Johnhav430

You know, the other day a collague was really late to work. He said he experienced a flat, and began changing it. A state trooper rolls up and says to quote, "Just what is it you think you're doing?"

Apparently, there's a law against changing a tire on the highway. We both got it, for safety. The weird thing is the colleague was made to feel guilty? He was told you could get me killed and was given some fatality statistic?

I'm not that old, but many things to still surprise me every day. Knowing how to change a tire and change oil were requirements before I could get a learner's permit when I was 16. There was even a Sopranos episode where the son said call the auto club, and Tony says in our house, we change our own tires.

I could have sworn that in my grandparents' time, cars were replaced maybe every 3 yrs because they didn't last (early adopter of Toyota and he had a '71 and '73 Corolla). Today they're replaced every 3 yrs. by choice.....

Another thing that surprised me, a 2 disc CD box set went on sale, and sold out in < 24 hours. What? Then, they wind up on eBay for $70+ This was for volume 23. I saw volume 1 on eBay for $4,999. Apparently the set was limited to 16,500 copies? Can't we just listen to the **** music for I dunno, maybe $18 for 2 discs or something? lol

Yeah, I do think Japanese cars as a general rule are more reliable, but Germans aren't necessarily unable to get you to work and back for years or anything. Unless it's a 2006 Passat 6 cyl awd...

Sybaritic

The Germans push the envelope on technology and innovation, and I think that's why their products cost more and have more problems. The Japanese do innovate, but not to the degree of the Germans, and they tend to like to make better what already exists.

The Germans know how to build high-performance, solid-bodied vehicles, so I think they allocate resources to those aspects plus new technologies, and focus less on obsessive quality control since you only have so many resources. Also, with greater brand prestige and a loyal base that are high earners, I feel the German Big Three know that people will desire the brand and thus tolerate higher maintenance costs in return for the performance cred and the social approval of their badges.

I worked for Mercedes-Benz and know why German cars are beloved, but I still prefer the Japanese brands (Lexus>Acura>Infiniti for me) for reliability, for the familiarity of the products/systems, better value for the money, enough prestige (Lexus really is the only prestigious Japanese luxe brand vs. Acura and Infiniti who can compete with the Germans on price) and less intimidating diagnosis bills.

Johnhav430

Two things on this, a PDR guy told me it's so easy to work on BMWs and MB, the results are flawless. The metal is so good and has a great memory.

Go figure, my small 335i coupe with composite fenders weighs just over 3,500 lbs. My large LS430 weighs 3,990. I would argue the 335i is really solid. The LS is built very well, but maybe not as solid. There's a certain type of thud one hears when shutting the door on a German car.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

in our image-conscious and 'gotta have it now' society, leasing sexy vehicles is popular, hence bmw, mercedes, audi success.

sears1234

Who told you German car have poor reliability?
My experience is VW and Mercedes having same reliability as Toyota and Lexus, and they both have better quality than Toyota and Lexus.

RNM GS3

OP - I recommend you visit BMW/MB forums.
There are a ton of owners there with cars over 100k miles.

I personally think the German lack of reliability has been greatly overblown.
I think the early 2000s were some bad cases with new Idrive on BMWs and MBs with air suspensions; but all those issues have been long resolved.
Just due regular maintenance and the cars will last long time.

LeX2K

The same publication will put the Accord on the list no matter how much of a lump of crap it is.

To answer the question, it is all about resources and priorities. As a general rule German auto makers prioritize styling and technology over long term reliability and viability of design. Put another way they cheat.

riredale

I've never had a German car, but I drove my parent's big Mercedes diesel sedan many times several decades ago. In the past year I drove my sister's brand-new bright-red baby BMW sports car for several days. In both instances I thought to myself, "Yuck." The diesel car had a bizarre throttle response and the Beemer's steering was millimeters-twitchy. I guess I could have gotten used to both characteristics, but why would I need to?

Next-door neighbor has an absolutely gorgeous Mercedes sports car about ten years old. Mirror-like silver with a hint of green and curves to melt your heart. Yesterday over the fence I commented on the car, and he said, "You want it? I'd sell it to you for next to nothing, but then I'd have you as an enemy." He repeated the adage that cars like that you lease and then return, because they cost a small fortune to keep running as they age.

I am beginning to conclude that the Germans build their cars to appeal to those buyers who want a new car and only for a couple of years. Nothing "wrong" with that philosophy per se, it's just not how I look at things. I tend towards things engineered for reliability.

mmarshall

Actually, it's more than that. In the 1990s and early 2000s, Mercedes and BMW cut back on the quality of materials, in their vehicles, as part of a cost-cutting measure to try and deal with the fact that Lexus (and, to a lesser extent, Infiniti) were giving them fierce competition, at lower prices, than they had previously faced. The quality of their vehicles, at the time, clearly suffered....and has only recently recovered somewhat

Johnhav430

I know, they should have called it the 8 best list, with the 3 series and Accord being permanent members...although I think the 3 really deserved it until the 2012 came out, it really deserved to be removed from then on....I don't know how the Accord has stayed on this long, I know my coworker's '08 had issues...in '10....

Johnhav430

If the BMW was a '12 3 series or newer, the steering is abysmal.....such a shame...

jwong77

While a lot of what is being said here is interesting, I just hate blanket statements like all German Cars are Beautiful... we know thats not true, go look at a BMW i3, and all German Cars are unreliable, I believe Porsche is known to have really good reliability and are German. As is usually the case with all things in life, its a lot more complicated than that.

pman6

I'm one of these people.
I hear about german unreliability, but don't really know the details.
Now, I'm open to buying german, but it's always the ripoff pricing that holds me back.

I've always thought, as long as the engine runs without mechanical failure, then the car is pretty reliable. I bet there is rarely a case of total mechanical failure in german cars. Manufacturers test their cars hard these days. Millions of miles on the 'ring and death valley.
A random dashboard light doesn't mean total electronics failure. It's just an annoyance.

My 2 lexus .... Had to replace the steering shaft for $1000. Waterpump for $1000. both well before hitting 100k. It's now 14+ years old.
My GS blew its waterpump at 45k. This time I went to a private mechanic for $400.

Are my cars reliable? I dunno

Sulu

At the risk of playing to stereotypes... The Germans are known for their engineering: cars, rockets, etc. The Japanese are known for their persistence and attention to detail; look at the finely-detailed cultivation of Bonsai trees and the requirement to be able to fold an origami cat single-handed before being allowed to stitch the ES instrument panel.

Modern electronics (that fills modern cars) is increasingly and incredibly detailed, and so requires great attention to the tiniest details to get right and debug problems. The Japanese have great attention to detail.

Coleroad

Agreed, the blanket statement about brands being unreliable, or reliable is unfair for the most part. The conversation should really be what drivetrain, and models. Like ford a lot of the problems reported come from the my key. People mess around with it and " my key" both sets. Then they don't have a master key to change settings. This requires you buy and program a new very expensive key. New land rovers problems with their gps. One needs to weigh out things more individually. My goodness cars decade after decade have become so much more reliable overall.