Interesting...Toyota's Lexus Testing Haggle-Free Sales at 12 U.S. Stores
08-07-15, 03:13 PM
#61
In my dealings with Saturn and Scion, this is essentially correct. My only real negotiations were over the value of my trade. It made for a very nice interaction with my salesperson, as they were no longer the middle man of the deal. The salesperson was there to show me the car, answer questions, and help with the paperwork. It was a very pleasant experience.
08-07-15, 07:39 PM
#62
Lexus Champion
I consider myself an educated buyer, and before buying, I do my research. I may visit a number of dealers (as I did before deciding on my current ESh) but I do so in order to learn about a particular model (or models) and to learn about a dealership, if there is a choice; I do not visit dealers to haggle over price.
I hate haggling over a price and I detest pushy salesman who know nothing about the product except how to play the game of walking back and forth between his desk and the sales manager's office; any dealership that promotes this game has very likely lost my sale (likely forever). I find this a waste of my time, and I find going out of my way just to save a few dollars on the price to be not worth the effort. How much am I saving if I have to drive far to a distant dealership just because they offered me the best price? I do not mind "paying a little more" if the sales representatives and other dealership associates treat me with respect; pushy sales is NOT respectful, IMO.
I hate haggling over a price and I detest pushy salesman who know nothing about the product except how to play the game of walking back and forth between his desk and the sales manager's office; any dealership that promotes this game has very likely lost my sale (likely forever). I find this a waste of my time, and I find going out of my way just to save a few dollars on the price to be not worth the effort. How much am I saving if I have to drive far to a distant dealership just because they offered me the best price? I do not mind "paying a little more" if the sales representatives and other dealership associates treat me with respect; pushy sales is NOT respectful, IMO.
08-07-15, 09:06 PM
#63
Racer
If the dealers take about one third off of their profit margin with no haggle I see that as a good thing. When it comes time for my next Lexus I would know what I am paying when I walk in the door. If I had a trade in that is where I would bargain hard. Those of you who think you are buying your car below invoice are badly mistaken. They may show you that invoice, but there is another invoice in the back office that shows what it really costs them, plus the incentives they get. A dealer can not really sell its car below invoice (not MSRP) and still remain in business. It worked great for the Saturn buyers. The car itself turned out to be a loser, but the pricing concept works. I think the pricing idea will work. That is why Lexus wants to do it. They want to get ahead of BMW and Mercedes in sales volume. Besides if I am looking for a new LS or GX I would not let a few hundred dollars change my mind. The cars have a better reliability rating and for the most part a higher resale value. BMW in general has one of the worst resale values.
and you can buy a car/suv below invoice and the dealer still makes money.
i can bet you they will not charge invoice in the no haggle model, but way above it closer to msrp..
08-07-15, 09:28 PM
#64
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Booo,... Lexus to test a no-negotiation price program at some dealerships in 2016
http://uncovercalifornia.com/content...alerships-2016
Reason why I bought Lexus,.. is the price negotiated. I see other brand like Acura is gonna welcome this new change.
Reason why I bought Lexus,.. is the price negotiated. I see other brand like Acura is gonna welcome this new change.
08-07-15, 10:27 PM
#65
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http://uncovercalifornia.com/content...alerships-2016
Reason why I bought Lexus,.. is the price negotiated. I see other brand like Acura is gonna welcome this new change.
Reason why I bought Lexus,.. is the price negotiated. I see other brand like Acura is gonna welcome this new change.
08-07-15, 10:35 PM
#66
This was already posted a couple days ago, and that thread has been moved to General Forums - Car Chat.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...-s-stores.html
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...-s-stores.html
08-08-15, 03:59 AM
#67
I'd like to see them do no haggle dealer invoice price.
Give everyone dealer invoice !
I wonder if that would result in mega sales, or if Merc and BMW will whoop lexus' *** just the same
Give everyone dealer invoice !
I wonder if that would result in mega sales, or if Merc and BMW will whoop lexus' *** just the same
08-08-15, 07:05 AM
#68
Lexus Fanatic
Interesting...Toyota's Lexus Testing Haggle-Free Sales at 12 U.S. Stores
A lot of dealers already do this. The dealer that I use has a "marked down price" that is already pretty good, I always do a little better, but even if I had to pay that marked down price, I'd be happy with that.
08-08-15, 09:15 AM
#69
Here's my version of No-Haggle pricing:
I prepare a Purchase Offer -- a document that completely specifies the car that I want, with exactly the options that I want, and offers a fixed price for that car. I give that document to the dealer. That is my only and final offer. They can take it or leave it.
I have done this for every car I have purchased during the last two decades. It puts the dealer off-balance, to say the least. Sometimes they make a counter-offer. But then, they are the one making the offer, not me. And I can just walk out at any point.
I prepare a Purchase Offer -- a document that completely specifies the car that I want, with exactly the options that I want, and offers a fixed price for that car. I give that document to the dealer. That is my only and final offer. They can take it or leave it.
I have done this for every car I have purchased during the last two decades. It puts the dealer off-balance, to say the least. Sometimes they make a counter-offer. But then, they are the one making the offer, not me. And I can just walk out at any point.
08-08-15, 11:08 AM
#70
Lexus Fanatic
That's what a lot of car buyers seem to like (me included)...a reasonably good price, marked down, that saves most of the hassles of negotiating, and at the same time gives the dealership some profit that they are entitled to. Since you're in the Maryland suburbs, you're probably familiar with the Fitzgerald chain (you know, the old man who says "There's Just No Better Way to Go" in his commercials). I believe he was the one who actually pioneered that No-Haggle Discount system in the D.C. area, though a few other local shops have followed suit.
08-08-15, 11:24 AM
#71
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I read the article in USA today and I think that no haggle prices means prices substantially lower than MSRP prices. Like a couple of thousands off, like the Saturn dealers were selling those cars.
The dealers will set these lower prices with different options installed, with decent profit margin for them. They have to let the customer walk away if the customer doesn't want to pay the no haggle price.
I really think this campaign will be successful and will roll out to the whole country. Most of us hate the haggling with car salesman, I know I do.
The dealers will set these lower prices with different options installed, with decent profit margin for them. They have to let the customer walk away if the customer doesn't want to pay the no haggle price.
I really think this campaign will be successful and will roll out to the whole country. Most of us hate the haggling with car salesman, I know I do.
08-08-15, 11:36 AM
#72
Lexus Fanatic
I don't know if they're still doing it, but when I bought a Mini Cooper for a spouse in 2008 it was a no-haggle purchase and it was the easiest car transaction of my life. I think it was 45 minutes from walking in the door to walking out with the signed and paid-for order form (I special ordered from the car configurator, so it was a few weeks until it arrived).
It sounds as though I'm in the minority on this board, but I just hate haggling. Charge a price for your product, and if it's fair and I want the product, I'll pay it. It forces the manufacturer to do the hard work on pricing, instead of the consumer. Haggling is just a technique used by dealerships to ensure that customers are paying absolutely the most that they are willing to pay for a car.
It sounds as though I'm in the minority on this board, but I just hate haggling. Charge a price for your product, and if it's fair and I want the product, I'll pay it. It forces the manufacturer to do the hard work on pricing, instead of the consumer. Haggling is just a technique used by dealerships to ensure that customers are paying absolutely the most that they are willing to pay for a car.
for a majority of car buyers the haggling is a no win situation. The dealers are negotiating 50-100 vehicles a week while the consumer may only do it once every 3-10 years. As a consumer you don't know what the break even price for the dealer is. That is why many consumers are using the TrueCar and Edmunds pricing now. While it may not be the lowest price possible it is generally a fair price where the consumer is not getting ripped off and the dealer makes a little.
What will be interesting is if service changes in this model. Will it become a thing where if you service your vehicle at a dealer where you didn't buy the vehicle you won't get a loaner. Will there be other items the dealers play up in this model?
Recently my wife was buying a Mazda 3. She did her research and had her Edmunds / True Car price. She knew a lot about the vehicle she wanted and had a vin for a specific vehicle she wanted with the engine configuration and packages she desired. The dealer didn't wiggle on that price at all but negotiated the trade in, extended warranty, etc.... We saw another customer come in that appeared to know nothing about cars. This middle aged woman said to the salesman that she wanted an all wheel drive SUV. Mazda has the smaller CX5 and the larger CX9 but this woman didn't know the differences between them in regards to size, engine, or anything else. I am guessing the salesman was salivating inside.
What will be interesting is if service changes in this model. Will it become a thing where if you service your vehicle at a dealer where you didn't buy the vehicle you won't get a loaner. Will there be other items the dealers play up in this model?
Recently my wife was buying a Mazda 3. She did her research and had her Edmunds / True Car price. She knew a lot about the vehicle she wanted and had a vin for a specific vehicle she wanted with the engine configuration and packages she desired. The dealer didn't wiggle on that price at all but negotiated the trade in, extended warranty, etc.... We saw another customer come in that appeared to know nothing about cars. This middle aged woman said to the salesman that she wanted an all wheel drive SUV. Mazda has the smaller CX5 and the larger CX9 but this woman didn't know the differences between them in regards to size, engine, or anything else. I am guessing the salesman was salivating inside.
1. You are in fact techinically negotiating when you pick a pre set price. All that is present is that the price is fixed.
2. The luxury car market is ULTRA competitive and a new product that is "hot" and is in "demand" will usually command closer to MSRP than invoice. A Lexus dealer has to be out of their mind to practically give a car away. Other Lexus dealers will be forced to lower the price on a new model when they can obviously charge more.
3. Competition like MB, BMW, etc immediately get an advantage as more people like to negotiate or deal than they like a fixed price. Lots of people want to know or "think" they got a deal.
The product decides the price paid by the consumer, it has ALWAYS been this way. Not the other way around.
People also have to remember that the social norm is to try and haggle, there is also the idea that payoff of haggling is worth the time and effort.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 08-08-15 at 12:02 PM.
08-08-15, 11:48 AM
#73
While this program sounds appealing my limited experience with "no haggling" dealers is that most often the prices are not low enough and the selling dealers just use the policy as an excuse not to deal. It is not unlike preprinting the "doc fee" on the purchase contract and saying it too is non-negotiable. Lately I've even seen purchase contracts with nitrogen filled tires or "protection package" pre printed on the contract. I'm not saying I wouldn't like such a program I just don't think it will work and we are accustomed to negotiating on cars - I used to even enjoy it but not anymore. And even when I did, I never thought I "won" the battle - it's the dealers playing field and they have to make money to continue in business.
Dave Mac
Dave Mac
08-08-15, 12:00 PM
#74
Lexus Fanatic
They DO sell a lot of things that way, however, in primitive societies and/or in a lot of Middle Eastern countries, open-market/bazaar-style. But American society, for most things, just doesn't operate that way...most people don't want to, or have time to, negotiate. In fact, try that in most stores and the manager or supervisor will probably ask you politely to leave.
Last edited by mmarshall; 08-08-15 at 12:04 PM.
08-08-15, 12:45 PM
#75
Lexus Champion
3. Competition like MB, BMW, etc immediately get an advantage as more people like to negotiate or deal than they like a fixed price. Lots of people want to know or "think" they got a deal.
The product decides the price paid by the consumer, it has ALWAYS been this way. Not the other way around.
People also have to remember that the social norm is to try and haggle, there is also the idea that payoff of haggling is worth the time and effort.
The product decides the price paid by the consumer, it has ALWAYS been this way. Not the other way around.
People also have to remember that the social norm is to try and haggle, there is also the idea that payoff of haggling is worth the time and effort.