Lexus Post-LFA Era
12-26-12, 06:22 PM
#19
I'm not so concerned with producing a new engine as long as they continue to improve the current ones. GM has been using the pushrod engine for 50 years while improving its efficiency to the point it can compete with anything out there.
What I am concerned with are exciting looking cars that perform well. Looks like Lexus has done better with handling, now we need coupes that are sleek and quicker to accelerate.
Makes no sense there is no SC that is sexy and pushing at least 450hp.
Makes no sense there is no ISF coupe.
Makes no sense Lexus has a F brand that doesn't have more power than the regular model. The current engine can easily make more power.
We are getting tired of waiting Lexus. Do it....do it now!
What I am concerned with are exciting looking cars that perform well. Looks like Lexus has done better with handling, now we need coupes that are sleek and quicker to accelerate.
Makes no sense there is no SC that is sexy and pushing at least 450hp.
Makes no sense there is no ISF coupe.
Makes no sense Lexus has a F brand that doesn't have more power than the regular model. The current engine can easily make more power.
We are getting tired of waiting Lexus. Do it....do it now!
12-26-12, 07:40 PM
#20
The HS may have failed in the U.S. but worldwide it sold 56,000 units which sold more than the GS 450h worldwide.
http://wot.motortrend.com/quiet-mile...#axzz2FoF0XEVp
As for the CT, it may not be a rocket but it sells well and does what it's suppose to do. It isn't as fast as an LFA or have more room than an LX but does well as a luxury hybrid hatchback.
Without models such as the ES, CT, HS, IS and RX we wouldn't get vehicles such as the LFA, LS 600h L, IS F etc...
http://wot.motortrend.com/quiet-mile...#axzz2FoF0XEVp
As for the CT, it may not be a rocket but it sells well and does what it's suppose to do. It isn't as fast as an LFA or have more room than an LX but does well as a luxury hybrid hatchback.
Without models such as the ES, CT, HS, IS and RX we wouldn't get vehicles such as the LFA, LS 600h L, IS F etc...
Here are a few clarifications.
* I am not looking to say bye bye to the ES and RX, those are bread an butter high volume models.
* The HS failed in the US. I kind of thought this was a US centric thread.
* The HS and CT came after the LFA program so I don't buy that they got us the cars you mentioned. I actually think the LFA cost us other good cars. The time and money that went into the LFA could have gone to doing a 4L V8 like we see the AMG folks doing now.
* I still say the CT is crap. It has the same junk plastic as my Vibe winter beater and a drivetrain makes me want to cry.
* Volume goes down as price goes up so sure, more HS cars are sold that GS hybrids. My point is by having a nobody bohnhehd like Templin at the helm, Lexus missed the boat by not offering the GS with AWD so rich and eco concerned folks in the Northeast and Midwest can have their cake and eat it too.
* The IS is to me, the key Lexus, not something to discard. When the 06 IS 350 came out, it was so good that BMW was forced to rush their turbo to market and they suffered quality problems with their high pressure fuel pumps. The big blunder was not offering AWD in the 350 (until what 5 years into the cycle). I hope the new platform was engineered for a vert from day one.
In summary, my beef is that Lexus is tilting their mix to low luxury. I want to see aspirational cars like the coupes. What I am seeing instead is a company looking at their competition and as long as they are not getting leap frogged too badly, they are not using their full imagination. I am hoping/expecting that for the next Hyundai Genesis sedan, they add AWD and get some real engineers to tweek the 5L V8 and tranny to make that a studly value package. A car like that could push Lexus a bit.
Last edited by S2000toIS350; 12-26-12 at 07:45 PM.
12-27-12, 06:12 AM
#21
Let the customers be free to configure (they have this stupid system where regional folks decide what will sell in their markets and that led to 2006 IS cars without HID lights for fear of sticker shock). If I am willing to pay for bamboo and extended leather, then let me order it.
Are you saying there should be more variation among the regions?
12-27-12, 08:23 AM
#22
Trexus, Thanks for your points.
Here are a few clarifications.
* I am not looking to say bye bye to the ES and RX, those are bread an butter high volume models.
* The HS failed in the US. I kind of thought this was a US centric thread.
* The HS and CT came after the LFA program so I don't buy that they got us the cars you mentioned. I actually think the LFA cost us other good cars. The time and money that went into the LFA could have gone to doing a 4L V8 like we see the AMG folks doing now.
* I still say the CT is crap. It has the same junk plastic as my Vibe winter beater and a drivetrain makes me want to cry.
* Volume goes down as price goes up so sure, more HS cars are sold that GS hybrids. My point is by having a nobody bohnhehd like Templin at the helm, Lexus missed the boat by not offering the GS with AWD so rich and eco concerned folks in the Northeast and Midwest can have their cake and eat it too.
* The IS is to me, the key Lexus, not something to discard. When the 06 IS 350 came out, it was so good that BMW was forced to rush their turbo to market and they suffered quality problems with their high pressure fuel pumps. The big blunder was not offering AWD in the 350 (until what 5 years into the cycle). I hope the new platform was engineered for a vert from day one.
In summary, my beef is that Lexus is tilting their mix to low luxury. I want to see aspirational cars like the coupes. What I am seeing instead is a company looking at their competition and as long as they are not getting leap frogged too badly, they are not using their full imagination. I am hoping/expecting that for the next Hyundai Genesis sedan, they add AWD and get some real engineers to tweek the 5L V8 and tranny to make that a studly value package. A car like that could push Lexus a bit.
Here are a few clarifications.
* I am not looking to say bye bye to the ES and RX, those are bread an butter high volume models.
* The HS failed in the US. I kind of thought this was a US centric thread.
* The HS and CT came after the LFA program so I don't buy that they got us the cars you mentioned. I actually think the LFA cost us other good cars. The time and money that went into the LFA could have gone to doing a 4L V8 like we see the AMG folks doing now.
* I still say the CT is crap. It has the same junk plastic as my Vibe winter beater and a drivetrain makes me want to cry.
* Volume goes down as price goes up so sure, more HS cars are sold that GS hybrids. My point is by having a nobody bohnhehd like Templin at the helm, Lexus missed the boat by not offering the GS with AWD so rich and eco concerned folks in the Northeast and Midwest can have their cake and eat it too.
* The IS is to me, the key Lexus, not something to discard. When the 06 IS 350 came out, it was so good that BMW was forced to rush their turbo to market and they suffered quality problems with their high pressure fuel pumps. The big blunder was not offering AWD in the 350 (until what 5 years into the cycle). I hope the new platform was engineered for a vert from day one.
In summary, my beef is that Lexus is tilting their mix to low luxury. I want to see aspirational cars like the coupes. What I am seeing instead is a company looking at their competition and as long as they are not getting leap frogged too badly, they are not using their full imagination. I am hoping/expecting that for the next Hyundai Genesis sedan, they add AWD and get some real engineers to tweek the 5L V8 and tranny to make that a studly value package. A car like that could push Lexus a bit.
12-27-12, 11:29 AM
#23
Lexus Champion
The LFA didn't cost new engines for regular Lexus vehicles. That's an assumption. The world is moving toward fuel efficiency, not towards 500hp sedans. The desire for those types of cars is there, but it's in small numbers. People are jumping the gun because those types of cars aren't here now. They have to take one thing at a time, guys.
12-27-12, 02:45 PM
#24
Lexus Test Driver
It's difficult to reconcile what Toyota does as a for-profit business vs. what we as consumers want, especially when we here on CL are enthusiasts. Performance junkies are the car world's 1%'ers. That said, if Lexus can bring us the ISF and LFA (not to mention Supra), then it can be done again. I say start with a GSF!
12-27-12, 05:12 PM
#25
Shinobi-X
I was kind of mashing a couple of things together. You got the configuration you wanted but had to wait for it. Most folks woudn't even try. I just find it goofy that Lexus asks the regional folks to guess what packages should be offered in their area. I go back to my early adopter theory (they want the most stuff and are OK paying for it), with the system in place many of the early IS 350s that car into the Northeast had few options. The second thing is why is Lexus so fixated on what you can and cannot have period. They have bamboo interior parts and they have rear seat heater for the new GS. Why can't they let you have those features on an F Sport?
spwolf
My point is we want Lexus to do everything they are capable of. The new GS handles great but the design is meh and they didn't spend a dime on the 350 drivetrain. In this current environment of smaller displacement and FI, Hyundai ain't talking about dumping the 5L V8.
TF109B
Hey, speculation is a key factor in forums. My view is that opportunity cost (putting $800 million into the LFA program) meant somethings that were on the board did not happen. For example, why would Lexus just concede the luxury convertible space by ending the SC430 and not having a replacement. My simple answer is the development budget went somewhere else. I would have to believe new engine development also took a hit from the LFA program expenses. Especially since the car was developed twice, once in aluminum and then in composite form.
I was kind of mashing a couple of things together. You got the configuration you wanted but had to wait for it. Most folks woudn't even try. I just find it goofy that Lexus asks the regional folks to guess what packages should be offered in their area. I go back to my early adopter theory (they want the most stuff and are OK paying for it), with the system in place many of the early IS 350s that car into the Northeast had few options. The second thing is why is Lexus so fixated on what you can and cannot have period. They have bamboo interior parts and they have rear seat heater for the new GS. Why can't they let you have those features on an F Sport?
spwolf
My point is we want Lexus to do everything they are capable of. The new GS handles great but the design is meh and they didn't spend a dime on the 350 drivetrain. In this current environment of smaller displacement and FI, Hyundai ain't talking about dumping the 5L V8.
TF109B
Hey, speculation is a key factor in forums. My view is that opportunity cost (putting $800 million into the LFA program) meant somethings that were on the board did not happen. For example, why would Lexus just concede the luxury convertible space by ending the SC430 and not having a replacement. My simple answer is the development budget went somewhere else. I would have to believe new engine development also took a hit from the LFA program expenses. Especially since the car was developed twice, once in aluminum and then in composite form.
12-27-12, 05:33 PM
#26
Shinobi-X
I was kind of mashing a couple of things together. You got the configuration you wanted but had to wait for it. Most folks woudn't even try. I just find it goofy that Lexus asks the regional folks to guess what packages should be offered in their area. I go back to my early adopter theory (they want the most stuff and are OK paying for it), with the system in place many of the early IS 350s that car into the Northeast had few options. The second thing is why is Lexus so fixated on what you can and cannot have period. They have bamboo interior parts and they have rear seat heater for the new GS. Why can't they let you have those features on an F Sport?
I was kind of mashing a couple of things together. You got the configuration you wanted but had to wait for it. Most folks woudn't even try. I just find it goofy that Lexus asks the regional folks to guess what packages should be offered in their area. I go back to my early adopter theory (they want the most stuff and are OK paying for it), with the system in place many of the early IS 350s that car into the Northeast had few options. The second thing is why is Lexus so fixated on what you can and cannot have period. They have bamboo interior parts and they have rear seat heater for the new GS. Why can't they let you have those features on an F Sport?
Totally agree, Mercedes Benz has a pretty good customization program that Lexus sorely lacks.
12-27-12, 06:55 PM
#27
Lexus Execs Want a New Halo Car to Replace LFA...
But Lexus enthusiast will have to settle for the LF-LC and LF-CC for the mean time. The LF-LC is not a direct successor to the LFA but it will most likely becomes Lexus' next flagship until a true successor to the LFA is released.
Now that the final Lexus LFA has rolled off the production line, the Japanese automaker is turning its attention to the future in order to continue building excitement around the brand.
In a recent interview with Automotive News, Lexus Executive Vice President Kazuo Ohara admitted that, “If we [Lexus] want to build a more emotional brand, then we need a halo car.” But it won’t be any sort of spiritual successor to the LFA, in fact, it will be a much more affordable sports car when Lexus gets around to making it.
The automaker has no immediate plans to build a new halo car, but rather wants to focus on a new four-point plan to help capture more market share. Those four points are: more impassioned design, new drivetrains, better customer service and sexier marketing. So far, the overhaul in the Lexus lineup with a more aggressive and sportier style has surely checked off the focus on impassioned design.
As for grabbing the attention of younger, luxury buyers, Lexus is seriously considering a new coupe model. Both the LF-LC and LF-CC have garnered a positive response, and the Japanese automaker is looking closely at both concepts. More importantly, however, Lexus is working on a new generation of powertrains to outfit its models with, including a 2.0-liter, turbocharged engine.
Over the next couple of years, Lexus will expand its lineup from six models to eight, but has declined to comment on an exact timetable.
In a recent interview with Automotive News, Lexus Executive Vice President Kazuo Ohara admitted that, “If we [Lexus] want to build a more emotional brand, then we need a halo car.” But it won’t be any sort of spiritual successor to the LFA, in fact, it will be a much more affordable sports car when Lexus gets around to making it.
The automaker has no immediate plans to build a new halo car, but rather wants to focus on a new four-point plan to help capture more market share. Those four points are: more impassioned design, new drivetrains, better customer service and sexier marketing. So far, the overhaul in the Lexus lineup with a more aggressive and sportier style has surely checked off the focus on impassioned design.
As for grabbing the attention of younger, luxury buyers, Lexus is seriously considering a new coupe model. Both the LF-LC and LF-CC have garnered a positive response, and the Japanese automaker is looking closely at both concepts. More importantly, however, Lexus is working on a new generation of powertrains to outfit its models with, including a 2.0-liter, turbocharged engine.
Over the next couple of years, Lexus will expand its lineup from six models to eight, but has declined to comment on an exact timetable.
12-27-12, 07:04 PM
#29
To me, the mean time would be 2013.
When the new IS hits in 2013, Lexus will have no coupes (or convertible) in the line up.
Those 2 happy camper mobiles are going to hit in 2014 and 2016 (estimates)?
When the new IS hits in 2013, Lexus will have no coupes (or convertible) in the line up.
Those 2 happy camper mobiles are going to hit in 2014 and 2016 (estimates)?