riknchar

I know many on this forum have had good things to say about the new Genesis G90, praising it for being an amazing value for the money compared to the LS. Many people, though, are concerned about the long-term quality of the Genesis brand.

I just read the latest survey results from the annual JD Power Initial Quality survey, and Genesis is crushing Lexus in the 2017 model year on initial quality issues.

Here's the link to the article: http://www.nbcnews.com/business/auto...-s-kia-n775161

Initial quality does not necessarily equate to long-term quality, but this is a good sign for Genesis. This sort of story may help Genesis be recognized as a serious competitor to Lexus/Mercedes/BMW/etc. Just food for thought...

I do plan to test drive the G90 once it becomes available in my area...

dfkd

They did mention specifically that both Toyota and Lexus are down because of their goofy infotainment systems.
The last 5-7 years or so, that's been the category that has ruined this survey.
Ford suffered on this survey because of Sync for a while for the same reason.

I think Kia and Hyundai aced that category because they were smart enough to include Apple CarPlay and Android Auto IMMEDIATELY as it was available.

UDel

Acura has taken a big tumble mainly from that touchscreen system even though the rest of the cars are still reliable. Horrible trend for automakers to be replacing buttons with awful touchscreens/mouse controllers.

It is nice Genesis is doing well in initial ownership but I would like to see a couple years of ownership to know if they are pretty painless to own after warranty is up. Genesis still keeps most physical buttons for most features in the interiors instead of in some stupid touchscreen you have to go through menu's which is why I like them, G90 interior looks very nice.

Toys4RJill

Toyota Motor Corp.’s Lexus line has slipped below the industry average in a closely watched study of new-car quality, while Korean automakers that only recently supplanted Japanese and German brands gained more momentum.

Lexus -- long considered a stalwart of quality -- ranked 15th out of 32 brands in J.D. Power’s initial quality study, falling from seventh place last year and first as recently as 2012. South Korea’s Kia Motors Corp. took top honors for the second year in a row and affiliate Hyundai Motor Co.’s Genesis brand finished No. 2 in its inaugural year.

The decline for Lexus has been playing out for several years. Once America’s top-selling luxury brand, owners reported 98 problems per 100 vehicles in the first three months of ownership, plagued in part by issues with complicated electronics systems. As competitors led by the Koreans catch up, Lexus is now near the middle of the pack. The industry average for brands improved to a rate of 97 problems, from 105 a year ago.

“Historically, Lexus has been the leading brand in the study,” said Dave Sargent, vice president of global automotive at J.D. Power. “Like everybody else, they’ve had challenges with new technology and they haven’t shown improvement while many others have.”

Korean brands, meanwhile, have been steadily improving. After struggling with a reputation for poor quality in the 1990s, Hyundai Chairman Chung Mong-Koo started studying Toyota and other high-caliber carmakers and put a similar ethos to work with his companies’ vehicles.

Kia secured the top spot for the second year in a row this year with a rate of 72 problems, down from 83 last year. Hyundai’s Genesis placed second with 77 problems, one fewer than third-ranked Porsche. A lower score in the study signifies a higher quality ranking.

“Many people wondered if we could maintain such a lofty position,” Michael Sprague, chief operating officer of Kia’s U.S. sales unit, said in a statement. The back-to-back showings as the industry’s top brand “reflect the exacting standards and craftsmanship our team members instill into every car, crossover and SUV Kia builds.”

Lexus wasn’t the only luxury brand to show a weaker ranking this year. Mass-market brands performed better than premium counterparts for only the third time since 1987, according to J.D. Power.

Luxury brands have one excuse for the falling rankings: They tend to pack their cars with more of the latest electronic gadgets, opening themselves up to additional opportunities for things to go wrong.

More problems pertaining to features, controls and displays were reported than last year, the only category of eight to diminish in latest annual study. Problematic features such as adaptive cruise controls and lane departure warnings are some of the tools that will be key to developing autonomous vehicles.

Luxury cars used to be so much better than mass-market cars when it came to reliable engines, better interior materials and basic quality that those factors offset problems with new electronics features, Sargent said. But these days, bread-and-butter brands like General Motors Co.’s Chevrolet division and Ford Motor Co. are doing so much better that their overall scores have surpassed many expensive brands.

For a look back at the J.D. Power survey for 2016, click here.

The traditional Detroit Three automakers performed better than import brands for the second year in a row and only the third time in the study’s 31-year history. Domestic brands averaged a rate of 93 problems, while import brands had 99.

Ford jumped from 11th place to fourth this year and had 16 fewer problems per 100 vehicles than in 2016. Chevy slipped one spot to seventh, but owners reported a rate of seven fewer problems than last year.

Ranking last was Fiat, with a rate of 163 problems. Fiat Chrysler Automobile NV’s Dodge and Chrysler brands, which share parts with Fiat vehicles, also rank below average. Among the company’s brands, only Ram trucks finished above average.

sears1234

I've found this since2010,that's why I left Lexus family.

BrownPride

J.D. Power isn't even reputable. I guarantee Lexus is the most reliable luxury car in the world. "X problems per 100 vehicles" tests nothing more than initial quality. Also, what defines a "problem?" Do minor software bugs count the same as transmission problems?

SW17LS

Wow...unfortunately I have to say, I also see it.

Where are my Kia and Genesis haters now? "Reputable" or not, Genesis will rightly use this as more ammunition to market directly to Lexus customers.

IQS is a "satisfaction" survey, not a "dependability" survey. Its a measure of how happy overall a customer is with their new car. Like it or not, this decline is representative of the fact that Lexus owners are not as pleased with their new cars as they were some years ago.

sears1234

IMO, Lexus reliability is still bullet proof, my only complaint is its internal rattle noise that probably caused by cheap material.
The noise drove me crazy, and even worse is dealer couldn't do much about it.

SW17LS

And this type of thing is what you see in the IQS, and this is the type of issue I've seen with Lexus cars as the years have progressed.

My Kia Minivan has zero rattles, snaps or quivers and I have several in the LS I'm chasing down.

mmarshall

Consumer Reports, which IS reputable, also rates Kia, as a brand, very highly in the reliability department. This is one of those times when J.D. Power has indeed hit the nail, if not exactly on the head, then very close to it.

Go to the nearest Kia dealership and look at their products for yourselves..I think you will see for yourself.

That's not to say, of course, that Kia are for everyone.....I happen to like Buicks myself (which also generally rate highly in the reliability department), for several reasons. But my brother, after excellent experiences with Kia products (Soul and Sportage) has become a believer......with my blessing.

SW17LS

While I'm not going to keep it long term, our Kia has been one of the most solid vehicles we've ever owned.

davyjordi

wow, i haven't experienced any decline in satisfaction over the course of my lexus ownership, but as a lexus enthusiast it's disconcerting to know that others have and that the marque is slipping.

kudos to kia and hyundai.

mmarshall

And that's even after a fire in the front end...which was not the vehicle's fault.

SW17LS

Yeah, that wound up being just cosmetic though. No worse than a light hit in the front.

I would buy another Hyundai/Kia/Genesis product without hesitation.

I would also continue to buy Lexus and Toyota products, as long as they make products I want to buy.

mmarshall

To be fair, though, Lexus, as it has done so for decades, still makes a silky-smooth, refined, reliable, and long-lasting drive train....along with excellent fit/finish and a mirror-like paint job. What has suffered, particularly in the last 10-11 years, has been a noticeable decline in the solidness of exterior and interior materials....sheet metal, interior hardware, trim, sound insulation in some cases, plastic parts, etc......