2015 Genesis Sedan Thread
12-29-13, 04:47 PM
#466
Just because they fit the same layout doesn't mean they're competitors. This is like comparing a Chrysler 300C to an LS460, or a Dodge Charger to a Rolls Royce Phantom. They don't operate in the same sphere despite being large RWD sedans. This comparison would be worth having if we were discussing the Equus, which is an actual LS460 competitor.
The door panel in the Equus still isn't as good as the LS460, in any event.
The door panel in the Equus still isn't as good as the LS460, in any event.
The Equus / LS door comparison proves my point. The two cars wouldn't be viewed next to each other if they didnt share some similar attribute. Of course further inspection of door quality and build reveals one is vastly superior and hence non competitive with the lesser.
12-29-13, 07:07 PM
#468
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12-29-13, 07:17 PM
#469
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You misunderstood because of how I used the term "competitors", basic arcitechture makes them comparable because they are large RWD V8 sedans by the most general of terms. As I mentioned before, class, refinement, quality, assembly and pedigree are the differentiating factors hence they compete in different classes. The reason you see the equus being compared to LS's and 7-Series in some tests is because of the above "general" factors that apply to these three vehicles including similar feature content, that's where the line stops. So every car is comparable, whether it is direct or indirect depends on vehcile taxonomy.
The Equus / LS door comparison proves my point. The two cars wouldn't be viewed next to each other if they didnt share some similar attribute. Of course further inspection of door quality and build reveals one is vastly superior and hence non competitive with the lesser.
The Equus / LS door comparison proves my point. The two cars wouldn't be viewed next to each other if they didnt share some similar attribute. Of course further inspection of door quality and build reveals one is vastly superior and hence non competitive with the lesser.
12-29-13, 07:21 PM
#470
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I'm no badge snob :
If it drives well, has a nice interior, isn't a PITA to maintain, and undercuts the competition pricing wise, I'll give it serious consideration.
If it drives well, has a nice interior, isn't a PITA to maintain, and undercuts the competition pricing wise, I'll give it serious consideration.
12-29-13, 07:27 PM
#471
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You misunderstood because of how I used the term "competitors", basic arcitechture makes them comparable because they are large RWD V8 sedans by the most general of terms. As I mentioned before, class, refinement, quality, assembly and pedigree are the differentiating factors hence they compete in different classes. The reason you see the equus being compared to LS's and 7-Series in some tests is because of the above "general" factors that apply to these three vehicles including similar feature content, that's where the line stops. So every car is comparable, whether it is direct or indirect depends on vehcile taxonomy.
The Equus / LS door comparison proves my point. The two cars wouldn't be viewed next to each other if they didnt share some similar attribute. Of course further inspection of door quality and build reveals one is vastly superior and hence non competitive with the lesser.
The Equus / LS door comparison proves my point. The two cars wouldn't be viewed next to each other if they didnt share some similar attribute. Of course further inspection of door quality and build reveals one is vastly superior and hence non competitive with the lesser.
this is equus door panel
i don't see anything wrong with it for a 60k car.
remember equus is significantly cheaper than LS. of course it won't be as good as LS
12-29-13, 07:43 PM
#472
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Hahaa I totally forgot about the Equus!
But yeah even if you compare both Flagships the LS is easily superior just by looking at the photos. I'm sure in person the LS would extend the lead even further.
Lexus has its own design elements. Something Hyundai still does not have. Looking at their cars there's Mercedes, Audi, BMW, Lexus in there. Enough
--Besides if EQUUS wanted to destroy the market like how the LS400 done than Hyundai should have made the EQUUS to be something truly superior. Just like the LS400. But that wasn't the case. Which is why Hyundai is still not a tip tier brand.
But yeah even if you compare both Flagships the LS is easily superior just by looking at the photos. I'm sure in person the LS would extend the lead even further.
Lexus has its own design elements. Something Hyundai still does not have. Looking at their cars there's Mercedes, Audi, BMW, Lexus in there. Enough
--Besides if EQUUS wanted to destroy the market like how the LS400 done than Hyundai should have made the EQUUS to be something truly superior. Just like the LS400. But that wasn't the case. Which is why Hyundai is still not a tip tier brand.
Last edited by yowps3; 12-29-13 at 07:55 PM.
12-29-13, 07:54 PM
#473
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Hahaa I totally forgot about the Equus!
But yeah even if you compare both Flagships the LS is easily superior just by looking at the photos. I'm sure in person the LS would extend the lead even further.
Lexus has its own design elements. Something Hyundai still does not have. Looking at their cars there's Mercedes, Audi, BMW, Lexus in there. Enough
But yeah even if you compare both Flagships the LS is easily superior just by looking at the photos. I'm sure in person the LS would extend the lead even further.
Lexus has its own design elements. Something Hyundai still does not have. Looking at their cars there's Mercedes, Audi, BMW, Lexus in there. Enough
12-29-13, 08:04 PM
#474
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12-29-13, 08:09 PM
#475
I think MB, BMW and Audi have raised the bar tremendously in the last five or so years. They have evolved so much that everyone else is left far behind in the dust. Lexus is certainly not at the same level as German big three anymore, and I'm not even sure they can ever catch up. They are just way too slow to bring out innovations.
With that being said, Hauindai is the last thing for Lexus to worry about. They need to be cutting edge to be taken seriously, not another runner up like infiniti/acura.
With that being said, Hauindai is the last thing for Lexus to worry about. They need to be cutting edge to be taken seriously, not another runner up like infiniti/acura.
12-29-13, 08:11 PM
#477
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no model will cause a 'mass lexus exodus' - change happens over time. it looked like lexus would not lose the luxury sales volume crown but of course they've now been trounced, and audi is on the rise too. hyundai/kia now have some nice models which will elevate their brands, and lexus is rebounding with a stronger line-up now. it will be 10-20 years before we see whether kia/hyundai really made inroads.
Lexus had 2 cars when it started. The LS400 and the ES250. The first ES was a dud, a stop-gap entry product that tided them over until the ES300 came out a few years later. What made Lexus successful in relative measure was the LS. But it did take Lexus several years to establish itself as a contender for the entrenched German players. Lexus was successful early on, especially compared to fellow star-up Infiniti, but it was NOT and instant hit.
The Germans than retaliated and took back the IMPORT sales crown (I believe Lincoln/Caddy were #1/#2) and we know Lexus had it for the 2000s.
"What if" doesn't come into play since Toyota did put in the money, research, development, engineering to make the Lexus brand which has turned into one of the most revered and best selling today.
12-29-13, 08:14 PM
#478
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12-29-13, 08:24 PM
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right now competition is as fierce as ever been and it's gonna be tough for any new comer to come up with something better than S class. IMO, that's impossible. new S class looks like it can easily compete against phantom & bentley.
Last edited by hlee12; 12-29-13 at 08:27 PM.