Torn between 3 cars for my next car!
09-13-12, 01:26 PM
#17
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I've had time in the regular C63 and black series...I love the 63...incredible....that would be my vote for now. Sounds great, high quality, very maneuverable, looks great, nice aftermarket and the forum and people that own it are really cool.
Good luck.
Good luck.
09-13-12, 01:44 PM
#18
my problem with the c63 is interior, it just looks a bit on the low-end side imho. if it has more of the IS touches it would be great. also of course, you said it the gas mileage. the 6.2L from mb is really bad on gas, it sounds great and it's a rocket, but it drinks gas stupidly fast (even faster than the e9x m3)
the new m3 is not out but somehow i am not too thrilled about it. probably like the m5, not NA, turbo so more chances for problems. the 335 is a nice car however again the turbo...
out of the 3, at this point, i probably would still go for the c63.
the new m3 is not out but somehow i am not too thrilled about it. probably like the m5, not NA, turbo so more chances for problems. the 335 is a nice car however again the turbo...
out of the 3, at this point, i probably would still go for the c63.
09-13-12, 01:57 PM
#20
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Caddy is a great car, but it will depreciate the fastest by far, compared with Lex, BMW, Merc etc.
+1 on the un-reliablitiy of the BMW. If you intend on keeping it after the extended warranty has run out, or buying one without a warranty-look out.
Just sold my Bimmer it was falling apart at 60k miles. Both my previous Lex have been basically flawless.
Machog
+1 on the un-reliablitiy of the BMW. If you intend on keeping it after the extended warranty has run out, or buying one without a warranty-look out.
Just sold my Bimmer it was falling apart at 60k miles. Both my previous Lex have been basically flawless.
Machog
09-13-12, 02:11 PM
#21
Super Moderator
So your initial supposition was that the GS-F was a better handler than the M-Sport based on a comparison with a Modern line set up for touring, but now you're complaining that even if that's wrong and the M-Sport IS the better handler, that's because it's a cosmetic package? I'm lost.
09-13-12, 09:26 PM
#22
Pole Position
I don't really mind if a GS is faster than a 335. How often will I ever see a GS on the drag strip or at the track? If I wanted the fastest car for the price, I would go for a 30k Mustang GT that will tear apart the 335 or GS.
Like I said before, Lexus is not appealing to me anymore. Sad to say, Lexus is probably one of the most boring car I have ever owned. I had a Acura, Mercedes, BMW in the past.
Like I said before, Lexus is not appealing to me anymore. Sad to say, Lexus is probably one of the most boring car I have ever owned. I had a Acura, Mercedes, BMW in the past.
How do I know?
Simple : I drove a Sport-Line 335i with the M-adaptive suspension/lowered suspension back-to-back with a GS350 F-Sport and the GS was more communicative, steered better and cornered better.
You probably chose the absolute worst time to jump ship to a BMW. You're right that IN THE PAST, BMW had the most exciting mainstream sedans to drive. But as of the past 2-3 years, BMW sedans have gotten larger, heavier, softer and more numb in steering and feedback. 30-40% of 3 series and 5 series forums posts are posts by former E90 and E39/E60 owners *****ing about how their F30 and F10 sedans are no longer the sharp precision driving instruments of the past.
Why are we comparing a GS350 to a 335? They aren't even direct competitors. Who cares.
Well of course a IS-F would blow away a 335. They aren't even in the same class. Talking about the same class, a C63 would definitely blow away a ISF.
Well of course a IS-F would blow away a 335. They aren't even in the same class. Talking about the same class, a C63 would definitely blow away a ISF.
Look we're not here to cheer-lead your choices. You wanted our opinions - this is our input. You might not like what you're hearing but it's my sincere attempt at giving you the unvarnished truth. ( No trolling intended on my part.)
Last edited by natnut; 09-14-12 at 01:26 AM.
09-13-12, 09:30 PM
#23
Pole Position
Partly right. Lowered Sports Suspension is standard. M-adaptive is optional, as are 19s (on any line). But from what I've read, it actually handles better on the staggered 18s (lower rotating weight). So knock off half the "boxes you have to tick". In terms of options it's $3200 for M-sport, $1000 for M-adaptive, and $500 for sport auto (nah, stick with the 6MT), vs $5690 for F-Sport. Yes, there are more boxes to tick, but those boxes are also less expensive.
So your initial supposition was that the GS-F was a better handler than the M-Sport based on a comparison with a Modern line set up for touring, but now you're complaining that even if that's wrong and the M-Sport IS the better handler, that's because it's a cosmetic package? I'm lost.
So your initial supposition was that the GS-F was a better handler than the M-Sport based on a comparison with a Modern line set up for touring, but now you're complaining that even if that's wrong and the M-Sport IS the better handler, that's because it's a cosmetic package? I'm lost.
AND it handles worse as measured objectively on the skidpad and slalom.
Last edited by natnut; 09-13-12 at 09:37 PM.
09-14-12, 01:32 AM
#24
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You miss my point : the GS is slower than the 335i in a straightline/ drag strip but HANDLES better and is more EXCITING to drive. You do yourself a disservice by not checking out a better handling car.
How do I know?
Simple : I drove a Sport-Line 335i with the M-adaptive suspension/lowered suspension back-to-back with a GS350 F-Sport and the GS was more communicative, steered better and cornered better.
You probably chose the absolute worst time to jump ship to a BMW. You're right that IN THE PAST, BMW had the most exciting mainstream sedans to drive. But as of the past 2-3 years, BMW sedans have gotten larger, heavier, softer and more numb in steering and feedback. 30-40% of 3 series and 5 series forums posts are posts by former E90 and E39/E60 owners *****ing about how their F30 and F10 sedans are now longer the sharp precision driving instruments of the past.
We mention a GS350 and ISF because you were the one who first compared across classes : a 335 is not in the same class as a C63AMG or an M3 but you're cross-shopping them anyway. We're just helping you widen your potential options here.
Look we're not here to cheer-lead your choices. You wanted our opinions - this is our input. You might not like what you're hearing but it's my sincere attempt at giving you the unvarnished truth. ( No trolling intended on my part.)
How do I know?
Simple : I drove a Sport-Line 335i with the M-adaptive suspension/lowered suspension back-to-back with a GS350 F-Sport and the GS was more communicative, steered better and cornered better.
You probably chose the absolute worst time to jump ship to a BMW. You're right that IN THE PAST, BMW had the most exciting mainstream sedans to drive. But as of the past 2-3 years, BMW sedans have gotten larger, heavier, softer and more numb in steering and feedback. 30-40% of 3 series and 5 series forums posts are posts by former E90 and E39/E60 owners *****ing about how their F30 and F10 sedans are now longer the sharp precision driving instruments of the past.
We mention a GS350 and ISF because you were the one who first compared across classes : a 335 is not in the same class as a C63AMG or an M3 but you're cross-shopping them anyway. We're just helping you widen your potential options here.
Look we're not here to cheer-lead your choices. You wanted our opinions - this is our input. You might not like what you're hearing but it's my sincere attempt at giving you the unvarnished truth. ( No trolling intended on my part.)
Thank you for your concern but I do not need help widen my "potential options." I am satisfied with the 3 choices listed above. Furthermore, I cross shopped between a 335, M3, and C63, which are all entry level sedans. A GS350 isn't considered as a entry level sedan from my understanding.
09-14-12, 09:55 AM
#27
Look at this (from MotorTrend website):
F30 335i RWD 3586 lbs 300-hp/300-lb-ft with Adaptive M adjustable shocks and Sports-tuned suspension :
0-60 : 4.7s
figure eight-lap time : 25.7 sec
lateral acceleration :0.90 average g
GS350 F-Sport RWD 3834 lbs 306 hp/277 lb-ft with Rear Wheel Steering :
0-60 : 5.4s
figure eight-lap time : 25.4 sec
lateral acceleration :0.94 average g
Keep in mind that the 335 M-Sport is one class size smaller than the GS350 F-Sport, weighs 300lbs less, has superior power-to-weight ratio, has superior straight-line acceleration than the GS, yet pulls less average g and is slower on the handling circuit.
Links :
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...5i_first_test/
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...s/viewall.html
If you want an overall well rounded affordable car get the 335 M-Sport. But for all out handling/performance, the M3 and C63 will be better.
If you get the 335 M-Sport for pure performance, you'll be driving it with this thought : "my uncle with his family sedan ( the GS350 F-Sport) can lose me in the twisties."
F30 335i RWD 3586 lbs 300-hp/300-lb-ft with Adaptive M adjustable shocks and Sports-tuned suspension :
0-60 : 4.7s
figure eight-lap time : 25.7 sec
lateral acceleration :0.90 average g
GS350 F-Sport RWD 3834 lbs 306 hp/277 lb-ft with Rear Wheel Steering :
0-60 : 5.4s
figure eight-lap time : 25.4 sec
lateral acceleration :0.94 average g
Keep in mind that the 335 M-Sport is one class size smaller than the GS350 F-Sport, weighs 300lbs less, has superior power-to-weight ratio, has superior straight-line acceleration than the GS, yet pulls less average g and is slower on the handling circuit.
Links :
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...5i_first_test/
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...s/viewall.html
If you want an overall well rounded affordable car get the 335 M-Sport. But for all out handling/performance, the M3 and C63 will be better.
If you get the 335 M-Sport for pure performance, you'll be driving it with this thought : "my uncle with his family sedan ( the GS350 F-Sport) can lose me in the twisties."
Bench racing at its finest!
The FRS did the figure 8 in 25.9 (worse than both the 3 and GS)... It must handle worse than both of these cars
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...t/viewall.html
09-15-12, 04:47 AM
#30
Pole Position
To the Original Poster, you seem to be making an error of logic here.
Granted you found your pre-face lifted IS350 boring. But this train of thinking :
my IS350 is boring--> all IS are boring ( did you try the ISF???) ---> IS is a Lexus ----> Lexus is boring ----> Lexus is not appealing to me anymore
This train of thinking just smacks of unjustified assumptions and errors in logic.
If you think Lexus is boring, may I suggest that :
1) you may be hopelessly out of touch with current Lexus developments,
2) have not done adequate research and are operating from incomplete knowledge
3) ( Or maybe just drinking too much "Germany Is Best" Koolaid peddled by the BMW forums).
Case in Point :
Granted you found your pre-face lifted IS350 boring. But this train of thinking :
my IS350 is boring--> all IS are boring ( did you try the ISF???) ---> IS is a Lexus ----> Lexus is boring ----> Lexus is not appealing to me anymore
This train of thinking just smacks of unjustified assumptions and errors in logic.
If you think Lexus is boring, may I suggest that :
1) you may be hopelessly out of touch with current Lexus developments,
2) have not done adequate research and are operating from incomplete knowledge
3) ( Or maybe just drinking too much "Germany Is Best" Koolaid peddled by the BMW forums).
Case in Point :
Last edited by natnut; 09-15-12 at 07:59 AM.