2015 Genesis Sedan Thread
#106
an e350 STARTS at $52k, which is a car you can't actually buy (stripped). no idea where you get the idea hyundai would 'have' to be under 40k to compete. that's pretty laughable.
now the ES starts at $36k, again for a car you likely can't buy. certainly cheaper than a new Genesis is likely to be, but i don't think it will compete either. Genesis is rwd and will most likely be more luxurious.
now the ES starts at $36k, again for a car you likely can't buy. certainly cheaper than a new Genesis is likely to be, but i don't think it will compete either. Genesis is rwd and will most likely be more luxurious.
do you consider s. korea a third world country?
this is exactly the same argument that wasn't true when an upstart division with big "L" logos ate into 3 pointed star and roundel sales.
I think if you saw the above car on the road you would struggle to identify what it is, and in that sense the car doesn't really say much about the driver. Hyundai needs a very easily identifiable corporate design language for these cars and I don't think they've got it. This along with the KIA K9 are styled like the type of cars you expect to see in an insurance commercial.
Last edited by Mr. Burns; 03-12-13 at 12:39 AM.
#107
It's larger and offers far better value than compact RWD cars like the IS, A4, C-class, CTS, and 3 series but is outsold by all of those cars as well.
I don't think merit is what's holding back the current model's sales, which should be double what they are.
I think if you saw the above car on the road you would struggle to identify what it is, and in that sense the car doesn't really say much about the driver.
the current lexus gs for example, has a completely forgettable rear.
i think something like an A6 is far more distinctive:
#110
those models have been out for a decade or more longer, so not surprising the first gen genesis doesn't outsell them.
that's not surprising at all either, because the larger, softer genesis sedan doesn't compete with those cars, and again, is 'new' on the market comparatively.
i don't agree. again, it's a first gen product... it will take a long time to get established.
that's not surprising at all either, because the larger, softer genesis sedan doesn't compete with those cars, and again, is 'new' on the market comparatively.
i don't agree. again, it's a first gen product... it will take a long time to get established.
lol, we only know certain models well because we see them so often.
the current lexus gs for example, has a completely forgettable rear.
i think something like an A6 is far more distinctive:
the current lexus gs for example, has a completely forgettable rear.
i think something like an A6 is far more distinctive:
The models we see from established brands have established design and body languages, Lexus included. You know when a car is from Lexus, and every Lexus design fits in with the rest of Lexus.
The sheetmetal is designed in unique Lexus fashion, despite the graphics being somewhat derivative. This is what's called a "design/body language" (L-finesse in Lexus' case) and is applied to every car in a brand's lineup, even if very clearly those cars have different graphics (headlight/grill shape, greenhouse shape, taillights etc...). The design/body language of Lexus is very different from that of BMW, Mercedes, and Audi, all of which have their own ways of carving lines and form onto their cars' bodies, with different degrees of hardness, softness, combinations of hardness/softness, amount of sculpting (i.e fender flares), gauges or etches vs. not etc...
Last edited by Mr. Burns; 03-12-13 at 10:47 AM.
#111
Right, so you think they are at the position now despite the poor sales of the cheaper current Genesis to offer a new one at a much higher price and have higher sales? I don't think so. Suddenly they've gone from a $33k fullsize RWD sedan that can't outsell the ugly and old FWD TL to a car that you suggest should be priced higher than $40k and think will perform better sales wise.
#112
Another thread, another "lets beat up the GS".
Thought we were talking about the Genesis?
#113
sorry you can't distinguish an A6 with any Audi from the last 100 years. i think it's pretty easy. saw a new A6 just the other day and the rear tail lights are dramatic.
As for the above carscoops rendering of the 2015 Genesis, when it is in black, it looks like the front of a 2012 Nissan Maxima, coupled with faint traces of a 2012 Chrysler 300 grille.
#114
Well every next gen model they introduced in the last 3 years has seen a substantial increase in sales all at a price point thousands more than their predecessors. That includes the Accent, Azera, Elantra, Sonata. Also their SUVs. If they make a more appealing, better, higher quality car then shouldn't they be able to charge more?
Besides, I'm not saying the next Genesis shouldn't and wouldn't see a price increase, but I'm challenging the assertion that Hyundai can charge more than $40k for a base model and see any meaningful volume, especially if the car they're selling lacks any novel, unique, and desirable traits from an engineering stand point.
not at all. when Mr Burns said "I think if you saw the above car on the road you would struggle to identify what it is, and in that sense the car doesn't really say much about the driver" i was simply countering that the 4GS rear isn't very distinctive. the 4GS is certainly distinctive in other ways, like the front.
Last edited by Mr. Burns; 03-12-13 at 07:43 PM.
#116
I think the really difficult thing is to create a brand and an image that's desirable, and then design cars that people associate with that brand and image. In the premium segments this is what gets success.
#117
Correct. But when you get cool things in the industry like LED lights or exhaust outlets in the bumper, automakers take note of trends that consumers like, be it LEDs or swoopy styling. I wouldn't call it copying, just consumer appeasement. Of course the double standard is consumers then start whining and complaining that its a "copy". I truly hate the masses..
#118
Correct. But when you get cool things in the industry like LED lights or exhaust outlets in the bumper, automakers take note of trends that consumers like, be it LEDs or swoopy styling. I wouldn't call it copying, just consumer appeasement. Of course the double standard is consumers then start whining and complaining that its a "copy". I truly hate the masses..
This is especially important for Hyundai, which is already taking a big enough risk offering these expensive to engineer cars with no assurance of solid volume. It's not wise in such a case to come up with unique designs that may potentially alienate buyers.
#119
Bitkahuna might have a point but he chose the worst possible example to illustrate it.
Not when Audi is the premium car maker most guilty of the "same sausage different lengths" syndrome.
#120
but like you said, i digress!
I think you misunderstood what I said. In person and on the road the 4GS is clearly a Lexus, it fits in with Lexus design language that many are familiar with, even if graphically the rear isn't unique. Same goes for BMWs, Audis, and Mercs. However the design language of the Genesis in the rendering does not have a clear family or brand that it can be associated with, aside from the brands it derives from (I see lots of A7). But those are multiple brands and it's still not an exact association. Coupled with the generic winged badge and potentially badge-less grill, it gives an identity-less vibe.
lexus didn't really have a lot of consistency until last couple of years with not, the big spindle grill in particular. 10 years ago it was all over the map with ls, gs, es, sc, etc. and of course lx, rx, gx had pretty much nothing in common on the exterior but that's all changed now so i get your point and agree with it!