The Myth of " German Engineering ".
12-01-15, 05:10 PM
#61
Lexus Fanatic
Were you over-boosting the engine past the red-line on the boost-gauge? That will put a lot of stress on the turbo and waste gate...not to mention the engine itself.
I hear you, though, on some of those BMW problems. Several years ago, I did a full-review on a brand-new M3 (bright blue) sitting right on the dealer-lot. Here's a car fresh out of the factory, mind you, with not even 20 miles on it. When I tried out the back seat (cramped as it was for a big guy my size), and pulled down the center arm-rest, the entire arm rest and its mounting hardware popped right out of the seat and fell down on the floor, leaving a big hole in the middle of the setback. It had just been stuffed in at the factory, like a cork in a bottleneck, and never actually attached. Then, if that wasn't bad enough, on the same car, it had either defective wiring, switches, or electric motor on the power-front drivers' seat. The switches would intermittently start to work one second, and not the next. I struggled with it for almost 10 minutes, then a couple of techs came out from the service department to try it, and THEY couldn't get it to work properly either. Finally, we got the seat into a position that was adequate for my test-drive....after the better part of 20 more minutes. When I brought the car back from the test-drive, it went right into the shop to have both the front and rear seats worked on.
I hear you, though, on some of those BMW problems. Several years ago, I did a full-review on a brand-new M3 (bright blue) sitting right on the dealer-lot. Here's a car fresh out of the factory, mind you, with not even 20 miles on it. When I tried out the back seat (cramped as it was for a big guy my size), and pulled down the center arm-rest, the entire arm rest and its mounting hardware popped right out of the seat and fell down on the floor, leaving a big hole in the middle of the setback. It had just been stuffed in at the factory, like a cork in a bottleneck, and never actually attached. Then, if that wasn't bad enough, on the same car, it had either defective wiring, switches, or electric motor on the power-front drivers' seat. The switches would intermittently start to work one second, and not the next. I struggled with it for almost 10 minutes, then a couple of techs came out from the service department to try it, and THEY couldn't get it to work properly either. Finally, we got the seat into a position that was adequate for my test-drive....after the better part of 20 more minutes. When I brought the car back from the test-drive, it went right into the shop to have both the front and rear seats worked on.
Last edited by mmarshall; 12-01-15 at 05:14 PM.
LOL
12-01-15, 06:10 PM
#63
Lexus Champion
My experience over the past 4 years (all under 50k miles with full dealer history):
ML500 over 12 months: Trim issues, passenger multi-contour seat failed, leaking rear diff, leaking steering rack and noisy PAS pump.
CL63 AMG over 16 months: Failed starter battery and drivers dynamic multi-contour seat plus new engine under MB warranty with previous owner.
XF SV8 over 8 months: Rust on trunk lid & front arches, fuel door failed, gear selector failed, sunroof collapsed, keyless go worked intermittently.
BMW E93 335i M SPORT over 14 months: 2 x wastegates, 2 x turbos, fuel pump, leaking gearbox, leaking AC, failed comfort access handle, various squeaks, rattles and leaking roof all within three weeks of purchase from BMW. Utter junk!
GS430 current: Dashboard squeaks
ML500 over 12 months: Trim issues, passenger multi-contour seat failed, leaking rear diff, leaking steering rack and noisy PAS pump.
CL63 AMG over 16 months: Failed starter battery and drivers dynamic multi-contour seat plus new engine under MB warranty with previous owner.
XF SV8 over 8 months: Rust on trunk lid & front arches, fuel door failed, gear selector failed, sunroof collapsed, keyless go worked intermittently.
BMW E93 335i M SPORT over 14 months: 2 x wastegates, 2 x turbos, fuel pump, leaking gearbox, leaking AC, failed comfort access handle, various squeaks, rattles and leaking roof all within three weeks of purchase from BMW. Utter junk!
GS430 current: Dashboard squeaks
12-01-15, 06:54 PM
#64
You'll get no argument from me that Lexus' long-term reliability is the best, but I'd have no hesitation going with another Audi unless I was going to keep the car for years. Then, I'd go Lexus.
Along the lines of this thread, my Audi service guy once said, "The Germans come up with the new technology and the Japanese perfect it".
12-02-15, 02:11 AM
#65
Driver School Candidate
Were you over-boosting the engine past the red-line on the boost-gauge? That will put a lot of stress on the turbo and waste gate...not to mention the engine itself.
I hear you, though, on some of those BMW problems. Several years ago, I did a full-review on a brand-new M3 (bright blue) sitting right on the dealer-lot. Here's a car fresh out of the factory, mind you, with not even 20 miles on it. When I tried out the back seat (cramped as it was for a big guy my size), and pulled down the center arm-rest, the entire arm rest and its mounting hardware popped right out of the seat and fell down on the floor, leaving a big hole in the middle of the setback. It had just been stuffed in at the factory, like a cork in a bottleneck, and never actually attached. Then, if that wasn't bad enough, on the same car, it had either defective wiring, switches, or electric motor on the power-front drivers' seat. The switches would intermittently start to work one second, and not the next. I struggled with it for almost 10 minutes, then a couple of techs came out from the service department to try it, and THEY couldn't get it to work properly either. Finally, we got the seat into a position that was adequate for my test-drive....after the better part of 20 more minutes. When I brought the car back from the test-drive, it went right into the shop to have both the front and rear seats worked on.
I hear you, though, on some of those BMW problems. Several years ago, I did a full-review on a brand-new M3 (bright blue) sitting right on the dealer-lot. Here's a car fresh out of the factory, mind you, with not even 20 miles on it. When I tried out the back seat (cramped as it was for a big guy my size), and pulled down the center arm-rest, the entire arm rest and its mounting hardware popped right out of the seat and fell down on the floor, leaving a big hole in the middle of the setback. It had just been stuffed in at the factory, like a cork in a bottleneck, and never actually attached. Then, if that wasn't bad enough, on the same car, it had either defective wiring, switches, or electric motor on the power-front drivers' seat. The switches would intermittently start to work one second, and not the next. I struggled with it for almost 10 minutes, then a couple of techs came out from the service department to try it, and THEY couldn't get it to work properly either. Finally, we got the seat into a position that was adequate for my test-drive....after the better part of 20 more minutes. When I brought the car back from the test-drive, it went right into the shop to have both the front and rear seats worked on.
12-02-15, 02:27 AM
#66
Driver School Candidate
If the experience of my friends is anything to go by then my own experience of the brands mentioned has actually been quite typical.
A search of the Web for BMW N54 wastegate rattle, ML steering rack leaks, XF trunk rust or MB M156 head bolts will show these are common problems amongst many.
A search of the Web for BMW N54 wastegate rattle, ML steering rack leaks, XF trunk rust or MB M156 head bolts will show these are common problems amongst many.
12-02-15, 04:36 AM
#67
Lead Lap
If the experience of my friends is anything to go by then my own experience of the brands mentioned has actually been quite typical.
A search of the Web for BMW N54 wastegate rattle, ML steering rack leaks, XF trunk rust or MB M156 head bolts will show these are common problems amongst many.
A search of the Web for BMW N54 wastegate rattle, ML steering rack leaks, XF trunk rust or MB M156 head bolts will show these are common problems amongst many.
12-02-15, 05:29 AM
#68
Lexus Test Driver
I tend to not judge a car brand from the anecdotal evidence from other people's friends having many issues on certain cars. However, out of my 3 friends with 335s, two were lemons and the third had multiple dealer visits for problems in the first year. This steered me away to the Lexus as I found a comparable vehicle in the IS350. BMW is definitely meant for leasing.
12-02-15, 06:02 AM
#69
Advanced
I may try a GS when it come time to trade the KIA.
I test drove a IS350 model, but it is not for me.
To KIA credit the Optima has held up pretty well for a two year old car.
Quiet, handles well, averages 24-25 mpg, very fast.
I have the 2.0T model with the twin-scroll turbo that makes 274 hp on regular gas(up to 290hp with 93 octane) and it moves.
I have changed the crappy stock Hankook tires for Michelin Primacy tire and use only premium Shell V-power 93 octane gas even though KIA says it is OK to use regular.
Those two changes alone enhance the Optima ten fold by making it quieter and quicker.
I noticed that the Optima had potential to be great during my test drive.
I knew that the stock Hankook Optimo 431 tires were crap and that regular gas does nothing for turbo engines even with direct injection technology.
The IS350 is still the faster car, but the KIA 2.0T is not that far behind when tweaked.
Last edited by carguy75; 12-02-15 at 06:11 AM.
12-02-15, 06:19 AM
#70
Advanced
I'm on my fourth Audi since 2009... '09 A5 S-Line, '10 S5 Cab, '11 S5 Cab, '15 S5 Coupe (yes, the S5 hits the sweet spot for me). I think the longest I kept one was 10k miles, but I haven't had even minor issues. I kept my '13 Lexus GS F Sport for 3 years and 21k miles and never had an issue either, aside from the aluminum trim denting. My dad kept his LS400 for close to 50k miles with nothing other than scheduled maintenance.
You'll get no argument from me that Lexus' long-term reliability is the best, but I'd have no hesitation going with another Audi unless I was going to keep the car for years. Then, I'd go Lexus.
Along the lines of this thread, my Audi service guy once said, "The Germans come up with the new technology and the Japanese perfect it".
You'll get no argument from me that Lexus' long-term reliability is the best, but I'd have no hesitation going with another Audi unless I was going to keep the car for years. Then, I'd go Lexus.
Along the lines of this thread, my Audi service guy once said, "The Germans come up with the new technology and the Japanese perfect it".
Audi has some solid cars also, however I avoided them due to issues with the 8speed transmission on some model failing just outside of the warranty period(after 50k miles).
Something to do with a electronic sensor inside the transmission itself that has to be replaced that requires the entire transmission be removed for the car.$$$$
Trust me i really liked the Q5, but read about the 8speed issues on the Audi forums and decided to go with Lexus for our next SUV.
Last edited by carguy75; 12-02-15 at 06:28 AM.
12-02-15, 06:27 AM
#71
Advanced
No boost gauge on the E93 plus I had barely done 300 miles in the car when I heard the wastegate rattle whilst reversing out of my garage with the window down. Turns out it's a common problem on the twin turbo N54 but what annoyed me more was that BMW sold this car with so many existing faults. The comfort access wasn't even working the day I collected the car from the dealer and it was down hill from there. Very happy it has gone.
The interior on most I have seem has peeling soft-touch rubber on the control ***** and the seats look very worn.
I wonder why the BMW dealers do not just replace the ***** on the CPO for the high price they ask for them.
Also the high pressure fuel pump issues/failures on some of the turbo models scared me away from BMW even though the have some nice sleek looking models like the 335 and 535.
Last edited by carguy75; 12-02-15 at 06:32 AM.
12-02-15, 06:34 AM
#72
Lexus Champion
I'm on my fourth Audi since 2009... '09 A5 S-Line, '10 S5 Cab, '11 S5 Cab, '15 S5 Coupe (yes, the S5 hits the sweet spot for me). I think the longest I kept one was 10k miles, but I haven't had even minor issues. I kept my '13 Lexus GS F Sport for 3 years and 21k miles and never had an issue either, aside from the aluminum trim denting. My dad kept his LS400 for close to 50k miles with nothing other than scheduled maintenance.
You'll get no argument from me that Lexus' long-term reliability is the best, but I'd have no hesitation going with another Audi unless I was going to keep the car for years. Then, I'd go Lexus.
Along the lines of this thread, my Audi service guy once said, "The Germans come up with the new technology and the Japanese perfect it".
You'll get no argument from me that Lexus' long-term reliability is the best, but I'd have no hesitation going with another Audi unless I was going to keep the car for years. Then, I'd go Lexus.
Along the lines of this thread, my Audi service guy once said, "The Germans come up with the new technology and the Japanese perfect it".
12-02-15, 06:38 AM
#73
Lead Lap
Something to do with a electronic sensor inside the transmission itself that has to be replaced that requires the entire transmission be removed for the car.$$$$
Trust me i really liked the Q5, but read about the 8speed issues on the Audi forums and decided to go with Lexus for our next SUV.
Trust me i really liked the Q5, but read about the 8speed issues on the Audi forums and decided to go with Lexus for our next SUV.
12-02-15, 06:43 AM
#74
Lexus Test Driver
Originally Posted by carguy75
I was thinking the same thing.
I may try a GS when it come time to trade the KIA.
I test drove a IS350 model, but it is not for me.
To KIA credit the Optima has held up pretty well for a two year old car.
Quiet, handles well, averages 24-25 mpg, very fast.
I have the 2.0T model with the twin-scroll turbo that makes 274 hp on regular gas(up to 290hp with 93 octane) and it moves.
I have changed the crappy stock Hankook tires for Michelin Primacy tire and use only premium Shell V-power 93 octane gas even though KIA says it is OK to use regular.
Those two changes alone enhance the Optima ten fold by making it quieter and quicker.
I noticed that the Optima had potential to be great during my test drive.
I knew that the stock Hankook Optimo 431 tires were crap and that regular gas does nothing for turbo engines even with direct injection technology.
The IS350 is still the faster car, but the KIA 2.0T is not that far behind when tweaked.
I may try a GS when it come time to trade the KIA.
I test drove a IS350 model, but it is not for me.
To KIA credit the Optima has held up pretty well for a two year old car.
Quiet, handles well, averages 24-25 mpg, very fast.
I have the 2.0T model with the twin-scroll turbo that makes 274 hp on regular gas(up to 290hp with 93 octane) and it moves.
I have changed the crappy stock Hankook tires for Michelin Primacy tire and use only premium Shell V-power 93 octane gas even though KIA says it is OK to use regular.
Those two changes alone enhance the Optima ten fold by making it quieter and quicker.
I noticed that the Optima had potential to be great during my test drive.
I knew that the stock Hankook Optimo 431 tires were crap and that regular gas does nothing for turbo engines even with direct injection technology.
The IS350 is still the faster car, but the KIA 2.0T is not that far behind when tweaked.
It sounds like luxury cruising is more your want so another alternative could be a TLX from Acura or the Q50. Those are great entry level lux cruisers.
12-02-15, 08:31 AM
#75
Driver School Candidate
I tend to not judge a car brand from the anecdotal evidence from other people's friends having many issues on certain cars. However, out of my 3 friends with 335s, two were lemons and the third had multiple dealer visits for problems in the first year. This steered me away to the Lexus as I found a comparable vehicle in the IS350. BMW is definitely meant for leasing.