that most buyers are unwilling to accept as a daily vehicle. Then they provide visceral entertainment (performance, sound, appearance), which allows them to stand out in people's memories.
Sports cars (particularly Italian and English ones) tend to stand out because they force significant compromises (practicality, cost, reliability) that most buyers are unwilling to accept as a daily vehicle. Then they provide visceral entertainment (performance, sound, appearance), which allows them to stand out in people's memories.
08-10-12, 12:39 AM
#4
Lexus Test Driver
My mercury mystique (1998)it had soul... if demons can have them
. I hated it with every fibre of me. In fact the only thing good that came of it is that I donated it to charity and got a bit of a tax break.
. I hated it with every fibre of me. In fact the only thing good that came of it is that I donated it to charity and got a bit of a tax break.
08-10-12, 03:40 AM
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I think soul also comes from the fact that some cars are simply engineered with passion in mind. The constructors weren't trying to build a car on price or ensure that it would be 100% reliable all the time. The focus was on other criteria such as styling, how it drove and sounded etc. and these factors seem to lend a hand in determining whether or not a car has soul. Also, the design, the designer, the brand - all these things add a type of passion and "life/character" to a car. Anything the late Sergio Pininfarina designed for example was automatically attributed to have some kind of soul. The Citroen DS for instance was designed and engineered by two famous and renowned people at the time and had so much advanced technology in it - it gave the car a life of its own.
To me some of the most visually appealing and "soulful" cars are...
Citroen SM
Citroen DS
Ferrari 250 GT Convertible
Mercedes 540K Spezial Roadster
Lancia Beta HPE
Peugeot 404 Coupe/Convertible
Fiat 130 Coupe
Fiat Dino Coupe
Fiat 2300 S Coupe
Alfa Romeo 6
...and many, many more.
To me some of the most visually appealing and "soulful" cars are...
Citroen SM
Citroen DS
Ferrari 250 GT Convertible
Mercedes 540K Spezial Roadster
Lancia Beta HPE
Peugeot 404 Coupe/Convertible
Fiat 130 Coupe
Fiat Dino Coupe
Fiat 2300 S Coupe
Alfa Romeo 6
...and many, many more.
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08-10-12, 06:49 AM
#8
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'soul' to me is a feeling i get that the people who designed and built a vehicle have (or had) a real passion, creativity and genius, and weren't just doing something mechanically, or for a cost target, or just to be 'safe'.
Dustin, thanks for the pics above
- this one just made me go "wow"... 
Dustin, thanks for the pics above
- this one just made me go "wow"...
08-10-12, 07:04 AM
#9
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I'm only going to post a few examples of cars with "soul" that I have experienced recently....
Yes I know its not a manual but it just ooozes with soul...its an event....a car so good Ferrari won't make any special versions of it.
''
As soon as you look at it you realize that some people lost their minds bringing this to market. It smells of soul and unaccountability to accountants. That sound!!!
To think this much soul can be had for around 26k. If you don't sit in this car and feel something overcome you, you simply cannot be an enthusiast. Just sitting in the car you can feel there is something supernatural about it
When everyone else had automatic V-8s, here was a stubborn manual V-8 with the soul of a sports car. Newer versions are faster and better equipped but dare I say nearly every E39 had something special about them.
I have to do my write-up on this vehicle but it has so much character and soul its no wonder it marches on with minimal changes. In a world where SUVs are all driving the same here is something holding on to its old school roots
Still carries the soul of the passed Honda founder and how the brand used to be.
Even a basic 911 has soul in spades as they stubbornly have that engine in the rear. Some versions have more soul than others but a 911 is a 911.
Yes I know its not a manual but it just ooozes with soul...its an event....a car so good Ferrari won't make any special versions of it.
''As soon as you look at it you realize that some people lost their minds bringing this to market. It smells of soul and unaccountability to accountants. That sound!!!
To think this much soul can be had for around 26k. If you don't sit in this car and feel something overcome you, you simply cannot be an enthusiast. Just sitting in the car you can feel there is something supernatural about it
When everyone else had automatic V-8s, here was a stubborn manual V-8 with the soul of a sports car. Newer versions are faster and better equipped but dare I say nearly every E39 had something special about them.
I have to do my write-up on this vehicle but it has so much character and soul its no wonder it marches on with minimal changes. In a world where SUVs are all driving the same here is something holding on to its old school roots
Still carries the soul of the passed Honda founder and how the brand used to be.
Even a basic 911 has soul in spades as they stubbornly have that engine in the rear. Some versions have more soul than others but a 911 is a 911.
08-10-12, 12:11 PM
#13
Out of Warranty
"Soul" was a more common currency in the automotive world more fifty years ago when most sporty cars were the product of one man's imagination. Today, committees design cars and they are highly compromised design exercises that reflect a consensus rather than a single vision. Think blended whisky here, rather than a single-malt.
Modern motorcars are stamped out like cookies, rather than lovingly assembled by hands that have been doing the same work for twenty-plus years, guided by calibrated eyeballs rather than laser beams. Certainly the assembly is more accurate today, panel fits can be better, even internals cut to closer tolerances produce a more machine-like product than a work of art. But that's the problem with soul - it comes from a single vision and skilled and experienced hands. Nevermind that parts now interchange freely, or that advanced metalforming techniques allow the production of body shapes undreamed of fifty years ago. The state of the art in engines alone has advanced the raw performance of the automobile to levels we couldn't even imagine on the F1 circuit thirty years ago. Now a machine that could kick a '60 Cooper Climax around Monaco like a damp sponge is available with a mass market name on the grill and can be yours for well under $30K; but it won't have soul.
A Porsche 911 won't either because, from the outset it was designed to be a precision tool first, an automobile second. It is undeniably one of the greatest production sports cars ever made, but the machine-like snick-snick of the gears shows no personality. It is the product of group-think - a fabulous group, but a committee nonetheless. Soul is the product of a creative process with a single vision, usually found in pre-1965 marques like Alfa, Fiat, Ferrari, Aston-Martin, Jaguar, Bugatti, and the road-racers of the pre-war period. They go back to WWI and the earliest "Formula" cars like the Alfa Monza of 1914:
Or the postwar Jaguars of the fifties:
Sure, from a pure performance standpoint, they could be run down and overtaken by most family sedans today . . . but the the soulful cars of my vintage would be a WHOLE lot more fun. What could be better than a sunny Sunday out on a winding two-lane country road chasing the shadows along to the howl of a handful of cylinders accompanied by the clatter of a pair of chain-driven mechanical overhead cams; a sonorous Weber intake and ripping Abarth exhaust note playing their concerto for one.
By comparison, a Veyron is more like a 747 on takeoff. Tremendous performance, nice noises out back, but it's all a little too organized, too sanitary. Call me old fashioned, but I like my automotive thrills served with a side of vegetable oil . . . as in Castrol, which run in the proper classic engine produces a piquant scent all its own. It's the perfect accompaniment to a day of recreational motoring.
Modern motorcars are stamped out like cookies, rather than lovingly assembled by hands that have been doing the same work for twenty-plus years, guided by calibrated eyeballs rather than laser beams. Certainly the assembly is more accurate today, panel fits can be better, even internals cut to closer tolerances produce a more machine-like product than a work of art. But that's the problem with soul - it comes from a single vision and skilled and experienced hands. Nevermind that parts now interchange freely, or that advanced metalforming techniques allow the production of body shapes undreamed of fifty years ago. The state of the art in engines alone has advanced the raw performance of the automobile to levels we couldn't even imagine on the F1 circuit thirty years ago. Now a machine that could kick a '60 Cooper Climax around Monaco like a damp sponge is available with a mass market name on the grill and can be yours for well under $30K; but it won't have soul.
A Porsche 911 won't either because, from the outset it was designed to be a precision tool first, an automobile second. It is undeniably one of the greatest production sports cars ever made, but the machine-like snick-snick of the gears shows no personality. It is the product of group-think - a fabulous group, but a committee nonetheless. Soul is the product of a creative process with a single vision, usually found in pre-1965 marques like Alfa, Fiat, Ferrari, Aston-Martin, Jaguar, Bugatti, and the road-racers of the pre-war period. They go back to WWI and the earliest "Formula" cars like the Alfa Monza of 1914:
Or the postwar Jaguars of the fifties:
Sure, from a pure performance standpoint, they could be run down and overtaken by most family sedans today . . . but the the soulful cars of my vintage would be a WHOLE lot more fun. What could be better than a sunny Sunday out on a winding two-lane country road chasing the shadows along to the howl of a handful of cylinders accompanied by the clatter of a pair of chain-driven mechanical overhead cams; a sonorous Weber intake and ripping Abarth exhaust note playing their concerto for one.
By comparison, a Veyron is more like a 747 on takeoff. Tremendous performance, nice noises out back, but it's all a little too organized, too sanitary. Call me old fashioned, but I like my automotive thrills served with a side of vegetable oil . . . as in Castrol, which run in the proper classic engine produces a piquant scent all its own. It's the perfect accompaniment to a day of recreational motoring.
08-10-12, 07:02 PM
#14
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Anytime. This is one of the most beautiful cars ever made in my opinion. If you're ever in Stuttgart you need to check out this car inside the Mercedes Museum. It will stop you dead in your tracks. A truly stunning automobile [work of art].
Also based on that car was the legendary "Autobahnkurier" which had some early aerodynamic pretensions. Absolutely beautiful machine.
Another stunner from Mercedes is this car: The 710 SS "Count Trossi". It looks like something Darth Vader would drive!
08-10-12, 07:16 PM
#15
Lead Lap
The subject of a car having soul is very subjective and has a different meaning to everyone as noted by everyone's posts. To me soul is a feeling when you drive the car and being able to drive the car and not have the car drive you and how much fun a car is to drive. To me many of today's car lack soul with all the techno nannies that pretty much save you from nearly every mistake you make. I like all cars and most of my cars have no soul and are pretty boring to drive (i.e. Lexus') but I love them. I loved my Z32 300ZXTT and my Supra TT but none had the soul of the Viper which is a car that I have held the longest of all my cars (10 years). There is something about that car that you have to respect and if you didn't respect it or know how to drive it it would bite you. No techno nannies to save you. While it had soul IMO, I really don't care that much about soul. I'm sure the new Viper doesn't have the soul of the older ones but I am ready to buy one a year or two after they begin production because of the performance. I also don't think the GTR has soul and I'm sure almost anyone can post decent lap times with that car without much effort. However, I love the performance of the GTR (and the fact that it has back seats for my little ones once they are in booster seats) and it is what I plan on getting if I don't like the new Viper. Just my opinion of course.