2016 Lexus GS Facelift
#121
^ the current GS eased the public into the Spindle design. Four years later and we've come full circle, the 4.5GS very closely resembles the concept which has manifested itself into the whole Lexus Line
Since the hybrid version hasn't appeared yet I'll just pretend the above is what it is
Since the hybrid version hasn't appeared yet I'll just pretend the above is what it is
#123
exclusive matchup
iTrader: (4)
and imho lexus started it with the fsport and they are milking it just as much as the others. the f sport and f are so confusing a lot of people can't distinguish. then it comes all the m235i. i don't like all those moves for sure. i think every car has their own merit. i am not a fan of the cla45 but it doesn't have certain performance. fwd is not a death sentence by default -- honda has proven it too
#124
#126
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
I don't know if I agree with that, even Honda knew better when it came to the two PROPER sports cars that they ever made - the NSX and S2K, which were both RWD.
#127
exclusive matchup
iTrader: (4)
I disagree with that, there were BMW's and MB's which carried M and AMG packages, but were not M or AMG cars long before Lexus even introduced F and F sport. And F sport is a subtle package, they don't make it a part of model name like say X5 M50d, or M550d or M235i. And don't get me wrong, I actually got myself the m235i, and its an awesome car, but while the M badging is cool I still think it should only belong on true M cars.
I don't know if I agree with that, even Honda knew better when it came to the two PROPER sports cars that they ever made - the NSX and S2K, which were both RWD.
I don't know if I agree with that, even Honda knew better when it came to the two PROPER sports cars that they ever made - the NSX and S2K, which were both RWD.
i consider m sport package just like the fsport package, it's just a package with a m / f badge on it.
and we are definitely on the same page that the m badge shouldn't be on non-m cars. i blame fully on marketing. and from a distant and clearly to most people, they can't tell difference between f and fsport.
i am not saying fwd is the proper way to do a sports car, but i am saying fwd doesn't automatically mean it's inferior. both the integra type r and civic si i think they are pretty decent fun cars. nothing like s2k or nsx but it's not like traditional fwd imho. same with cla45.
and again, i am not saying i am a fan, i am not. but i am just saying there is some merit given the amg philosophy since the beginning (which is different from bmw m imho, or at least originally)
Last edited by rominl; 08-28-15 at 01:29 PM.
#128
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
no, m sport and the m badge together with the 235 or whatever, it came out after fsport was introduced. fsport came out i think around 2010 or 2012 time frame? they didn't have msport back then. mb from factory never had/has amg badge on anything but amg cars. all the amg badges are put on by dealerships.
i consider m sport package just like the fsport package, it's just a package with a m / f badge on it.
and we are definitely on the same page that the m badge shouldn't be on non-m cars. i blame fully on marketing. and from a distant and clearly to most people, they can't tell difference between f and fsport.
and we are definitely on the same page that the m badge shouldn't be on non-m cars. i blame fully on marketing. and from a distant and clearly to most people, they can't tell difference between f and fsport.
But whatever, its marketing and its clearly working for them. These extra bits attract buyers, so everyone is jumping on the band wagon. And while I'm not fond of this marketing, but if it makes Lexus offer more customization to spice up their traditionally boring line up - let it be.
i am not saying fwd is the proper way to do a sports car, but i am saying fwd doesn't automatically mean it's inferior. both the integra type r and civic si i think they are pretty decent fun cars. nothing like s2k or nsx but it's not like traditional fwd imho. same with cla45.
and again, i am not saying i am a fan, i am not. but i am just saying there is some merit given the amg philosophy since the beginning (which is different from bmw m imho, or at least originally)
and again, i am not saying i am a fan, i am not. but i am just saying there is some merit given the amg philosophy since the beginning (which is different from bmw m imho, or at least originally)
#129
exclusive matchup
iTrader: (4)
they called it msport and amg package, but they actually carried no badge on the cars at all until after lexus started doing fsport. but you do have a good point with some mb with amg wheels (that says amg).
i am not very sure, i have had more than a few of my non-car friends pointing out a regular fsport (from the rear) saying oh so that's the lexus super sports car right? they saw the fsport badge. it might not be with the is250 badge, but effect is there
for sure the marketing is working for all manufacturers, no doubt. but i am sure you and i both agree from a pure enthusiast point of view, this is quite sad. the whole exclusivity is down the toilet big time
i am not very sure, i have had more than a few of my non-car friends pointing out a regular fsport (from the rear) saying oh so that's the lexus super sports car right? they saw the fsport badge. it might not be with the is250 badge, but effect is there
for sure the marketing is working for all manufacturers, no doubt. but i am sure you and i both agree from a pure enthusiast point of view, this is quite sad. the whole exclusivity is down the toilet big time
#130
It just needs the nike LEDs.
#131
Lexus Test Driver
I disagree with that, there were BMW's and MB's which carried M and AMG packages, but were not M or AMG cars long before Lexus even introduced F and F sport. And F sport is a subtle package, they don't make it a part of model name like say X5 M50d, or M550d or M235i. And don't get me wrong, I actually got myself the m235i, and its an awesome car, but while the M badging is cool I still think it should only belong on true M cars.
My issue with Lexus is the "F" brand is WEAK - LFA was great but no replacement. ISF discontinued.
RCF is the only true F model and not sure why the upcoming GSF is an F car, should be GS500F.
It has not gained traction with enthusiasts and most F sport branded cars offer no real performance benefit.
So Lexus started putting the F badging on everything before truly having real performance F models. Putting the carriage before the horse so to speak.
//M and AMG have great history and a full lineup of true performance models that give credibility to each brand.
#132
Lexus Test Driver
bland profile, same front design as every other BMW and pretty bad rear design... yes, F10 is boring vehicle when we are talking about it at the end of 2015.
I see same amounts of E class, A6 and 5 series (and a lot of all of them every day), and 5 series easily has the most vanilla design of them all... A6 manages to look way more interesting, and E class while being old design, doesnt look like anything else.
5 series is literally the Camry of European executive sedans.
I see same amounts of E class, A6 and 5 series (and a lot of all of them every day), and 5 series easily has the most vanilla design of them all... A6 manages to look way more interesting, and E class while being old design, doesnt look like anything else.
5 series is literally the Camry of European executive sedans.
If you dont feel the A6 is a bland design then you are from a different planet and your hatred for BMW is really apparent. A6 has FWD proportions unlike the 5 which has long hood, short overhangs etc.
A great design will still be great 10-20 years from now. Everytime i see an E39 on the road, it still looks amazing and same for 2GS. E60 on the other hand is still awkward.
F10 is considered a GREAT design by most people and has BMW evolutionary heritage styling unlike the E60 before it.
#133
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
There is no doubt that BMW and MB are milking the //M and AMG naming by offering styling packages and various accessories. Lexus is smart to do the same with F sport.
My issue with Lexus is the "F" brand is WEAK - LFA was great but no replacement. ISF discontinued.
RCF is the only true F model and not sure why the upcoming GSF is an F car, should be GS500F.
It has not gained traction with enthusiasts and most F sport branded cars offer no real performance benefit.
So Lexus started putting the F badging on everything before truly having real performance F models. Putting the carriage before the horse so to speak.
//M and AMG have great history and a full lineup of true performance models that give credibility to each brand.
My issue with Lexus is the "F" brand is WEAK - LFA was great but no replacement. ISF discontinued.
RCF is the only true F model and not sure why the upcoming GSF is an F car, should be GS500F.
It has not gained traction with enthusiasts and most F sport branded cars offer no real performance benefit.
So Lexus started putting the F badging on everything before truly having real performance F models. Putting the carriage before the horse so to speak.
//M and AMG have great history and a full lineup of true performance models that give credibility to each brand.
#134
Lexus Champion
iTrader: (3)
If you dont feel the A6 is a bland design then you are from a different planet and your hatred for BMW is really apparent. A6 has FWD proportions unlike the 5 which has long hood, short overhangs etc.
A great design will still be great 10-20 years from now. Everytime i see an E39 on the road, it still looks amazing and same for 2GS. E60 on the other hand is still awkward.
F10 is considered a GREAT design by most people and has BMW evolutionary heritage styling unlike the E60 before it.
And I'm totally with you on E39 and 2GS - they are truly timeless.
#135
I'm an Audi owner and think the A6 is the most bland sedan in its class. That's why when I traded my last S5 for a sedan I went with a 4GS. The 5 Series still looks great and so does the GS (in F Sport trim). IMHO, the E Class is an angular mess that they have been trying to fix and will finally be cleaned up when they sprinkle it with the S Class "fairy dust" like they did with the C Class.
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