2014 S-Class caught undisguised.
#122
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The S-class is a good car but people ignore that it's very very expensive, even compared to its European competitors. For that kind of money MB can afford to offer porcelain switchgear and diamond stitching, but technically anyone should be able to. I'd like to see if they can offer a car as good as the LS for LS money.
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#123
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Lol regarding the engine thing, i really couldn't care less as long as it is quiet. I drive super slow anyways so 500 horses would just be a waste of gas for me. Idk about the navigation though. No first hand experience. And i actually like how the LS doesn't have crazy diamond stitching on the seats. I like the smoother look, but that is subjective.
About the adaptive cruise control thing, maybe someone can clear this up for me but i always thought the LS was the first to bring this tech to the US with the 430.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autono...control_system
Maybe i am misreading something or reading it wrong.
About the adaptive cruise control thing, maybe someone can clear this up for me but i always thought the LS was the first to bring this tech to the US with the 430.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autono...control_system
Maybe i am misreading something or reading it wrong.
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#125
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Lol regarding the engine thing, i really couldn't care less as long as it is quiet. I drive super slow anyways so 500 horses would just be a waste of gas for me. Idk about the navigation though. No first hand experience. And i actually like how the LS doesn't have crazy diamond stitching on the seats. I like the smoother look, but that is subjective.
The mid level sedan has arisen to such a point that they really need to reach even further to set the flagship full sized sedan apart. The competition has done that, Lexus has not. We're not doing our brand any favors as enthusiasts by pretending that a second refresh of a 7 year old chassis, engine, and drivetrain is going to cut it when every single manufacturer has a fresh chassis in that segment.
Originally Posted by Mr Burns
The S-class is a good car but people ignore that it's very very expensive, even compared to its European competitors. For that kind of money MB can afford to offer porcelain switchgear and diamond stitching, but technically anyone should be able to. I'd like to see if they can offer a car as good as the LS for LS money.
The LS is not the stand out car in that segment anymore, and its not even really much of a value anymore.
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#126
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Originally Posted by sw10gs
Are you currently in the market for a $80,000+ sedan? Then to be blunt...what you think really is beside the point. What matters is what the buyer in that segment is looking for, and what the competition in that segment is doing. This is coming from a huge longtime LS fan, the LS is probably my favorite car...the LS is standing still while the competition is just running circles around them. The LS is just old, the 2013 refresh helped, but it still looks like a 2006-2007 era car in the doors and handles, etc. The LS needs an all new model and quick.
At the same time, it may not matter to you what i think, but i just felt that it was perfectly reasonable for me to talk about what i like in the current LS and my driving habits.
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#127
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LS was a refresh, this seem to be an all new car. Can't wait to see this in person.
#128
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At the same time, it may not matter to you what i think, but i just felt that it was perfectly reasonable for me to talk about what i like in the current LS and my driving habits.
I remember having this conversation with you about the very market segment I AM a buyer in and you trying to tell me I was wrong about midsized $60k luxury sedan buyers when I had just bought a midsized $60k luxury sedan...very frustrating.
Last edited by SW17LS; 05-11-13 at 04:19 PM.
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#129
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Then why are you disagreeing with people that say it is?!?
Its fine to talk about it, but its a meaningless exercise as a part of a objective conversation about the vehicle and how it compares to other vehicles in its segment since you aren't a buyer in that segment. You can talk in abstracts, but it would be like me talking about how a Ferrari or Lamborghini would better fit into my driving habits...or how I would live in a 14,000 square foot house. Fun...but not of any value when talking objectively about a car and its market segment. Have you even driven the '13 LS? How about an A6, XJ, 7 or S class?
I remember having this conversation with you about the very market segment I AM a buyer in and you trying to tell me I was wrong about midsized $60k luxury sedan buyers when I had just bought a midsized $60k luxury sedan...very frustrating.
Its fine to talk about it, but its a meaningless exercise as a part of a objective conversation about the vehicle and how it compares to other vehicles in its segment since you aren't a buyer in that segment. You can talk in abstracts, but it would be like me talking about how a Ferrari or Lamborghini would better fit into my driving habits...or how I would live in a 14,000 square foot house. Fun...but not of any value when talking objectively about a car and its market segment. Have you even driven the '13 LS? How about an A6, XJ, 7 or S class?
I remember having this conversation with you about the very market segment I AM a buyer in and you trying to tell me I was wrong about midsized $60k luxury sedan buyers when I had just bought a midsized $60k luxury sedan...very frustrating.
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#130
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Originally Posted by sw10gs
Then why are you disagreeing with people that say it is?!?
Originally Posted by sw10gs
I remember having this conversation with you about the very market segment I AM a buyer in and you trying to tell me I was wrong about midsized $60k luxury sedan buyers when I had just bought a midsized $60k luxury sedan...very frustrating.
When you say that "just because X person doesnt own Y car, thus X person has no say/should have no say in Y car" means that anyone in this forum who doesn't own a Lexus should immediately not comment on anything.
I'm beginning to think you seem to have some kind of personal resentment with me. The fact that i TALK doesn't always mean i am directly addressing you nor any specific person. Sure sometimes i talk in response to you but the fact that i post messages talking about "the target buying segment" or "the merits of a certain vehicle" in way is supposed to mean "I am right, SW10GS is wrong". I never intend to attack you, but it seems you aren't always returning the favor. Remember that this is a forum, so when people talk they dont always mean to address certain people. If you feel i have wronged you, or attacked you unfairly then perhaps we should talk about this in private chat.
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#131
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Lots of ongoing talk about how Lexus is 'tier 1’ (whatever that really means) but reality is they're not when you travel around. The LS is a wonderful car. But it's not and likely never will be very competitive with an s-class.
Seems almost no one has driven EVERY car they comment about or is a potential or current customer. If those things were actually required then there wouldn't be much content on here.
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#132
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I mentioned Lexus because this is clubLEXUS and we compare most everything to Lexus vehicles. ![Smilie](https://www.clublexus.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Lots of ongoing talk about how Lexus is 'tier 1’ (whatever that really means) but reality is they're not when you travel around. The LS is a wonderful car. But it's not and likely never will be very competitive with an s-class.
Seems almost no one has driven EVERY car they comment about or is a potential or current customer. If those things were actually required then there wouldn't be much content on here.
![Smilie](https://www.clublexus.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Lots of ongoing talk about how Lexus is 'tier 1’ (whatever that really means) but reality is they're not when you travel around. The LS is a wonderful car. But it's not and likely never will be very competitive with an s-class.
Seems almost no one has driven EVERY car they comment about or is a potential or current customer. If those things were actually required then there wouldn't be much content on here.
Right but there are way to many people just muddying forums and threads with a bunch of nothing which is frustrating to owners and enthusiasts as well as those reading from the sidelines trying to learn.
But hey you don't think the LS will ever be as good as an S class and Lexus isn't Tier 1 on a Lexus forum!
#133
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Noone is saying you are wrong. Just because you belong in a certain segment does not make you completely immune from outside comments. Likewise, just because you are a representative of a certain segment, does in NO way make you the ABSOLUTE in that standard. I dont doubt where you stand, but it is going to be very hard to lend me to believe that you are the ideal be all-end all of that group.
1. Capable of purchasing the car
2. Interested in a vehicle of that segment
3. Had the experience of driving all the vehicles in the segment
I AM the consumer. What I think is whats of value when discussing that segment...not what you think. Just as what a full sized luxury buyer thinks is whats of value when discussing full sized luxury cars, not what I think...or what you think. There isn't anything you can tell me about the midsized luxury car buyer because I AM the buyer.
This statement of yours is the problem:
Lol regarding the engine thing, i really couldn't care less as long as it is quiet. I drive super slow anyways so 500 horses would just be a waste of gas for me. I
When you say that "just because X person doesnt own Y car, thus X person has no say/should have no say in Y car" means that anyone in this forum who doesn't own a Lexus should immediately not comment on anything.
Note you did not answer my question, have you even driven the LS, A6, XJ, 7 series and S Class? Any of them?
Originally Posted by Blueprint
Right but there are way to many people just muddying forums and threads with a bunch of nothing which is frustrating to owners and enthusiasts as well as those reading from the sidelines trying to learn
Last edited by SW17LS; 05-11-13 at 04:56 PM.
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#134
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Originally Posted by sw10gs
Note you did not answer my question, have you even driven the LS, A6, XJ, 7 series and S Class?
Originally Posted by sw10gs
Since you are not a consumer who purchases a car in this segment...who cares if you don't care about the engine or that you drive "super slow" anyways. We are discussing the LS and how it fits in with full sized flagship luxury sedans...what we care about is what the buyer of a flagship full sized luxury sedan thinks about the engine.
Same situation with your opinion about the stitching and interior trim.
Same situation with your opinion about the stitching and interior trim.
Originally Posted by sw10gs
Its a way of commenting. Whether you intend it or not your input in discussions like this comes across as dismissive and argumentative, and when you are discussing a vehicle with people who own or are capable of owning the vehicle or its competitors...its frustrating. Other members are discussing the car, but the way they put their discussions forward is different.
I'd rather not argue with you on every thread.
Treat others the way you want to be treated.
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#135
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Again, noone needs to care, but that doesnt change the fact that i SHOULD not say it.
Tell me where i was argumentative.
I merely said good points about the LS.
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