Drive an EV? Get ready to open your wallets.
#1
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Drive an EV? Get ready to open your wallets.
Well, since localities obviously can't tax gasoline that electric cars don't use, guess what your friends down at city hall are coming up with?
http://grist.org/news/ev-owners-jolted-by-new-taxes/
States have begun introducing taxes on not using gasoline.
As the number of electric vehicles on the roads starts to climb, a number of states are introducing new fees to offset the projected losses in gas-tax revenues. The AP reports that at least 10 states have considered or passed legislation that would impose such fees on electric or hybrid cars. The new charges could help governments build and maintain the roads and bridges upon which the new generation of vehicles are being driven. But it seems that owners of gas-free cars are also being eyed to plug holes left in government budgets by the improved efficiency of traditional vehicles.
From Bloomberg Businessweek:
Gas taxes are one of the main sources of funding for bridges and roads. But people are driving more fuel-efficient cars, and many states’ tax rates haven’t kept up with inflation during the past decade. That’s left less money available for repairs. Nationwide, gas tax revenue declined every year from $40.7 billion in 2004 to $37.9 billion in 2010, according to inflation-adjusted data from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a research group in Washington. That’s a big reason Virginia and Washington State are levying green-car taxes and New Jersey, North Carolina, Indiana, and at least four other states are considering doing the same. “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them,” says Arizona State Senator Steve Farley, a Democrat who wrote a bill to tax electric-car drivers 1¢ for every mile they log on state highways under a yet-to-be-devised tracking system. “Just because we have somebody who is getting out of doing it because they have an alternative form of fuel, that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t pay for the roads.”
From the AP article:
Ryan Turner, an IT professional in Chapel Hill, said he and many other drivers of alternative-fuel vehicles chose their cars because they’re concerned about the environment and the country’s dependence on oil. The Chevrolet Volt driver helped advocate for a statewide plug-in vehicle readiness plan. “On its face, it’s reasonable for electric owners to contribute toward road tax in some way,” he said. “I think what’s suspect is that, given all the issues we have in this state, given the state’s woeful effort so far to promote electric vehicles as part of some statewide agenda, it is suspect that this vehicle tax is a priority given the small amount of the revenue it will bring in.” The policy looks especially arbitrary when more and more conventional cars are achieving fuel efficiency that’s comparable to some hybrid cars, Turner added.
Jay Friedland, legislative director for the advocacy group Plug In America, has asked legislators in other states to phase in special fees after the number of alternative-fuel vehicles reaches 100,000, arguing administrative costs make such policies counter-productive before states reach a critical mass. “We generally say this is a period of time when you should be incentivizing these vehicles, but after a while, yes, everyone should be paying their fair share,” he said. Some states have been mulling taxes based on the number of miles driven each year in each electric or hybrid vehicle. That may seem the fairest way of levying such charges, but it requires government monitoring that many regard as creepy and intrusive. As a result, annual fees are proving more popular with state legislatures.
http://grist.org/news/ev-owners-jolted-by-new-taxes/
States have begun introducing taxes on not using gasoline.
As the number of electric vehicles on the roads starts to climb, a number of states are introducing new fees to offset the projected losses in gas-tax revenues. The AP reports that at least 10 states have considered or passed legislation that would impose such fees on electric or hybrid cars. The new charges could help governments build and maintain the roads and bridges upon which the new generation of vehicles are being driven. But it seems that owners of gas-free cars are also being eyed to plug holes left in government budgets by the improved efficiency of traditional vehicles.
From Bloomberg Businessweek:
Gas taxes are one of the main sources of funding for bridges and roads. But people are driving more fuel-efficient cars, and many states’ tax rates haven’t kept up with inflation during the past decade. That’s left less money available for repairs. Nationwide, gas tax revenue declined every year from $40.7 billion in 2004 to $37.9 billion in 2010, according to inflation-adjusted data from the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, a research group in Washington. That’s a big reason Virginia and Washington State are levying green-car taxes and New Jersey, North Carolina, Indiana, and at least four other states are considering doing the same. “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them,” says Arizona State Senator Steve Farley, a Democrat who wrote a bill to tax electric-car drivers 1¢ for every mile they log on state highways under a yet-to-be-devised tracking system. “Just because we have somebody who is getting out of doing it because they have an alternative form of fuel, that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t pay for the roads.”
From the AP article:
Ryan Turner, an IT professional in Chapel Hill, said he and many other drivers of alternative-fuel vehicles chose their cars because they’re concerned about the environment and the country’s dependence on oil. The Chevrolet Volt driver helped advocate for a statewide plug-in vehicle readiness plan. “On its face, it’s reasonable for electric owners to contribute toward road tax in some way,” he said. “I think what’s suspect is that, given all the issues we have in this state, given the state’s woeful effort so far to promote electric vehicles as part of some statewide agenda, it is suspect that this vehicle tax is a priority given the small amount of the revenue it will bring in.” The policy looks especially arbitrary when more and more conventional cars are achieving fuel efficiency that’s comparable to some hybrid cars, Turner added.
Jay Friedland, legislative director for the advocacy group Plug In America, has asked legislators in other states to phase in special fees after the number of alternative-fuel vehicles reaches 100,000, arguing administrative costs make such policies counter-productive before states reach a critical mass. “We generally say this is a period of time when you should be incentivizing these vehicles, but after a while, yes, everyone should be paying their fair share,” he said. Some states have been mulling taxes based on the number of miles driven each year in each electric or hybrid vehicle. That may seem the fairest way of levying such charges, but it requires government monitoring that many regard as creepy and intrusive. As a result, annual fees are proving more popular with state legislatures.
#2
Lexus Champion
Why not take a holistic approach to paying for roads?
I agree with “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them” but do not agree with the bandaid approach that seems to be happening. If drivers of ever more fuel efficient cars (including hybrids and EVs) are starting to pay less than their "fair share" of road taxes (which for all purposes is the fuel tax on gasoline and diesel), why not be innovative, "think outside of the box" and come up with a new system of road tax(es) that is fair to everyone -- shared by all road users -- rather than slapping a new, dedicated tax on this new group of road users?
For example, the road use tax seems like a good idea, but don't just slap it on EV and hybrid drivers, implement it across the board, on ALL drivers. Why not reduce fuel taxes at the pump so you do not unfairly tax people who DO NOT (or cannot) drive EVs and hybrids (they would otherwise be hit by the road use tax AND a high fuel tax)? If you take a holistic approach that is implemented across the board, you can also use the road tax system to both encourage "good habits" and discourage "bad habits": reward people who buy smaller cars, EVs, fuel efficient cars, etc. while having people who wish to buy the big gas guzzlers pay more.
Inventing a new road tax system will take hard work and creativity, but that is why we have government: They must lead and act on our behalf, in a manner that benefits the many (not just the few); they should not be puppets who merely sit out their term without getting anything done.
I agree with “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them” but do not agree with the bandaid approach that seems to be happening. If drivers of ever more fuel efficient cars (including hybrids and EVs) are starting to pay less than their "fair share" of road taxes (which for all purposes is the fuel tax on gasoline and diesel), why not be innovative, "think outside of the box" and come up with a new system of road tax(es) that is fair to everyone -- shared by all road users -- rather than slapping a new, dedicated tax on this new group of road users?
For example, the road use tax seems like a good idea, but don't just slap it on EV and hybrid drivers, implement it across the board, on ALL drivers. Why not reduce fuel taxes at the pump so you do not unfairly tax people who DO NOT (or cannot) drive EVs and hybrids (they would otherwise be hit by the road use tax AND a high fuel tax)? If you take a holistic approach that is implemented across the board, you can also use the road tax system to both encourage "good habits" and discourage "bad habits": reward people who buy smaller cars, EVs, fuel efficient cars, etc. while having people who wish to buy the big gas guzzlers pay more.
Inventing a new road tax system will take hard work and creativity, but that is why we have government: They must lead and act on our behalf, in a manner that benefits the many (not just the few); they should not be puppets who merely sit out their term without getting anything done.
#3
Why not take a holistic approach to paying for roads?
I agree with “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them” but do not agree with the bandaid approach that seems to be happening. If drivers of ever more fuel efficient cars (including hybrids and EVs) are starting to pay less than their "fair share" of road taxes (which for all purposes is the fuel tax on gasoline and diesel), why not be innovative, "think outside of the box" and come up with a new system of road tax(es) that is fair to everyone -- shared by all road users -- rather than slapping a new, dedicated tax on this new group of road users?
For example, the road use tax seems like a good idea, but don't just slap it on EV and hybrid drivers, implement it across the board, on ALL drivers. Why not reduce fuel taxes at the pump so you do not unfairly tax people who DO NOT (or cannot) drive EVs and hybrids (they would otherwise be hit by the road use tax AND a high fuel tax)? If you take a holistic approach that is implemented across the board, you can also use the road tax system to both encourage "good habits" and discourage "bad habits": reward people who buy smaller cars, EVs, fuel efficient cars, etc. while having people who wish to buy the big gas guzzlers pay more.
Inventing a new road tax system will take hard work and creativity, but that is why we have government: They must lead and act on our behalf, in a manner that benefits the many (not just the few); they should not be puppets who merely sit out their term without getting anything done.
I agree with “The intent is that people who use the roads pay for them” but do not agree with the bandaid approach that seems to be happening. If drivers of ever more fuel efficient cars (including hybrids and EVs) are starting to pay less than their "fair share" of road taxes (which for all purposes is the fuel tax on gasoline and diesel), why not be innovative, "think outside of the box" and come up with a new system of road tax(es) that is fair to everyone -- shared by all road users -- rather than slapping a new, dedicated tax on this new group of road users?
For example, the road use tax seems like a good idea, but don't just slap it on EV and hybrid drivers, implement it across the board, on ALL drivers. Why not reduce fuel taxes at the pump so you do not unfairly tax people who DO NOT (or cannot) drive EVs and hybrids (they would otherwise be hit by the road use tax AND a high fuel tax)? If you take a holistic approach that is implemented across the board, you can also use the road tax system to both encourage "good habits" and discourage "bad habits": reward people who buy smaller cars, EVs, fuel efficient cars, etc. while having people who wish to buy the big gas guzzlers pay more.
Inventing a new road tax system will take hard work and creativity, but that is why we have government: They must lead and act on our behalf, in a manner that benefits the many (not just the few); they should not be puppets who merely sit out their term without getting anything done.
#4
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
states’ tax rates haven’t kept up with inflation during the past decade. That’s left less money available for repairs
If those doing the actual paving/construction/repairs would just spend a little more money today on better materials and do the job right to start wth, it would save a whole lot of money later on (more than the extra-spend in the first place) and these road-use taxes wouldn't be needed as much.
Last edited by mmarshall; 06-11-13 at 02:45 PM.
#5
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
#6
The way we tax fuel to pay for road construction is flawed, as pointed out earlier.
If you really want a fair way to pay for road construction, tax people based on number of miles driven. Those who use the roads more often pay more. Guaranteed if we had a tax system like this in place back in the 1940's/50's, there wouldn't be a such thing a suburban sprawl.
Of course tracking number of miles driven is kind of a hard thing to do. You could put GPS trackers in cars, but IMO that's way too big brother. I know if you had yearly inspections and recorded the miles on the odometer, people would find a way to cheat at that(roll back their odometers). Best I can figure is that you enter your VIN and mileage every time you purchase gas, pretty hard to cheat the system that way. Still that's a big invasion of privacy, the government can still kind of track your habits that way.
If you really want a fair way to pay for road construction, tax people based on number of miles driven. Those who use the roads more often pay more. Guaranteed if we had a tax system like this in place back in the 1940's/50's, there wouldn't be a such thing a suburban sprawl.
Of course tracking number of miles driven is kind of a hard thing to do. You could put GPS trackers in cars, but IMO that's way too big brother. I know if you had yearly inspections and recorded the miles on the odometer, people would find a way to cheat at that(roll back their odometers). Best I can figure is that you enter your VIN and mileage every time you purchase gas, pretty hard to cheat the system that way. Still that's a big invasion of privacy, the government can still kind of track your habits that way.
#7
Ha, repairs? that's a laugh. Anyone that's driven in the NYC metro area in the past couple of years know that they don't repair these roads anymore. Every day around here is like driving through a war zone (no exaggeration). The roads are absolutely horrendous. No, they simply want more tax dollars. Has nothing to do with repairs (although a very good excuse to rip off EV buyers).
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#8
Lexus Test Driver
LOL...This is funny, kinda see where this is Heading.
AMAZING!!! that Toyota Foresee this, and has been always doing Hybrids Vehicles instead of Plug-In, or EV
Way to go Toyota!!!
AMAZING!!! that Toyota Foresee this, and has been always doing Hybrids Vehicles instead of Plug-In, or EV
Way to go Toyota!!!
#9
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
#12
I know, I wasn't implying that you did. I just wanted to highlight that section of the article and the ridiculousness of it all.
#13
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
#14
Lexus Fanatic