LexBob2

In CR from their Owner Surveys the reliabilty of all Acura models is Above Average to Well Above Average. Don't know about Infiniti.

mmarshall

I agree. I usually trust CR's data more than Power's. That's not to say that Power's data is useless by any means. But I've also found that, over the years, CR's data more closely approxomates my own experience in reliability with the cars I've owned (which have been a decent number).

hlee12

i haven't sat on any of the new acuras lately. i don't think i've been to acura dealer for 5-6 years. that's how much i don't care about their product.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

likewise. no interest here. a client got a new mdx which i've looked at a bit (although not been for a ride in yet) - he certainly loves it.

Toys4RJill

Nobody needs CR surveys to know that Honda and Acura models are reliable. I would probably say Honda is more reliable than Toyota, but nobody else really comes close.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

the differences between brands are smaller than ever so i don't believe it to be that big a deal any longer. mercedes having 50% more 'issues' of porsche doesn't seem to be hurting them. but stats can be 'presented' in different ways. so the count in the chart is problems per 100 vehicles (PP100). with porsche at 74 that means 74 out of 100 owners had one problem in the first 90 days, but that's not all it can mean. it could also mean 37 people out of 100 had two problems or 1 person out of 100 had 74 problems. but let's say it means there's a 74% chance you'll have one issue in the first 90 days. for mercedes the count can mean 1.15 problems per owner on average (115 PP100) or it can mean you're likely to have 1 issue in the first 90 days. is that a big deal vs. a 75% chance? not to me. with cars as complex as porsche, mercedes and lexus not only can there easily be 'problems' but it's very subjective in many cases... people reporting a problem that a car 'drives funny' or 'makes a noise' which many in fact be normal.

having said all that, toyota and honda both have very well earned reputations for top quality / reliability.

the only thing the chart tells me is don't get a fiat.

bagwell

+1, seriously....I don't judge a car at all on "INITIAL QUALITY" (first 90 days of ownership) I'm more concerned with 3+ year reliability ratings.

Toys4RJill

The initial quality is useless to me. News cars have a warranty so that usually takes care of the 90 days.

Up to 5 years, Toyota has power train warranties, can't remember if Honda has the same.

Now, after 5 years, nothing comes close to Toyota or Honda. No surveys are needed to confirm that.

. GM become junk, Ford is crap, and Hyundai has no track record. The Germans also don't hold up. No surveys are need to confirm either LOL.

pbm317

Initial quality isn't useless, hassles or constantly going into the dealer in the first 90 days can set a precedent and can quickly tarnish a consumer's overall satisfaction with the vehicle. You generally want a person to be happy with what is their 2nd largest purchase in life. As with many things in life, it comes down to that "first impression."

I don't think you can unequivocally say nothing comes close to Toyota or Honda, yes they're the leaders, but many people across many brands can hang onto their cars with simple maintenance and enjoy a similarly low level of issues for many many miles. Can't just say GM becomes junk or Ford is crap. Hyundai is starting to build their track record.

Companies are dynamic and forever changing. It's dangerous to get so deeply rooted in one's view/opinions. Sony once commanded huge premiums (some deserved) for outstanding quality and performance. They then proceeded to sit on their *** while other companies started to get aggressive and turn out more features and content for lower prices. They got knocked out by some upstart Koreans (LG and Samsung) among others, Vizio, etc. The same can happen to anyone. Sony still makes great stuff, no doubt, but they don't command nearly the market presence/share that they once had.

mmarshall

Well, even if the repair bill is not coming out of their own pocket, some people are annoyed by needless trips to the dealer to get things corrected that should have been done on the assembly line before the car rolled out of the factory. Fortunately, those trips, with most vehicles, are done significantly less-often than in the past. The last new car I can remember seeing and/or reviewing with a significant number of actual factory-assembly defects (not just little scratches in the paint, for example, from the transporter) was a 2008 BMW M3.

Yep, American-market Hondas went to a 5/60 powertrain and 3/36 bumper-to-bumper several years ago, to match rival Toyota. Previously it had been all 3/36...although Hondas were usually built so well at the plant that few people actually used that 3/36 warranty.

Except for a couple of well-known issues like the older N/A 2.5L head-gaskets, Subarus have also ranked very high in reliability.

Hyundai quality sharply improved after the late 1990s, and, by the mid-2000s, was (roughly) equal to some Japanese makes like Mazda and Nissan, though not quite to Honda's level. Kia took a few more years, but it also showed major improvement.

JDR76

This is a pretty good read about the IQS study and results.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/questio...or-car-buyers/

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

doesn't take care of the hassle of taking it in though (unless a car like an equus in which case they come to you to pick it up and drop it off ).

that might be the most narrow-minded car point of view i've seen in years. might have been true 2 decades ago, but not today.

first off, your "after 5 years" obviously only applies to 5+ year old cars. you (and no one else) can speak for how CURRENT brand vehicles will do after 5 years.

second, TONS of people have what you call 'junk', 'crap', and all non toyota and honda brand vehicles older than 5 years and have little to no issues. and TONS of people with 5+ year old toyota and honda owners do indeed have issues. timing belts go, water pumps die, transmissions have problems, window motors fail, power steering goes bad, and on and on and on.

now you're probably right that 'in general' a 5 or even 10 year old camry, corolla, accord, civic will be just fine and reliable, unless of course it's been thrashed. but i also know that TONS of ford f-150 trucks are VERY reliable for 10, 15, 20+ years.

my 8 year old explorer is nothing special by today's standards, and i hope i don't jinx it, but it's been completely reliable except one recall (quick software update) when it was new.

my neighbor owns about 5 mercedes vehicles and one diesel gm van. i'd guess on AVERAGE the vehicles are 15 years old, with the newest being maybe a 2004 E class, and the oldest being about a 1980 mercedes 560 coupe or similar. they drive them all day, every day, and besides routine maintenance they don't have any problems.

you really need to open your mind a bit.

EXCELLENT post

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

thanks for the link... makes my point that 'problems' are subjective...





how about rtfm?

JDR76

Exactly. That's why I don't get the survey, or at least how they have it named. It is not, at least in my opinion, really measuring quality.

I'm a pretty tech savvy guy, working in a very technical profession, and I'll be honest and say that, despite reading the manuals for both of my cars, there were things I did not figure out about them within those first 90 days of ownership. For the first 90+ days, I couldn't get the text messages to work through the nav on my IS. Turns out I had a setting wrong on my phone. Something like that would be considered to be a "problem" on their "quality" survey.

It's an interesting read, but not something I would use to impact my car buying decisions.

hlee12

this is how it goes -

1. buy the car
2. but it breaks down
3. ton of wasted time at the dealer
4. never buy their products again
5. spread the word online how crappy they are


i've had non toyota car that lasted 150k miles without any major issues. 3 of them. i've had a friend who repeatedly bought hondas because he thinks hondas last forever. his nissan didn't, so he stays with honda. my parents stuck with lexus because they didn't trust german reliability. i have a friend who is a major audi homer. he keeps buying used audis. the ones that don't have a good track record. surprisingly he never ever has any trouble with them. all of them were over 100k miles. he believes audis are bulletproof when you take care of them.



that's just way things are. people will believe whatever they want to believe.