2018 Camry revealed
07-01-17, 10:27 AM
#362
Lexus Fanatic
07-01-17, 10:43 AM
#363
Lexus Fanatic
The new design direction is working.
07-01-17, 11:04 AM
#364
Pole Position
have they lost marketshare or have other marques gained marketshare independent of lexus? i mean, given that lexus set sales records in 2015 and 2016, i'd wager the latter.
07-01-17, 11:08 AM
#365
Lexus Fanatic
I think you are right. The latter makes a little more sense. Lexus sold 198K in 2011, and now 331K in 2017. MB sold 261K in 2011 and now 376K in 2017
07-01-17, 11:54 AM
#366
If you look at their sales though, they're up. It's just Mercedes and BMW have grown much more, they have many more models, etc.
2015 was Lexus biggest sales year ever, 2016 second biggest sales year ever. Market share is down somewhat, but not that much, couple tenths of a % from the highest ever, which makes sense when you look at their placement with their competitors.
Like Jill said, Lexus is doing very well.
As for the Camry, the Accord doesn't blow the old Camry away and it's terrible, it's not going to blow this Camry away either. This will leave the Accord in the dust.
2015 was Lexus biggest sales year ever, 2016 second biggest sales year ever. Market share is down somewhat, but not that much, couple tenths of a % from the highest ever, which makes sense when you look at their placement with their competitors.
Like Jill said, Lexus is doing very well.
As for the Camry, the Accord doesn't blow the old Camry away and it's terrible, it's not going to blow this Camry away either. This will leave the Accord in the dust.
From 2002 to 2016, Lexus increased their sales from a class leading 234k to a no longer class leading 331k units/yr USA.
However, in the same period, Benz increased their sales from a second place 213k to a class leading 374k units/yr USA.
The Europeans have always had more body choices and engine options than Lexus.
While the E Class increased it sales from 2002-07's peak of 58k/yr to 2009-16's peak of 70k/yr, Lexus dropped its new sporty ES sales from 2006-12's peak of 82k/year to 2012-18's sporty ES peak of just 72k/year.
Likewise, Lexus dropped its midsize premium RWD GS sales from 2005-12 3GS' peak of 33k/yr to the new sporty 2012-19 4GS' peak of just 23k/yr.
Old 2003-08 Lexus RX peaked at 108k units/yr, while 2008-15 RX fell slightly to a peak at 107k/yr.
However in that same period, Mercedes ML was allowed increase its sales from 2005-11's peak of 34k to 2011-18's peak of over 46,000 units/yr USA.
Likewise, BMW X5 was allowed to increase its peak from 2006-13's 44k to 2013-20's 54,000+ units/yr USA.
I'm sure Lexus will give the next generation 5LS a nice sporty ride - very relevant to this class of cars, and Lexus fanatics will come up with all sorts of excuses as to why sales cannot match its predecessor 4LS peak of 35,000 units/yr USA.
If TMC is to go sporty, at least it is better to do sports in the Camry which is more likely to be purchased by a younger buyer with faster driving habits and a shallower pocket, than to make the flagship 5LS sporty when 5LS is generally purchased by an older buyer whose driving habits have generally slowed down, but who generally has much deeper pockets.
We can always take a comfortable Camry, and have it firmed up aftermaket - however it is very difficult yo have a sporty Camry softened up for comfort!
Furthermore, when Akio first made his comments about wanting TMC to have more inspired styling & more inspired dynamics, he was comparing TMC to famous European marques like Maserati & Lotus etc.
I wonder if the then new incoming president realizes that Maserati & Lotus etc went broke - the former bought out by Fiat, while the latter bought out by GM?
There's a saying, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Best to be yourself, rather than pretend to be someone else.
For example, rather than pretend to be Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Warren Buffet or Mark Zuckerberg - Steve is best when he is himself, and Peter is best when he is Peter.
Akio is no perfect man - no more perfect than Donald Trump; Akio has his share of victories and mistakes.
_
Last edited by peteharvey; 07-01-17 at 02:03 PM.
07-01-17, 12:27 PM
#367
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
Lexus recent sales growth is due to one thing... the nx. Everything else is pretty flat to way down.
but sales should grow regardless due to immigration and population growth.
but sales should grow regardless due to immigration and population growth.
07-01-17, 12:45 PM
#369
The IS has fallen slightly from the old 2006-13 2IS' 54,000 units/yr USA, to the current 2013-20 3IS' 51,000 units/yr USA.
In the same period, 2000-07 C Class' peak of 69,000 units/yr was allowed to grow to 2007-14 C Class' peak of 88,000 units/yr USA!
Lexus models tend to start with peak sales, and then decline over time.
On the other hand, Mercedes-Benz sales tend to start slowly, and increase thanks to discounting as the model ages.
I like to quote competing rising sales of sedans in the same class, because this stops people from making excuses that sales of certain models of sedans have fallen due to sales of SUV's.
In the same period, 2000-07 C Class' peak of 69,000 units/yr was allowed to grow to 2007-14 C Class' peak of 88,000 units/yr USA!
Lexus models tend to start with peak sales, and then decline over time.
On the other hand, Mercedes-Benz sales tend to start slowly, and increase thanks to discounting as the model ages.
I like to quote competing rising sales of sedans in the same class, because this stops people from making excuses that sales of certain models of sedans have fallen due to sales of SUV's.
07-01-17, 01:25 PM
#370
Lexus Fanatic
Probably depends on just who those immigrants are. Those doing menial jobs and/or making at or near minimum wage are not likely to be taking brand-new vehicles home....especially at Lexus prices.
07-01-17, 01:27 PM
#371
Lexus Champion
Im not sure why they went the "sporty" route with Camry.
This looks like they are losing what they do best and why loyal customers buy a Camry in first place.
They made same mistake with Lexus and the whole Fsport/Lfinesse nonsense.
I would of went more luxury, more comfort, best quality, and best tech - that is what buyers of missize cars want.
If Toyota wants Sport - bring back Supra and Celica.
This looks like they are losing what they do best and why loyal customers buy a Camry in first place.
They made same mistake with Lexus and the whole Fsport/Lfinesse nonsense.
I would of went more luxury, more comfort, best quality, and best tech - that is what buyers of missize cars want.
If Toyota wants Sport - bring back Supra and Celica.
07-01-17, 01:30 PM
#372
Lexus Champion
Is this true? I hope not. Show me the numbers that prove that the new Camry will be smaller inside yet larger outside than the current Camry.
07-01-17, 01:39 PM
#373
Lexus Champion
The new hinges do not increase the size of the hole. It merely raises the trunklid further up and forward when open so that you are less likely to bump your head. But I can see 2 problems with that: shorter people may have a harder time reaching up to close the trunklid; and the larger-diameter gooseneck hinges may actually take up more room inside the trunk when it is closed.
07-01-17, 01:44 PM
#374
Lexus Fanatic
My concern is not about the size of the trunk. I know it is larger. My concern is the size of the opening -- the hole that allows you to put stuff in that trunk. A large trunk is almost useless unless you can actually put large items in it. A small opening limits you to putting in small or flat items that you can actually squeeze in that opening.
The new hinges do not increase the size of the hole. It merely raises the trunklid further up and forward when open so that you are less likely to bump your head. But I can see 2 problems with that: shorter people may have a harder time reaching up to close the trunklid; and the larger-diameter gooseneck hinges may actually take up more room inside the trunk when it is closed.
The new hinges do not increase the size of the hole. It merely raises the trunklid further up and forward when open so that you are less likely to bump your head. But I can see 2 problems with that: shorter people may have a harder time reaching up to close the trunklid; and the larger-diameter gooseneck hinges may actually take up more room inside the trunk when it is closed.
07-01-17, 02:15 PM
#375
Lexus Champion
No, I did not, but I was asking the question of anybody who has actually seen the new Camry: How large is the trunk opening? It looks small. I have not seen it in person myself but I am concerned that the size of the hole is smaller.