FrankReynoldsCPA

The Koreans have stepped up their game with the styling. I've only ever driven one korean car though, so I don't know much about them.

As far as Japanese cars go, I've always found them somewhat bland. The Maxima looks really good, however.

MjThind

My family: Lexus, Range, Benz, and Lambo, not a Korean in sight, I'm 16 and drive a RX350, I think its more stylish than any other Korean car. Today's world is full of what you call "value" shoppers, so price matters, they want to see how many things they can get for a cheap price, but when was the last time cheap and quality come in the same sentence for one product? Plus Japanese look at the warranty issue with logic, they think why offer a class leading warranty when there is nothing to fix on most of the time...

Lil4X

^^ That's wonderful if your family has $300K+ to invest in rolling stock, but for the other 99% of us, we have to look for value/cost. A car is a depreciating commodity, and the aim here is to depreciate fewer actual dollars.

Looking at the present market, we have to look for values in underpriced cars. Right now, Chrysler, Kia, and Hyundai are the value leaders - perhaps not in objective quality, but in bang for the buck. Other domestics are close behind, and while none of these cars will appeal to the brand snobs, Middle America is voting with its wallet.

Part of the secret is "retained value" - and that's why the Japanese are still leading sellers, trading largely on their reputation on the auction block. Lagging price-performance a bit are the Korean and domestics, while European cars, with the exception of Benz and BMW (although they do not address mass markets, and trade largely on "perceived value"), have been poorly marketed this side of the pond. Otherwise we'd be hip-deep in Seats, Fiats, Vauxhalls, Renaults and Opels.

mmarshall

Perfect example of what I've been saying for years, of the idea of the RX being an older person's or soccer-mom car being an inacccurate stereotype. Young people can, and often do, drive RXs. Same with a number of other so-called "Grandpa" vehicles....Buick, Oldsmobile, Mercury, etc.....

However, I'll agree that it is rare to see a young person under 30 driving a traditional Cadillac like a DTS or Fleetwood. I could count the number of times I've seen it on one hand.

When? Automotive history has numerous examples. The inexpensive, well-built air-cooled VW Beetle was an icon for decades. In the 1960s, Dodge and Plymouth sold millions of inexpensive Valiants and Darts with one of the most durable automobiles engines ever built....the famous "Slant-Six". Then, in the 70s, inexpensive, well-built Toyota Corollas swept the world. In the 80s, along came Honda, which repeated the Toyota success story of the 70s. In the 1990s, Saturn not only made a classic line of innovative, well-built small cars, but revolutionized customer sales and service methods as well. After 2000 or so, the formerly inexpensive but poorly-built Hyundais and Kias began to rapidly improve, and those companies started offering quality and low prices...though recently, their prices have started to reflect their better quality. Today, we are starting to (finally) see good American-badged small cars (Dart, Focus, Cruze, Verano, etc....) at low-to-reasonable prices, too, even though Saturn's classic S-series compacts are long-gone. .

mmarshall

Prices on Hyundais and Kias, though, are now reflecting their quality. The reality of economics can't be put off forever. In general, they still aren't any more expensive than their competition (and, in some cases, like the Equus, still cheaper), but the days of their El-Cheapo bargain-bacement prices out the door are gone. Price a new Accent or Rio, for instance. Just this year, their base prices have gone up some $2000 over last year.......and they now run in pretty much the same range as most of their competition. The Nissan Versa, admittedly, still has a super-cheap price in base form, but you get what you pay for.......its design/build quality is like what Hyundai/Kia were giving us back in the bad old days of the 90s.

Aron9000

You're missing the whole point, its supposed to be simple, fun, and cheap. Why a new Wrangler costs $30-40k is beyond me. Its two axles, 4 wheels, engine, transmission, transfer case, a body tub, 4 seats, and some flappy canvas for a roof. Chrysler makes a TON of $$$$ off this vehicle, I guess because people are still willing to fork out silly cash for these things.

Getting back on topic, I do think the Koreans have it all over the Japanese in terms of styling. Except maybe for the new Mazda 6, that is one good looking car. But seriously the Japanese have been selling us the same "look" forever. The Nissan Altima, Mazda 3, Toyota Camry, Civic, Corolla, Fit, they look like the same car you could have bought 5, 6, 7, 8, 10 years ago.

LeX2K

The styling on the Korean models is not going to age well, way over wrought and in some cased downright ridiculous. Understated and classy styling wins every time, in 10-15 years the car still looks modern and respectable. Trendy styling works until that trend is no longer in vogue.

Lil4X

Agreed. Price advantages last only so long as a manufacturer can "cheat" the basic economics of production, whether by employing underpaid workers or using substandard materials. Both of these will eventually come back to bite an automaker that stays in business long enough as skilled workers begin to demand higher wages/benefits. The floor under labor cost is rising due to the employment of automation in many assembly plants, those manufacturers that are able to take advantage of it by making heavy, long-term investments in manufacturing technology will be able to cut their labor force, but not necessarily their costs. Whether it is better to pay workers more versus investing in complex automation systems is a tough call, but with technology costs coming down and human labor costs going up, it gets to be a no-brainer - in industrialized nations.

T0ked

iTrader: (2)

That might be true, although I disagree. Even then, if you're leasing for 3 years, who cares? And if you're buying because of the 10 year warranty, i doubt trendiness is high on your list.

mmarshall

Monthly lease-payments, though, are ususally based on the amount of money down up-front and the vehicle's projected depreciation over whatever the lease term is......usually 2-4 years. How well the vehicle is received (or projected to be received) in the used-car market after that term is up may be at least partly dependent on styling. Case in point.......how many people, for example, were in the market for a used (or even new) Pontiac Aztek?

LexFather

I think his point is who cares about styling that might not age well with the buyer who is going to lease for 3 years and get rid of the car for a new one with updated styling. Then "timelessness" doesn't matter, what matters is what is trendy and in at the moment.

I saw an Elantra parked next to a Civic and Corolla and they didn't even seem to be from the same class or world. The Elantra was far more visually appealing.

T0ked

iTrader: (2)

But all that is set at the time of the lease. Once you lease it, it yours for the duration, and I'm sure the trend you signed into will be fine during that time.

Yes, but people who leased the Aztek didn't have to care about its resale value because that was already agreed upon.

mmarshall

Styling, of course, is subjective, but I'll agree that the Corolla's styling, especially, is far more conservative than on newer Elantras. The Civic's is somewhere in the middle.

mmarshall

Yep.....and automakers often gain or lose money on what they project for lease-rates. To some extent, I agree...it's a crap-shoot, and a guess at best. Nissan and their dealerships, for example, lost a fair amount of cash from leases, several years in a row, because they underestimated the depreciation of their new cars....the lease dollars collected didn't cover all of the actual depreciation. BMW, on the other hand, has been able to give good deals on leases because of the continuing popularity of both their new and used products, especially the 3-Series.