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Thanks for the review, we've always had a Forrester in the garage for the past decade, and they have been nothing but great to my, my wife and my son for all of our adventures. I find myself disappointed, however, at the CVT. I haven't driven one yet, but the last CTV Audi I drove didn't leave me too impressed.
They may be inexpensive and 'sensible' but soooo ugly.
I respect the preferences of others on design since differing opinions make discussing cars interesting. I migrated from Lexus to Subaru several years ago and never looked back. Maybe with reduced expectations because of cost, a lack of rattles compared to both RXs I owned, much better response from Subaru Customer service than I ever received from Lexus and especially because of excellent resale value guaranteed by Subaru, I have become a loyal customer. My latest '17 Outback Touring, in my eyes, is a great looking wagon/crossover even comparing it to much more expensive brands. Sure Subarus are not for everyone, but more people are jumping on its bandwagon because sales have continued to increase every month over the same month in the previous year for at least 3 years. Most importantly Subaru understands value, which IMO, Lexus has sadly forgotten to include in it's offerings.
I respect the preferences of others on design since differing opinions make discussing cars interesting. I migrated from Lexus to Subaru several years ago and never looked back. Maybe with reduced expectations because of cost, a lack of rattles compared to both RXs I owned, much better response from Subaru Customer service than I ever received from Lexus and especially because of excellent resale value guaranteed by Subaru, I have become a loyal customer. My latest '17 Outback Touring, in my eyes, is a great looking wagon/crossover even comparing it to much more expensive brands. Sure Subarus are not for everyone, but more people are jumping on its bandwagon because sales have continued to increase every month over the same month in the previous year for at least 3 years. Most importantly Subaru understands value, which IMO, Lexus has sadly forgotten to include in it's offerings.
Agreed, I really like the current Outback, I think they look great!
Glad you enjoyed it. A lot of people in my area drive them, even though winters here are not consistently severe.
, we've always had a Forrester in the garage for the past decade, and they have been nothing but great to my, my wife and my son for all of our adventures. I find myself disappointed, however, at the CVT. I haven't driven one yet, but the last CTV Audi I drove didn't leave me too impressed.
CVTs are good for fuel economy and smooth operation, but, yes, their driving characteristics take some getting used to....and I'm not sold on the long-term durability of the drive-belts, even though a lot of progress has recently been made in their design.
We get a (and I think they're not quite right) employee price on Subarus from the mfg. Many coworkers have checked it out and said that the price is somewhat higher than if they negotiate in person (this seems to be true of all the pre-negotiated no haggle pricing--look for the asterisk and be prepared to get phone calls for more than one year from dealerships--google voice is key). This led me to check out the WRX Limited (not the STi, which was older technology). It really turned me off when a 2x y.o. salesman said, We really don't like to go for test drives unless a buyer is serious (I had a $25 test drive offer). There were not that many cars in stock, and the showroom was packed. This gave confirmation in my mind that there is a cult like following and likely supply is meeting, or not really meeting demand (remember the days when a new Camry came out, there were zero on the lots and one ordered from an allocation). A car co. who still offers a stick, nice, also a car I want to like, but when driving or sitting in them, for whatever reason, don't really like, and I don't actually like the boxer sound when the car gets older....doesn't "wow" me I guess...
i agree the outback is nice looking! and congrats. it's the forrester that i think is unattractive (cheap looking).
Here's the part I don't get, and it's likely plain and simply put, cost. Remember how cheap the original CR-V and Ford Escape looked, when from behind, you could see the stamped steel control arms, really ugly and cheap? It seems to me Subaru is like that today....drive behind an Outback or Forester. I also noticed that with the fake dual exhaust phenomenon (yes Lexus is stone cold busted too), Subaru at some point took that away (maybe they have put it back), again hinting at cost cutting. I ride in my buddy's Legacy, it's like 1 yr. old, and it's very unimpressive imho.....
It really turned me off when a 2x y.o. salesman said, We really don't like to go for test drives unless a buyer is serious (I had a $25 test drive offer).
That's nonsense (not you....the sales guy). Considering all the vehicles I review, test-drive, check out or inspect for others who are shopping or taking delivery, or simply when shopping for myself (as when I looked very seriously at the new Lacrosse, MKZ, G80, Cadenza, and ES350), I probably test-drive a hundred different vehicles for each one I actually buy and take home. When I took my last new car home (a Buick Verano) I had already checked one out at least three or four times.
There were not that many cars in stock, and the showroom was packed. This gave confirmation in my mind that there is a cult like following and likely supply is meeting, or not really meeting demand (remember the days when a new Camry came out, there were zero on the lots and one ordered from an allocation). A car co. who still offers a stick, nice, also a car I want to like, but when driving or sitting in them, for whatever reason, don't really like, and I don't actually like the boxer sound when the car gets older....doesn't "wow" me I guess...
Most of those I know who drive Subies (maybe the WRX and STI-jocks excepted) are not cultists per se, but simply those who want an inexpensive, well-designed, winter-reliable vehicle with a good safety record.
Here's the part I don't get, and it's likely plain and simply put, cost. Remember how cheap the original CR-V and Ford Escape looked, when from behind, you could see the stamped steel control arms, really ugly and cheap? It seems to me Subaru is like that today....drive behind an Outback or Forester. I also noticed that with the fake dual exhaust phenomenon (yes Lexus is stone cold busted too), Subaru at some point took that away (maybe they have put it back), again hinting at cost cutting. I ride in my buddy's Legacy, it's like 1 yr. old, and it's very unimpressive imho.....
The reason you can see the suspension parts from the rear of most Subaru SUVs is because of their 8" ground clearance and high departure angles. While not as off-road capable as some Jeeps, they are designed to be used off-road if owners choose to do so. Neither current model Foresters, nor Outbacks have fake dual exhausts. The boxer 6cyl. has dual exhausts while the boxer 4 does not. Legacys, IMO, are very inexpensive for their content, starting in the low to mid 20's, all with AWD. No, they can't compete with a BMW 540i, but the price points are miles apart. But hey, luckily we have many choices when shopping for a vehicle. Diversity is good.
The reason you can see the suspension parts from the rear of most Subaru SUVs is because of their 8" ground clearance and high departure angles. While not as off-road capable as some Jeeps, they are designed to be used off-road if owners choose to do so. Neither current model Foresters, nor Outbacks have fake dual exhausts. The boxer 6cyl. has dual exhausts while the boxer 4 does not. Legacys, IMO, are very inexpensive for their content, starting in the low to mid 20's, all with AWD. No, they can't compete with a BMW 540i, but the price points are miles apart. But hey, luckily we have many choices when shopping for a vehicle. Diversity is good.
I guess another example would be the current Honda Pilot, the suspension looks so cheap (again like the original CR-V and Ford Escape)....the Range Rover has decent ground clearance as well, but the suspension looks differently, and yes I get it, it's an expensive vehicle. But a base Grand Cherokee or Durango do not have cheap looking control arms...
That's nonsense (not you....the sales guy). Considering all the vehicles I review, test-drive, check out or inspect for others who are shopping or taking delivery, or simply when shopping for myself (as when I looked very seriously at the new Lacrosse, MKZ, G80, Cadenza, and ES350), I probably test-drive a hundred different vehicles for each one I actually buy and take home. When I took my last new car home (a Buick Verano) I had already checked one out at least three or four times.
Most of those I know who drive Subies (maybe the WRX and STI-jocks excepted) are not cultists per se, but simply those who want an inexpensive, well-designed, winter-reliable vehicle with a good safety record.
That very day, we did drive the WRX Limited, and someone did take an STi out for a test drive, so this 2x y.o. salesperson was making up his own rules, and imho probably didn't last. I got my $25 and left thinking man I hope Japan doesn't stop building cars (the WRX and Forester at the time were made in Japan), but this one isn't for me....(quad exhaust I know fake but looks good, and summer only tires standard, I liked it and could even stand the looks somewhat, but not the way it drove)
I've always liked the Forester and the Outback, even back when they had looks that only a mother could love. As with other Subes of the era, the interiors were grainy black plastic and pushed wierd to a totally new level. As practical as they might be, they were a little underpowered (unless you sprung for the turbo), and even spending the big bucks didn't bring much improvement in the interior. It was the vehicular equivalent of a hair shirt, forcing you to suffer for the greater good.
Walking through the parking lot at church last weekend (my preferred venue for checking out real-world new cars - you know the ones with baby seats, cracker crumbs, and all sorts of toys, papers, and family detritus strewn about), I was greatly impressed with a Forester similar to the one Mike tested. It actually looked like something produced in this galaxy, if not this particular planet. It represents a bargain in the price/value scale that has previously eluded it. With whatever basic goodness it possessed, you always had to get your head around that quirky styling (being kind here), to arrive at solid but overpriced vehicle. Props to Subaru for finally understanding the American market beyond the tree-huggers and latte tipplers who were willing to pay more for less - just for the cachet.
i agree the outback is nice looking! and congrats. it's the forrester that i think is unattractive (cheap looking).
Honestly I think it's an attractive kind of cheap and ugly!!! Very utilitarian and at least IMHO slightly more masculine that the competing crossovers.
that's because they were designed by mercedes. (when they owned chrysler)
Even look at the previous Navigator/Expedition, GM's Traverse/Acadia/Enclave, these don't have cheap control arms like the Pilot/MDX, or Outback/Forester, imho......I think it's cost cutting....
This may or may not be the actual parts, but illustrates what I see when driving behind one of the cars mentioned....the list price for OE on the control arm is only $113 (inexpensive)
Again they likely do the job just fine, but don't look to be high quality
05-15-17, 12:43 PM
A lot of people in my area drive them, even though winters here are not consistently severe. 
