2014 Toyota Highlander thread
03-17-14, 10:02 AM
#422
Lexus Champion
03-17-14, 10:06 AM
#423
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by bagwell
what issues have you had?
03-17-14, 12:36 PM
#424
I have many close friend who work in engineering in the auto industry. Trust me - the Jeep is a low quality vehicle by design and material selection. Oh yeah, it's also assembled by drugged up lazy UAW workers who can't be fired from their jobs.
03-17-14, 12:41 PM
#425
This is an honest to god truck, with a V8 facing north/south, a full time AWD system using a transfer case with low range, good ground clearance, decent approach/departure angles, 7000lb towing capacity. It isn't some sissy Camry based, transversely mounted V6 jacked up station wagon wannabee like most SUV's in that 20-50k price range.
03-17-14, 12:49 PM
#426
Lexus Fanatic
Lets keep this a positive, friendly discussion please.
03-17-14, 01:19 PM
#427
No one in the industry, just ask your engineering "friends", would lump the Grand Cherokee's structure in the same classification of unibody as most of the crossovers on the market today.
The Grand Cherokee has always had a very unique, reinforced, unibody type of construction that is quite robust and up to the rigors demanded of off-road vehicles. The new Ranger Rover and Range Rover sport also fall into this new category.
Low quality design and material selection? Go sit in the Grand Cherokee Overland, or even the Summit, and then sit in a Toyota 4Runner Limited as tell me which one is better.
The Grand Cherokee has always had a very unique, reinforced, unibody type of construction that is quite robust and up to the rigors demanded of off-road vehicles. The new Ranger Rover and Range Rover sport also fall into this new category.
Low quality design and material selection? Go sit in the Grand Cherokee Overland, or even the Summit, and then sit in a Toyota 4Runner Limited as tell me which one is better.
03-17-14, 01:55 PM
#428
Definitely agree the Jeep sits, drives, performs better. It's just not as durable over the mid and long term, and that's a consequence of its cost cutting in design and materials selection. If they wanted to, I'm confident they could make the Jeep as reliable and durable as a Toyota, but they just choose not to. For example, when selecting materials for parts, jeep only provides a budget for material cost and testing that is only a fraction of Toyota.
As an example, Google gm truck frame rust for discussion on how gm cheaps out by not rust proofing their frames and uses a cheap spray instead that flakes and peels off.
As an example, Google gm truck frame rust for discussion on how gm cheaps out by not rust proofing their frames and uses a cheap spray instead that flakes and peels off.
03-17-14, 02:10 PM
#429
Lexus Fanatic
Definitely agree the Jeep sits, drives, performs better. It's just not as durable over the mid and long term, and that's a consequence of its cost cutting in design and materials selection. If they wanted to, I'm confident they could make the Jeep as reliable and durable as a Toyota, but they just choose not to. For example, when selecting materials for parts, jeep only provides a budget for material cost and testing that is only a fraction of Toyota.
There is some truth to what you're saying based on my experience I agree. I had a long chat with my mechanic about this when he was replacing the Jeep's badly corroded brakes at 25k miles. He said Chrysler's problem is that they don't make choices when it comes to materials and part content that will stand the test of time. They've got the surface down, the exterior, interior, performance and driving quality, but the issue is when you get beneath the surface they have crappy brake components, poor quality electrical connections and switches, etc etc.
He contrasted that with Toyota, who has the stuff beneath the surface dialed in, but doesn't focus enough on the stuff at and above the surface on vehicles without an "L" on the trunk...which is why we have crappy interior plastics, frumpy styling, cheap trim, etc on these Toyota vehicles...BUT...every button and switch will work forever. Hopefully vehicles like the new Highlander show that Toyota is figuring out they need to focus on both.
His point about Jeep and other Chryslers is that no matter how good looking, well built, great driving a vehicle they might make...if that stuff beneath the surface continues to be inferior you won't ever have a vehicle that truly is world class. On the flip side of that, until Toyota injects some passion, style, precision, and substance into their lineup of vehicles...they may be something non-enthusiasts will buy and drive forever because they always work...but they won't be something that someone who loves cars will love to own.
I think he's right, my issues with the Jeep have been brakes corroding very early, issues with assembly (sunroof drains), and issues with switches and electrical components failing (electrical connections that are just inferior to what Toyota uses).
Would I buy another Jeep? Yes. Would I buy another Jeep if it was a vehicle I was going to keep for 10 years? I don't think so.
Last edited by SW17LS; 03-17-14 at 02:14 PM.
03-17-14, 03:27 PM
#430
If it was easy to make great quality cars then everyone would do it. I doubt Chrysler guys go to work thinking that they will end up designing least reliable cars on the road or that they have to delay the production of new model to iron out the bugs.
It doesnt help that FIAT is rated worst european company for reliability... they do have style though.
It doesnt help that FIAT is rated worst european company for reliability... they do have style though.
03-17-14, 03:55 PM
#431
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by SW13GS
I had a long chat with my mechanic about this when he was replacing the Jeep's badly corroded brakes at 25k miles.
but the issue is when you get beneath the surface they have crappy brake components
You say your brakes got corroded at only 25K. I see you live in MD (I'm next door in VA), and, parts of MD (especially in the higher elevations to the West), DO occasionally get severe winters (such as the one we are currently having), where a lot of road salt and chemicals are used. Are you washing and/or spraying off the brakes and underbody regularly with a hose after it is exposed to salt? I rinse and spray my own car with a hose thoroughly, including all of the nicks and crevasses underneath, as soon as practicable after I drive it on winter roads. It's best to let the engine/exhaust and brakes cool, of course, before spraying them with cold water
He contrasted that with Toyota, who has the stuff beneath the surface dialed in, but doesn't focus enough on the stuff at and above the surface on vehicles without an "L" on the trunk...which is why we have crappy interior plastics, frumpy styling, cheap trim, etc on these Toyota vehicles...BUT...every button and switch will work forever. Hopefully vehicles like the new Highlander show that Toyota is figuring out they need to focus on both.
His point about Jeep and other Chryslers is that no matter how good looking, well built, great driving a vehicle they might make...if that stuff beneath the surface continues to be inferior you won't ever have a vehicle that truly is world class. On the flip side of that, until Toyota injects some passion, style, precision, and substance into their lineup of vehicles...they may be something non-enthusiasts will buy and drive forever because they always work...but they won't be something that someone who loves cars will love to own.
His point about Jeep and other Chryslers is that no matter how good looking, well built, great driving a vehicle they might make...if that stuff beneath the surface continues to be inferior you won't ever have a vehicle that truly is world class. On the flip side of that, until Toyota injects some passion, style, precision, and substance into their lineup of vehicles...they may be something non-enthusiasts will buy and drive forever because they always work...but they won't be something that someone who loves cars will love to own.
And the RWD Chrysler products that come from the E-Class RWD/AWD platform, of course, (300, Charger, Challenger) have some good Mercedes-designed components in the chassis/suspension/steering/brakes.
Last edited by mmarshall; 03-17-14 at 03:59 PM.
03-17-14, 04:06 PM
#432
Lexus Fanatic
You say your brakes got corroded at only 25K. I see you live in MD (I'm next door in VA), and, parts of MD (especially in the higher elevations to the West), DO occasionally get severe winters (such as the one we are currently having), where a lot of road salt and chemicals are used. Are you washing and/or spraying off the brakes and underbody regularly with a hose after it is exposed to salt?
But yes, my cars get washed once or twice a week year round, especially in the winter. In any event, even if they weren't all my other cars have been/are maintained the same way so it still highlights an issue with the Chrysler components that isn't/wasn't present in the others (primarily, Toyotas).
He said the brakes looked like brakes on a car with 100k miles, he needed to use a slide hammer to get the rotors off the hubs.
03-25-14, 01:31 AM
#433
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2014 Toyota Highlander: Around the Block
http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews...und-the-block/
http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews...und-the-block/
A Timely Upgrade
This is the latest in our new series of short-take reviews, in which we concentrate on a car or truck with a powertrain or trim level not previously detailed.
As the three-row crossover becomes America's de facto family car, the genre takes on an increasingly important role in an automaker's lineup. The newly redesigned 2014 Toyota Highlander, then, picked an opportune time to up its game. It may be largely carryover mechanically, but it looks and feels significantly upgraded.
Skiing road trip
Our all-wheel-drive test example featured the Highlander's mainstay powertrain, a 270-hp, 3.5-liter V-6, paired with a six-speed automatic. It returned an indicated 22 mpg on a four-hour trip to the Adirondacks that was about three-quarters highway and the rest two-lane roads. On the way home, with a bit more downhill, we managed 23 mpg. This engine makes adequate power, but won't inspire Walter Mitty fantasies.
The Highlander's ride was busy on less-than-perfect pavement, although the suspension soaks up potholes pretty well. Still, the 2014 Highlander is a more agreeable road-trip steed than its predecessor. It's fairly quiet and not hard to see out of (a backup camera is standard). It's also available with blind-spot warning, rear cross-traffic alert, lane-departure warning and adaptive cruise control. The latter is useful but perhaps not quite aggressive enough for the New York State Thruway on the Friday of a holiday weekend.
The recalibrated steering now has some reassuring heft to it. In the last Highlander, it was rather overboosted and limp. The smooth, leather-wrapped wheel actually feels connected to something, which is novel for a Toyota.
Greater substance, space for people and stuff
The new Highlander is nearly three inches longer and has 13.5 additional cubic-feet of cargo space. The interior has been transformed, with padded surfaces and a stitched dash cover, and seatbelts for three in the third row. A padded, nearly full-width shelf under the dash is perfect for stashing cell phones and sunglasses and glows blue at night, the best use of ambient lighting we've seen yet.
The only negative in this well thought-out interior is that, in Limited models, the roomy middle row comes only with two captain's chairs, which eliminates the center seating position. You have to drop down a trim level to get the more versatile, three-passenger split-bench seat.
Did we say free upgrade? We did not
The new Highlander's greater size, substance, and niceness come at a price, however. My AWD Limited test car rang in at $44,793, although it was equipped with everything, including all the aforementioned high-tech features, plus navigation, heated front and rear seats, a heated steering wheel, and a panoramic sunroof. The price-leader Highlander LE has crept up just a bit, but the volume models -- the ones people actually buy -- are now between $890 and $1700 higher. You pay more, but you get more. That could be the theme of the 2014 Toyota Highlander.
This is the latest in our new series of short-take reviews, in which we concentrate on a car or truck with a powertrain or trim level not previously detailed.
As the three-row crossover becomes America's de facto family car, the genre takes on an increasingly important role in an automaker's lineup. The newly redesigned 2014 Toyota Highlander, then, picked an opportune time to up its game. It may be largely carryover mechanically, but it looks and feels significantly upgraded.
Skiing road trip
Our all-wheel-drive test example featured the Highlander's mainstay powertrain, a 270-hp, 3.5-liter V-6, paired with a six-speed automatic. It returned an indicated 22 mpg on a four-hour trip to the Adirondacks that was about three-quarters highway and the rest two-lane roads. On the way home, with a bit more downhill, we managed 23 mpg. This engine makes adequate power, but won't inspire Walter Mitty fantasies.
The Highlander's ride was busy on less-than-perfect pavement, although the suspension soaks up potholes pretty well. Still, the 2014 Highlander is a more agreeable road-trip steed than its predecessor. It's fairly quiet and not hard to see out of (a backup camera is standard). It's also available with blind-spot warning, rear cross-traffic alert, lane-departure warning and adaptive cruise control. The latter is useful but perhaps not quite aggressive enough for the New York State Thruway on the Friday of a holiday weekend.
The recalibrated steering now has some reassuring heft to it. In the last Highlander, it was rather overboosted and limp. The smooth, leather-wrapped wheel actually feels connected to something, which is novel for a Toyota.
Greater substance, space for people and stuff
The new Highlander is nearly three inches longer and has 13.5 additional cubic-feet of cargo space. The interior has been transformed, with padded surfaces and a stitched dash cover, and seatbelts for three in the third row. A padded, nearly full-width shelf under the dash is perfect for stashing cell phones and sunglasses and glows blue at night, the best use of ambient lighting we've seen yet.
The only negative in this well thought-out interior is that, in Limited models, the roomy middle row comes only with two captain's chairs, which eliminates the center seating position. You have to drop down a trim level to get the more versatile, three-passenger split-bench seat.
Did we say free upgrade? We did not
The new Highlander's greater size, substance, and niceness come at a price, however. My AWD Limited test car rang in at $44,793, although it was equipped with everything, including all the aforementioned high-tech features, plus navigation, heated front and rear seats, a heated steering wheel, and a panoramic sunroof. The price-leader Highlander LE has crept up just a bit, but the volume models -- the ones people actually buy -- are now between $890 and $1700 higher. You pay more, but you get more. That could be the theme of the 2014 Toyota Highlander.
With three row seating and a comfortable ride, the new Highlander fits the bill for most families, but fuel economy doesn't rise to modern standards.