pbm317

It debuted back in the 2016 car in China already. http://www.automobilemag.com/news/20...m-in-shanghai/ But they've withheld it from the U.S. Market, choosing to focus on the En-vehicles. Encore, Envision, Enclave and likely some repositioning of Regal vs the new LaCrosse

Toys4RJill

Nobody knows if that is the true reason. There is speculation that the Varano is going to be replaced by a Cadillac based Cruze type of vehicle

mmarshall

It is indeed a bargain by sedan standards, but the true reason it is being discontinued (per GM itself) is because of the exploding popularity of SUVs, and to get more factory space for SUVs. Like it or not, SUVs are simply taking over the American market....and you can generally hank cheap gas, though not all SUVs get bad mileage.

coolsaber

This move and even the Corolla move saddens me a great bit. That infrastructure, city economy, jobs, and most importantly families are going to feel the brunt of the quest to maximize margins by the automakers. And yes, someone can say well thats how capitalism works, and well now new individuals in third world nations, or other in need nations will get jobs etc. Great but really doesnt take away from the crap these people are in for. People probs fought hard to keep them there, but usually once a company has made its mind up, its near impossible to reverse course.

Toys4RJill

In the situation of the Corolla, the plant is going to make SUVs. So it's not at all a loss.

mmarshall

Trump is campaigning, in part, on opposition to companies being able to just close down plants and move out of the country at the drop of a hat. But, to date, he hasn't shown many details except to put a 35% tariff on imported goods by U.S.-badged manufacturers. That will (supposedly) not make it economically viable any longer for companies to shift jobs overseas, like they've been doing.

coolsaber

I dont partake in politics, but my opinion is, the president is a nice title to have, but your basically a puppet (no fault of the person of course) controlled by the house, senate, and their big budget lobbyists. So whoever decides to take over, we shall see what the campaign promises actually meant.

But regardless in the meantime these families affected by such transitions have very little hope. At least in the Corolla plant, there transitioning to SUVs, and seeing it as SUVs, CUVs are the hottest thing sliced bread, glimmer of hope. I heard GM and Fiat are moving operations out of there as well, and only one of them is keeping their engine plant up and running

Toys4RJill

This is just General Motors PR speak for "this niche segment is no longer viable for Buick". Regardless if SUVs are taking over sedans, if GM thought they could sell the Verano in the next gen form, they would do it. The problem is that Corolla, Civic, Elantra, and Cruze are all going premium options and premium trim for the small segment. I test drove the Verano last month and while it lived up to the billing of quiet running and pretty decent refinement, at $25k it lacked popular items such as a sunroof, touchscreen, heated seats, power moonroof, leather wrapped wheel, back up cam, and I could add more things. It's hard to justify the price point for a car the size of the Cruze yet asking for Camry money with a lot of missing features.

mmarshall

Agreed.....this is not a political forum. I only reason posted the stuff I did about Trump here because what he was proposing could greatly affect the future of the auto industry.

mmarshall

A leather-wrapped wheel, I think, is standard on U.S. spec versions...as is a touchscreen. True, my 25K Verano lacks a sunroof and heated seats...but I didn't want a sunroof. I'm tall, and sunroof housings typically rob an inch or two of headroom....enough to make a difference. Mine, of course, is a 2012......standard and optional equipment could have changed on it since then.

I've test-driven the four compacts you mention (except for the very latest version of the Civic), and, IMO, none of them can approach the Verano's refinement. Neither can the Acura ILX...though the ILX is extremely well-built. The Audi A3 can, in some areas....not in others.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

so much fail it's hard to know how to respond. so it's an insult that tens of millions of americans use and love chinese built iphones?

there is no outrage. it's a competitive global economy. companies do what they have to do to compete, make a profit, reinvest those profits to make more competitive/better vehicles, rinse, repeat.

mmarshall

I agree with at least part of what you're saying. But, on the other hand, laid-off factory employees usually can't afford to buy new cars..............and what are auto companies in business for? To sell cars. One usually cannot sell new cars to those who are scraping by on unemployment or welfare/food stamps....what little they get usually has to into paying off the mortgage or putting food on the table.

I know this happened many decades ago, when it was a markedly different industry than today, but I'm still a firm believer in Henry Ford's philosophy that the more you pay your workers, the more new vehicles they will, in turn, be able to afford to buy right off the assembly line. Ford, without any union-pressure of any kind (he didn't believe in unions), willingly and voluntarily paid his factory people twice the going rate of other companies.....when other auto-executives laughed and claimed he would go out of business. That was one reason (among several) for the Model T's enormous popularity.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

the flaw in what you say is that if an employee costs a company (with benefits) $100k a year let's say, and buys a new car every 5 years, then it 'costs' a company $500K to sell say a $50K car to make say $10K in profit. the math doesn't work for car companies to keep people hired just so they will buy cars (assuming they will buy cars from the company they work for).

a car company has to assume that laid off workers will find other jobs and the car companies must continue to try to reduce costs, so they can offer cars at prices that enough consumers can afford and want, even if some of their own laid off employees no longer can.

mmarshall

Yes, that's true to some extent (and I'm aware of that), but the other side of the coin is that some companies want it both ways...they want to sell new cars, but not pay people to actually produce them (or pay them slave wages to do so). While I do understand the need to control costs, there is such a thing as greed. These firms want other companies, like you say, to foot the bills, while they themselves reap the benefits in sales. Well, the world doesn't always work that way. You reap what you sow.....or don't sow. And you can bet that laid-off auto workers aren't likely to turn around and fork over tens of thousands of $$$$$, for a new vehicle, right back to the company that just screwed them.

Anyhow, I started this thread, not necessarily to argue the politics or economics of overseas production or of laying off domestic workers (somehow we all got off-track into that), but, now that my knee is back to something at least approaching normal, to take a close look at the Envision and see how the Chinese plant is screwing them together. I think that is important, since it is the first mass-produced Chinese-built (but not necessarily Chinese-designed) vehicle to be marketed on American shores. In the past, several automotive entrepreneurs (including Malcolm Bricklin) have attempted to arrange for Chinese-built vehicles from Chinese companies (like Cheri) to be marketed and sold here (Cheri even had a display one year at the Detroit Auto Show). But, somehow, those attempts fell through the cracks.(my guess is that those vehicles simply couldn't meet American safety and emission standards). GM, of course, has done so with the Envision.....but the Envision comes from an American-badged corporation, not Chinese. And, from what I can tell, especially from the front seas, it seems designed more for Chinese-Sized persons than Americans.

Toys4RJill

A subsidised cell phone costing $200 versus a $42k Buick are different stories. I have already said that if economics make it that a car can no longer be built in the US or Canada, then moving production elsewhere is a given. In the case of GM, Cadillac and Buick should be building their high priced cars, trucks, and SUVs in North America. And yes its a complete insult.