View Poll Results: What should the next LS go after?
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Next Lexus LS (2018 model)
10-12-15, 12:10 PM
#271
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yes james, long time!
i think dealership experience can really vary. i have seen awesome and terrible lexus services myself, and my limited experience with bmw and mb have been very positive so far (though of course, i have heard bad ones too).
lexus has extra 3 years or so on the new LS, they better get it right
i think dealership experience can really vary. i have seen awesome and terrible lexus services myself, and my limited experience with bmw and mb have been very positive so far (though of course, i have heard bad ones too).
lexus has extra 3 years or so on the new LS, they better get it right
10-12-15, 01:08 PM
#272
Lexus Fanatic
An S550 optioned conservatively the way I would want it is about $105-110. So its about $30k more comparing to what I would want.
Now...bear in mind I got $10k off my LS460 so the transaction price was really $70k. At least when I got it you wouldn't do as well on an S550.
10-13-15, 02:27 AM
#273
i was under the impression that they will debut the car in jan 2016 in tokyo, which then i expect the car to hit dealerships in late summer as 2017 models. so that would make the current one 4 model years.
but yes if it is pushed out to summer 2017 as 2018 model then it's 5 years. i don't think we know enough for anything to be factual yet
As for the LS, there are no prototypes in sight, save for a mechanical mule that appeared in May 2015. Actual 200B programme prototypes are testing and have been since at least 2014, but they are not out in the field for public viewing. The fifth generation is not coming next year to showrooms, unless moved forward last minute.
As I said for months, Lexus will preview the next generation LS in concept form and NOT the production version. I have been proven right. For some reason Lexus announced this October 28 reveal last week, yet no one has posted anything on here regarding that.
I am particular about the model timelines, especially in cases of aging product.
It is the only core Mercedes-Benz model that won't be using MRA this decade.
I just love your comments at times, honestly.
again you are trying to talk about value, which i will totally agree with you that lexus is better value. it would be stupid to argue that. but no matter how you spin it, you just can't deny the presence and prestige status of the s class. just go and get the total sales numbers of LS vs S from 2007 to 2012 and we will talk about which car has a better presence in this segment. and i am not even going to discount the fact that most LS sold are swb whereas S doesn't even have swb here in the US.
and you still don't get the idea that second set of buyers have much less influence on the overall presence of the flagship audience that manufacturer cares about.
you don't have to challenge me. my ls460l was black and i had first hand experience about the car paint quality. so unless you actually own either a s550 or ls460 in black over period of time, you can feel however you want but i think my words carry more weight.
now i do agree with you, i think the 07-09 s class exterior was not as desirable than the 07-09 LS. but at the same time i can also say the 10-13 s class exterior improvement from the headlights to talights, it's far better than the less than impressive upgrades on the LS of the same period. and f-finesse? give me a break, we all know how l-finess is after the 06-12 lexus era, you don't see that at all anymore
and you still don't get the idea that second set of buyers have much less influence on the overall presence of the flagship audience that manufacturer cares about.
you don't have to challenge me. my ls460l was black and i had first hand experience about the car paint quality. so unless you actually own either a s550 or ls460 in black over period of time, you can feel however you want but i think my words carry more weight.
now i do agree with you, i think the 07-09 s class exterior was not as desirable than the 07-09 LS. but at the same time i can also say the 10-13 s class exterior improvement from the headlights to talights, it's far better than the less than impressive upgrades on the LS of the same period. and f-finesse? give me a break, we all know how l-finess is after the 06-12 lexus era, you don't see that at all anymore
The decision making made, for what became the 2010 model year LS was clearly uninspired and a case of resting on their laurels too much. I naturally wrote it off and hoped they were already at work on a successor due in 2012-13, not 2017.
First of all, WHEN.THE.F are we going to see the new LS? I have heard this month at the Tokyo Auto Show, but Lexus is being so tight-lipped, I can't even find a rendering.
I'm practically foaming at the mouth in anticipation. I certainly think Lexus has the capability for a class-comptetive/leading LS....just look at the 400 and 430; they were tops in objective comparison tests almost every time. The question is, are they going to actually follow through again? We know Lexus has the engineering beans.
I'm practically foaming at the mouth in anticipation. I certainly think Lexus has the capability for a class-comptetive/leading LS....just look at the 400 and 430; they were tops in objective comparison tests almost every time. The question is, are they going to actually follow through again? We know Lexus has the engineering beans.
Lazy journalists in the West (mostly in US) cannot be bothered to get all the information at their disposal, compared to their Japanese counterparts and are more than likely indifferent about such news, in it being a positive Lexus topic.
There will simply be no new production Lexus unveilings until the LC coupe in Detroit. One should expect to start seeing LS prototypes running as soon as the Tokyo concept debuts. It is all carefully timed for a reason in such cases. Concept showings overlapping with the first prototype spottings is not a coincidence. Testing is always done behind doors until prototypes are ready and verified for road use.
As an owner of a brand new LS460 I can tell you...it's a great car, the S550 is a better car. The price difference reflects that. Lexus needs to step up their game and answer that.
As someone who has watched values in this segment over a long period of time, the S Class does depreciate more steeply than the LS. Doesnt mean the LS is a better car. More expensive cars depreciate faster, and the public has more faith in the long term reliability of a Lexus which helps resale.
If you offered me an S550 in exchange for my LS I would take it. Every LS owner being honest would.
As someone who has watched values in this segment over a long period of time, the S Class does depreciate more steeply than the LS. Doesnt mean the LS is a better car. More expensive cars depreciate faster, and the public has more faith in the long term reliability of a Lexus which helps resale.
If you offered me an S550 in exchange for my LS I would take it. Every LS owner being honest would.
To the others in thread, it's not that one is saying that there are absolutely no strengths the current XF40 LS has over the W222 S-Class, but that the weaknesses outweigh the strengths greatly. In my case, I do prefer the S over the LS in terms of incumbent examples. No contest.
Yes, I very much co-sign this. Launched in 2006 =/= since 2007. One really should not be referring to something anachronistically, as it is not truly accurate and minimizes the longevity of an aging product. The current generation was first being rendered in early 2004, first spied and also leaked in 2005. It has been around a little bit longer than 2007, so it is disingenuous to claim by default it is merely 8 years old.
By the time 2007 came around, both the S-Class and LS were getting their nip-and-tucks for MY2010 signed off and/or towards that (in LS case). I already pointed this out, so if it falls on deaf ears, oh well.
I really wonder why some folks continually struggle to know the difference between what a model year is and model's actual introduction. For me, I have made it as simple as MY (Model Year) - 1 = intro year, except in special cases (see 1998 LX470). The Lexus RX launched in March 1998, yet it was a 1999 model. By the end of 1998, the second generation was already in development and halfway through after 2 years since RX debut.
I would not be surprised either, but hope for the best. Other than the LFA, lately sometimes Lexus is caught penny-pinching in areas such as level of customization, packaging and equipment across regions. On the other hand, BMW IS is about to be eclipsed by another competitor in the near future, where they're not even expecting it.
10-13-15, 03:41 AM
#274
Seems like Lexus planned to release the new LS in the final years of the S class to take advantage of the markets' worn out feelings for the S Class just like how the S class came out these couple years and is totally destroying the LS and the 7 series.
10-13-15, 08:05 AM
#276
Lexus Fanatic
Quite unfortunate how that it is likely not far from the truth, as it shows how far the LS is now lagging behind in comparison. I would do the same at this point, but then again I do not really own an LS. However (off the record), that could change depending on the next gen and possible endowment next year.
To the others in thread, it's not that one is saying that there are absolutely no strengths the current XF40 LS has over the W222 S-Class, but that the weaknesses outweigh the strengths greatly. In my case, I do prefer the S over the LS in terms of incumbent examples. No contest.
To the others in thread, it's not that one is saying that there are absolutely no strengths the current XF40 LS has over the W222 S-Class, but that the weaknesses outweigh the strengths greatly. In my case, I do prefer the S over the LS in terms of incumbent examples. No contest.
If you compare the current LS to the current XJ, or the outgoing 7, or even the much newer A8 it still compares very favorably and quite frankly continues to lead. Its really the S Class which is such a far and away improvement over the previous S Class that almost creates a new segment above the other offerings. Price wise, you can clearly see that too, its in another category entirely.
10-13-15, 05:02 PM
#277
Yes, I very much co-sign this. Launched in 2006 =/= since 2007. One really should not be referring to something anachronistically, as it is not truly accurate and minimizes the longevity of an aging product. The current generation was first being rendered in early 2004, first spied and also leaked in 2005. It has been around a little bit longer than 2007, so it is disingenuous to claim by default it is merely 8 years old.
By the time 2007 came around, both the S-Class and LS were getting their nip-and-tucks for MY2010 signed off and/or towards that (in LS case). I already pointed this out, so if it falls on deaf ears, oh well.
I really wonder why some folks continually struggle to know the difference between what a model year is and model's actual introduction. For me, I have made it as simple as MY (Model Year) - 1 = intro year, except in special cases (see 1998 LX470). The Lexus RX launched in March 1998, yet it was a 1999 model. By the end of 1998, the second generation was already in development and halfway through after 2 years since RX debut.
By the time 2007 came around, both the S-Class and LS were getting their nip-and-tucks for MY2010 signed off and/or towards that (in LS case). I already pointed this out, so if it falls on deaf ears, oh well.
I really wonder why some folks continually struggle to know the difference between what a model year is and model's actual introduction. For me, I have made it as simple as MY (Model Year) - 1 = intro year, except in special cases (see 1998 LX470). The Lexus RX launched in March 1998, yet it was a 1999 model. By the end of 1998, the second generation was already in development and halfway through after 2 years since RX debut.
i don't agree though we should "count" those development and leaked prototype years as well, i think that's only going to confuse more. everyone knows design cycles start way earlier, in fact when you see spy and rendering, that's probably a year or two into it already. truth is i have seen a full scale model (metal, NOT clay) of the w222 in person way back in late 2009, but i don't think it makes sense to say that the w222 is freaking 8+ years old already? that's just silly
i did this exercise long ago but i dont' have that info now. how's the sales of w221 throughout the years? did it seriously dip down towards the end? i always felt that lexus is the only brand where models start to tip off more seriously as MY goes by
10-13-15, 06:37 PM
#278
I would not be surprised either, but hope for the best. Other than the LFA, lately sometimes Lexus is caught penny-pinching in areas such as level of customization, packaging and equipment across regions. On the other hand, BMW IS is about to be eclipsed by another competitor in the near future, where they're not even expecting it.
well regions be regions, but a lot of thought went into TPS 2.0 (TNGA) to provide for more variation in TPS. They do keep adding options and variations even without new platforms... but for instance, one of the main points of TPS 2.0 factories was that shop can do different bumper for each vehicle on the line vs previous batch building.
Oh and do tell, who is the competitor? :-)
Always appreciate your posts btw!
10-13-15, 06:47 PM
#279
If they decided to re-use old engines/platform/tech, then we would not have latest stuff in LS until 2025.
So, like Prius in Toyota world, LS will herald new platform, engines and technologies for Lexus... it will be first showing of new platform and likely new engines as well.
10-13-15, 08:56 PM
#280
Lead Lap
That's the interesting thing. W221 sales were strong right up until the W222 arrived.
10-13-15, 09:17 PM
#281
yup that's exactly my point, last i recalled the w221 was strong throughout the years even when ppl knew the w222 was coming. that's one thing i hope lexus can one day achieve -- consistent sales throughout model years. so far the trend most of the time is their cars sell very hot the first or second model year, then it starts to come down, sometimes quickly. they want more constant presence. like the 4gs, it was good the first year, then it drops off quick until lexus started throwing out super good lease deals and numbers pick up again. people can argue about value, but truth is i regularly see new gs on the roads. to me that's a good thing
10-14-15, 01:20 AM
#282
Pole Position
FYI, I test drove the new Genesis when it launched in my country.
It's not even in the same ballpark as the GS in terms of seamless drivability, handling and smoothness, let alone the LS.
Try again when Hyundai has the product line to back your outlandish claims.
10-14-15, 06:32 AM
#283
Lexus Fanatic
Why didn't I buy a Genesis? Had I decided to stay in that price segment I might have. The LS is what I really wanted and the opportunity to get one for a good deal presented itself so I took it. For me the only thing keeping me out of one of these luxury Hyundais is brand snobbery. As far as a car goes though, the Genesis is a great car and the Equus is a great car (albeit older). The new Equus will be really great I'm sure.
While he may be the "resident Hyundai schill" you're certainly the "resident Hyundai hater" as referenced by this opinion which has no basis in reality. If you come to these cars with an open mind, their benefits over traditional competitors for the price point are very clear.
