What If Lexus and Mazda Teamed Up for a New Supercar?
#17
This makes no sense. A Mazda supercar should have a rotary engine (Furai anyone?), full stop. It's also hard to believe Lexus could gain anything from Mazda in building a supercar.
A midrange Toyota/Lexus-Mazda sports car collaboration could be interesting, though.
The 787B only won LeMans because it was more reliable than competitors - it's not a good example of or argument for Mazda leading in performance or other such qualities. Many cars even in LeMans, including the Mercedes-Benz C11, were much faster. It's also tough to make an argument about driving characteristics in racing categories like the 787B's Group C (which is today's LMP1/LMP2/SR1/WSC), where the cars are prototype race cars as opposed to production cars, and thus are fully adjustable to suit a particular driver's preferences.
Or Lexus should just buy Aston Martin.
A midrange Toyota/Lexus-Mazda sports car collaboration could be interesting, though.
The 787B only won LeMans because it was more reliable than competitors - it's not a good example of or argument for Mazda leading in performance or other such qualities. Many cars even in LeMans, including the Mercedes-Benz C11, were much faster. It's also tough to make an argument about driving characteristics in racing categories like the 787B's Group C (which is today's LMP1/LMP2/SR1/WSC), where the cars are prototype race cars as opposed to production cars, and thus are fully adjustable to suit a particular driver's preferences.
Or Lexus should just buy Aston Martin.
#18
Lexus Test Driver
Reliability is key in endurance racing; no one is disputing that. But reliability wasn't what was being discussed. And surely, it should not be - after all, do you really think Mazda could help Lexus make a more reliable supercar? Does Lexus really need help with that given the LFA is regarded to be among the most reliable supercars - if not the most - ever made?
I'm going to assume you just brought up the 787B in a discussion about handling and tuning without understanding that it only won because of reliability (not to mention the other issues of trying to make it relevant to our discussion, such as an LMP1 car not being a good indicator of handling feedback regardless of how quick it is). Either way, the 787B doesn't at all rebut the assertion that I and others have made that Mazda doesn't have the pedigree in supercar handling and tuning to make a joint venture worthwhile.
- Let me know in which racing series "riced up street cars" can race against FIA GT3/4 or ACO GTE Porsche, Ferrari, or MB vehicles; and
- the issue being discussed was not winning races or being "faster" anyway, but what handling/tuning expertise Lexus would gain from a joint venture.
No idea why the responses to my post have all been complete non sequiturs - guess that says a lot about the debate in question.
Last edited by gengar; 10-04-15 at 05:40 PM.
#21
Pit Crew
Like others, I don't think Lexus needs to team with Mazda, or anyone else in my opinion.
As for is the supercar market ripe for being knocked off? YES, YES, YES, its never been better.
Consider both Corvette and Porsche, the two big players in the US are plagued with serious reliability problems. Due to VW's mess, Porsche is in no position to respond to a new entry. With Corvette engines doing their hand grenade imitation, GM keeps hoping no one will notice. Mercedes and Jaguar have never been taken seriously in the US despite their performance. With Lexus's stellar reputation for reliability, I'm amazed they haven't decided to invade this section with a price structure similar to GM, a $60-70K entry level model and a $110K supercar.
As for is the supercar market ripe for being knocked off? YES, YES, YES, its never been better.
Consider both Corvette and Porsche, the two big players in the US are plagued with serious reliability problems. Due to VW's mess, Porsche is in no position to respond to a new entry. With Corvette engines doing their hand grenade imitation, GM keeps hoping no one will notice. Mercedes and Jaguar have never been taken seriously in the US despite their performance. With Lexus's stellar reputation for reliability, I'm amazed they haven't decided to invade this section with a price structure similar to GM, a $60-70K entry level model and a $110K supercar.
#22
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
article is pure 'what if' not based on even rumors.
toyota has relationships with yamaha and bmw to name two performance powerhouses. yeah it took the mazda 2 for a scion (dumb move imo) but i don't see ANYTHING toyota can learn or gain from a joint performance car venture with mazda.
toyota has relationships with yamaha and bmw to name two performance powerhouses. yeah it took the mazda 2 for a scion (dumb move imo) but i don't see ANYTHING toyota can learn or gain from a joint performance car venture with mazda.
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