Toyota Planning Solid-State Battery
07-26-17, 10:21 AM
#1
Toyota Planning Solid-State Battery
Solid-State Battery
Source
TOKYO - Toyota is working on an electric car powered by a new type of battery that significantly increases driving range and reduces charging time, aiming to begin sales in 2022, the Chunichi Shimbun daily reported on Tuesday.
Toyota's new electric car, to be built on an all-new platform, will use all-solid-state batteries, allowing it to be recharged in just a few minutes, the newspaper said, without citing sources.
By contrast, current electric vehicles (EVs), which use lithium-ion batteries, need 20-30 minutes to recharge even with fast chargers and typically have a range of just 300-400 kilometers (185-250 miles).
Toyota has decided to sell the new model in Japan as early as 2022, the paper said.
Toyota spokeswoman Kayo Doi said the company would not comment on specific product plans but added that it aimed to commercialize all-solid-state batteries by the early 2020s.
Japan's biggest automaker is looking to close the gap with EV leaders such as Nissan and Tesla as battery-powered cars gain traction around the globe as a viable emission-free alternative to conventional cars.
Whether Toyota will be able to leapfrog its rivals remains to be seen, however, as mass production requires a far more stringent level of quality control and reliability.
"There's a pretty long distance between the lab bench and manufacturing," said CLSA auto analyst Christopher Richter. "2022 is ages away, and a lot can change in the meantime." How quickly the new EVs will catch on would also depend largely on battery costs.
Having long touted hydrogen fuel-cell vehicles and plug-in hybrids as the most sensible technology to make cars greener, Toyota last year said it wanted to add long-range EVs to its lineup, and set up a new in-house unit, headed by President Akio Toyoda, to develop and market EVs.
Toyota is reportedly planning to begin mass-producing EVs in China, the world's biggest auto market, as early as in 2019, although that model would be based on the existing C-HR sport utility vehicle and use lithium-ion batteries.
Other automakers such as BMW are also working on developing all-solid-state batteries, eyeing mass production in the next 10 years.
Solid-state batteries use solid electrolytes rather than liquid ones, making them safer than lithium-ion batteries currently on the market.
Toyota's new electric car, to be built on an all-new platform, will use all-solid-state batteries, allowing it to be recharged in just a few minutes, the newspaper said, without citing sources.
By contrast, current electric vehicles (EVs), which use lithium-ion batteries, need 20-30 minutes to recharge even with fast chargers and typically have a range of just 300-400 kilometers (185-250 miles).
Toyota has decided to sell the new model in Japan as early as 2022, the paper said.
Toyota spokeswoman Kayo Doi said the company would not comment on specific product plans but added that it aimed to commercialize all-solid-state batteries by the early 2020s.
Japan's biggest automaker is looking to close the gap with EV leaders such as Nissan and Tesla as battery-powered cars gain traction around the globe as a viable emission-free alternative to conventional cars.
Whether Toyota will be able to leapfrog its rivals remains to be seen, however, as mass production requires a far more stringent level of quality control and reliability.
"There's a pretty long distance between the lab bench and manufacturing," said CLSA auto analyst Christopher Richter. "2022 is ages away, and a lot can change in the meantime." How quickly the new EVs will catch on would also depend largely on battery costs.
Having long touted hydrogen fuel-cell vehicles and plug-in hybrids as the most sensible technology to make cars greener, Toyota last year said it wanted to add long-range EVs to its lineup, and set up a new in-house unit, headed by President Akio Toyoda, to develop and market EVs.
Toyota is reportedly planning to begin mass-producing EVs in China, the world's biggest auto market, as early as in 2019, although that model would be based on the existing C-HR sport utility vehicle and use lithium-ion batteries.
Other automakers such as BMW are also working on developing all-solid-state batteries, eyeing mass production in the next 10 years.
Solid-state batteries use solid electrolytes rather than liquid ones, making them safer than lithium-ion batteries currently on the market.
07-26-17, 10:27 AM
#2
Pole Position
that would be great. also unexpected because toyota has been putting a lot of r&d funds into hydrogen cell technology so it's refreshing to hear that they are also working on advanced battery packs and that means they wouldn't be left out with just, say, the prius as its quasi-electric (read: hybrid) car. of course they have others at present, but when one thinks of toyota and hybrids one tends to gravitate toward the prius.
07-26-17, 04:45 PM
#3
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
hope they pull it off!!!
07-26-17, 05:19 PM
#4
That's why I worry about those people who have bought a lot of Tesla stock, and aren't checking on a daily basis and ready to sell off their stock instantly before the big collapse in share price, brought about by people like Toyota Motor Corp and their solid state battery technology.
It's not just TMC, there are so many other big corporations developing this technology, or something equivalent.
It's not just TMC, there are so many other big corporations developing this technology, or something equivalent.
07-26-17, 08:06 PM
#7
Lexus Champion
Great news!
Toyota surprises us again... but I think we should stop being surprised by Toyota's announcements. Toyota does not play by the same rulebook that other automakers do; Toyota is a very conservative company, playing its cards very, very close to the chest. It only makes technology announcements when the progress to marketization is well underway.
If Toyota says that it will have EVs on the market in 2022, I would not doubt that. That is only one automotive generation away but I suspect that design work on a new EV has been going on (in secret) for some time now. I have no idea if a "new platform" is an adapted TNGA/GA-L platform or a bespoke platform dedicated to EVs. I suspect it will be an EV-specific platform, perhaps underpinning a new car that does not look like the current 3-box style of large and separate compartments for engine, passengers and cargo.
I suppose that we should have read more into the announcements from late 2016 when Toyota announced that it had not only tamed the lithium-ion battery, but had set up a new company (with Akio Toyoda at the helm) to develop electric vehicles. Not only had Toyota tamed the Li-Ion battery, but was well on its way to the holy grail of EV batteries, a quick-charging, long-cycle, solid-state battery.
Despite what it had said earlier about the inviability of Li-Ion batteries and the battery electric vehicle, and the decision to develop hydrogen fuel cell vehicles instead, those can be seen now as what they truly were: hedges, in case Toyota could not develop its own battery that would be small enough, light enough, safe enough, that could charge and discharge quickly enough, yet be reliable over the long-term.
If I trade in for a new TNGA hybrid (can I hope for a plug-in hybrid?) in 2018, perhaps I could trade that in for a Toyota EV four years after that?
Toyota surprises us again... but I think we should stop being surprised by Toyota's announcements. Toyota does not play by the same rulebook that other automakers do; Toyota is a very conservative company, playing its cards very, very close to the chest. It only makes technology announcements when the progress to marketization is well underway.
If Toyota says that it will have EVs on the market in 2022, I would not doubt that. That is only one automotive generation away but I suspect that design work on a new EV has been going on (in secret) for some time now. I have no idea if a "new platform" is an adapted TNGA/GA-L platform or a bespoke platform dedicated to EVs. I suspect it will be an EV-specific platform, perhaps underpinning a new car that does not look like the current 3-box style of large and separate compartments for engine, passengers and cargo.
I suppose that we should have read more into the announcements from late 2016 when Toyota announced that it had not only tamed the lithium-ion battery, but had set up a new company (with Akio Toyoda at the helm) to develop electric vehicles. Not only had Toyota tamed the Li-Ion battery, but was well on its way to the holy grail of EV batteries, a quick-charging, long-cycle, solid-state battery.
Despite what it had said earlier about the inviability of Li-Ion batteries and the battery electric vehicle, and the decision to develop hydrogen fuel cell vehicles instead, those can be seen now as what they truly were: hedges, in case Toyota could not develop its own battery that would be small enough, light enough, safe enough, that could charge and discharge quickly enough, yet be reliable over the long-term.
If I trade in for a new TNGA hybrid (can I hope for a plug-in hybrid?) in 2018, perhaps I could trade that in for a Toyota EV four years after that?
Trending Topics
07-26-17, 08:09 PM
#8
Lexus Champion
That's why I worry about those people who have bought a lot of Tesla stock, and aren't checking on a daily basis and ready to sell off their stock instantly before the big collapse in share price, brought about by people like Toyota Motor Corp and their solid state battery technology.
It's not just TMC, there are so many other big corporations developing this technology, or something equivalent.
It's not just TMC, there are so many other big corporations developing this technology, or something equivalent.
07-26-17, 10:58 PM
#9
This is all very interesting. I don't know much about battery technology but I've often wondered about the raw materials required to produce a fleet of electric vehicles such as the Tesla or Nissan Leaf? A simple Google search revealed some interesting results. Lithium is said to be an abundant resource depending on who you ask. Folks at Tesla are more concerned about Cabolt which is used in the cathode of Tesla’s battery cells.
Toyota's new solid state batteries are said to utilize sodium which can be extracted from sea water.
Interesting stuff
https://electrek.co/2016/11/01/break...le-bottleneck/
Toyota's new solid state batteries are said to utilize sodium which can be extracted from sea water.
Interesting stuff
https://electrek.co/2016/11/01/break...le-bottleneck/
07-28-17, 03:40 AM
#11
Lexus Test Driver
I'm surprised Toyota did this all on its own. I'd be even more surprised if this tech was already out of the lab and ready to be ramped up to commercial scale. The current nickel hydride and lithium ion battery packs used in Toyota hybrids were co-developed with Panasonic. Tesla's Gigafactory and SolarCity partner is also Panasonic. What gives?
07-28-17, 10:22 AM
#12
It is a long LONG way from announcements like this one and the commercial success of a new technology. The press release was likely intended to show the world that Toyota is a player even in the EV world.
I can remember as a kid reading about the new Chrysler turbine car. All sorts of advantages, and the commercialization was just "five years away." So five years comes and goes, and the Turbine Car is "about five years away." Repeat ad infinitum.
Since the Global Warming hysteria is fading away it seems to me that the electric vehicle will become a significant portion of the pool only when it offers a dramatically-better experience than a hybrid. But what? Quiet operation? Dramatic acceleration? No gasoline smell? Lower cost? Yawn.
And I don't want to have to plug in the thing at night. Some sort of automatic charging connection surely will be developed.
I can remember as a kid reading about the new Chrysler turbine car. All sorts of advantages, and the commercialization was just "five years away." So five years comes and goes, and the Turbine Car is "about five years away." Repeat ad infinitum.
Since the Global Warming hysteria is fading away it seems to me that the electric vehicle will become a significant portion of the pool only when it offers a dramatically-better experience than a hybrid. But what? Quiet operation? Dramatic acceleration? No gasoline smell? Lower cost? Yawn.
And I don't want to have to plug in the thing at night. Some sort of automatic charging connection surely will be developed.
07-28-17, 12:50 PM
#13
Lexus Champion
I'm surprised Toyota did this all on its own. I'd be even more surprised if this tech was already out of the lab and ready to be ramped up to commercial scale. The current nickel hydride and lithium ion battery packs used in Toyota hybrids were co-developed with Panasonic. Tesla's Gigafactory and SolarCity partner is also Panasonic. What gives?
Panasonic is a huge battery company and it can develop and sell its batteries to other companies, including Tesla.
07-28-17, 11:19 PM
#14
Bold move by Toyota, if true. It does suggest that Toyota is double dipping into both Fuel Cell and EV in order to hedge their bets. In my opinion, it would be best if they launch this technology in both a Prius model AND a Lexus model.
07-31-17, 04:21 PM
#15
Lexus Champion
Great news!
Toyota surprises us again... but I think we should stop being surprised by Toyota's announcements. Toyota does not play by the same rulebook that other automakers do; Toyota is a very conservative company, playing its cards very, very close to the chest. It only makes technology announcements when the progress to marketization is well underway.
If Toyota says that it will have EVs on the market in 2022, I would not doubt that. That is only one automotive generation away but I suspect that design work on a new EV has been going on (in secret) for some time now. I have no idea if a "new platform" is an adapted TNGA/GA-L platform or a bespoke platform dedicated to EVs. I suspect it will be an EV-specific platform, perhaps underpinning a new car that does not look like the current 3-box style of large and separate compartments for engine, passengers and cargo.
I suppose that we should have read more into the announcements from late 2016 when Toyota announced that it had not only tamed the lithium-ion battery, but had set up a new company (with Akio Toyoda at the helm) to develop electric vehicles. Not only had Toyota tamed the Li-Ion battery, but was well on its way to the holy grail of EV batteries, a quick-charging, long-cycle, solid-state battery.
Despite what it had said earlier about the inviability of Li-Ion batteries and the battery electric vehicle, and the decision to develop hydrogen fuel cell vehicles instead, those can be seen now as what they truly were: hedges, in case Toyota could not develop its own battery that would be small enough, light enough, safe enough, that could charge and discharge quickly enough, yet be reliable over the long-term.
If I trade in for a new TNGA hybrid (can I hope for a plug-in hybrid?) in 2018, perhaps I could trade that in for a Toyota EV four years after that?
Toyota surprises us again... but I think we should stop being surprised by Toyota's announcements. Toyota does not play by the same rulebook that other automakers do; Toyota is a very conservative company, playing its cards very, very close to the chest. It only makes technology announcements when the progress to marketization is well underway.
If Toyota says that it will have EVs on the market in 2022, I would not doubt that. That is only one automotive generation away but I suspect that design work on a new EV has been going on (in secret) for some time now. I have no idea if a "new platform" is an adapted TNGA/GA-L platform or a bespoke platform dedicated to EVs. I suspect it will be an EV-specific platform, perhaps underpinning a new car that does not look like the current 3-box style of large and separate compartments for engine, passengers and cargo.
I suppose that we should have read more into the announcements from late 2016 when Toyota announced that it had not only tamed the lithium-ion battery, but had set up a new company (with Akio Toyoda at the helm) to develop electric vehicles. Not only had Toyota tamed the Li-Ion battery, but was well on its way to the holy grail of EV batteries, a quick-charging, long-cycle, solid-state battery.
Despite what it had said earlier about the inviability of Li-Ion batteries and the battery electric vehicle, and the decision to develop hydrogen fuel cell vehicles instead, those can be seen now as what they truly were: hedges, in case Toyota could not develop its own battery that would be small enough, light enough, safe enough, that could charge and discharge quickly enough, yet be reliable over the long-term.
If I trade in for a new TNGA hybrid (can I hope for a plug-in hybrid?) in 2018, perhaps I could trade that in for a Toyota EV four years after that?