mmarshall

Well, no, it's not false. 100K is still a lot more than the bank than the average American has today...especially those struggling to pay off mortgages, credit-card debt, or college tuition for their kids.


You're correct that my own personal situation is better-than-average, with a Federal pension for the rest of my life and tax-free income added to it. But I'm not looking at it just from my own perspective. My whole generation, who basically started to work back in the 60s and early 70s, were fortunate enough to have entered the work force when good jobs and careers were far more plentiful than they are today. Yes, some of us Boomers made mistakes, and are still paying the price for it today. But, overall, we have it pretty good compared to a lot of the young people just starting out today, especially those without degrees.

mmarshall

Back on topic, and the question of what will or will not be dropped, I'd take almost anything GM management says with a grain of salt. I personally like most of their products, but GM has a long-standing reputation of doing two things.....First, suddenly dropping vehicles that they finally got right through several years of improving them, and, Second, making false or misleading statements about their vehicles/ordering/availability, and then changing their minds the next morning (I recently ran into that on the new Lacrosse myself). Personally, I like Mary Barra, and think she's a breath of fresh air compared to some of the GM CEO's we've seen for too many years, but even she only has so much authority and influence in a corporation that huge, and one human being alone, even in that seat, can't necessarily work miracles.

geko29

Way to completely ignore the rest of my post, where I provided a detailed explanation of just how little money that really is for a retiree. Additionally, this is not money "in the bank". It is in tax-advantaged but withdrawal-restricted retirement accounts. Those are two VERY VERY different things. The average retiree with $100k or less in retirement savings (and remember, about a third have little or nothing at all) likely only sees a 4-figure bank account balance on the day their SS check hits.

Please explain how $31k in annual household income is "having it pretty good". This is the average retirement income for your generation.

There's a reason that one in 5 Americans over 65 are still working, and one in twelve over 75. The same reason that nearly two thirds (62%, to be exact) of the currently 45-60 group (exactly half of which is comprised of baby boomers) expect to have to delay their retirement. Anyone who would self describe as "well-heeled" would not be contemplating working well past retirement age so they can continue eating.

Bringing it back full circle--the reason that sales are poor for cars like the DTS/XTS is because there are fewer and fewer people who are both interested in them AND can afford them. Certainly many, such as yourself, can. But the overwhelming majority cannot. Hence the targeting of buyers who can afford such cars in large numbers with models that appeal to them--to varying degrees, hence this thread.

mmarshall

I wasn't ignoring your post. And, when I said "In the Bank"....that was a figure of speech for not only bank accounts, but all types of nest-eggs, including the ones you mentioned.

Also, keep in mind...I did not get the nice nest-egg I did by making a lot of large purchases. Though, yes, while I did get a new car regularly throughout my lifetime (always been a car enthusiast LOL)....I also made a number of personal sacrifices, didn't spend a lot of money on things like vacations, entertainment, clothes, sports, new electronics, etc.....and used the money I WOULD have spent to invest in tax-free securities. It paid off.


Actually a number of them have also converted to foreign luxury-brands.....Mercedes, Lexus, BMW, Audi, etc....


Again, though, back to topic......Cadillac. Cadillac shot themselves in the foot by forgetting their base, and by pursuing a group of individuals that were basically Bimmer-Philes, and had little if any interest in Cadillac. The result was quite predictable....it didn't take Mensa-levels of intelligence to see that. And, of course, even over and above that, the SUV craze continues to decimate the sedan market, period.

gengar

I agree with this, but it's also shocking to me that Cadillac does not even have the brand cachet to market competitors in these classes.

Meanwhile, look at the Germans. MB is offering almost 20 models (not all sold in the US).

mmarshall

Cadillac sedans DO have a fair amount of German engineering in them...particularly from Opel.

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

I agree in the sense that I like cars to 'line up' and be clearly defined so to speak ex. 3, 5, 7, IS, GS, LS, C, E, S etc..
But I understand the move to consolidate the sedan portfolio, especially with market trends. The current ATS, CTS and XTS are all good vehicles in their own right. But they don't sell no matter what Cadillac does. By consolidating the ATS and CTS they are effectively returning the CT5 to that 'tweener' status. Infiniti has does this with their G37/Q50 M37/Q70 for many years. Cadillac isn't abandoning sedans, they're just switching gears which is focusing on Crossovers and Electrification. The Cadillac XT4 is in the works to slot below the XT5. Similar premium marques like Volvo and Maserati both just committed all 2019 models moving forward to be electrified or hybrid. The automotive landscape is certainly changing.

Sulu

Wasn't that the reason for introducing the small ATS in the first place, because a single larger (i.e. mid-size) CTS could not draw in the buyers shopping for the smaller 3-series or C-Class?

Now, Cadillac is going back to one CTS-like car to cover small and mid-size buyers?

Aron9000

If they price a "tweener" car right, it will sell. The previous gen CTS is a great example, it was significantly bigger than a 3 series, about the same size as the then current E60 5 series, and cost about as much as a mid-lower spec 3 series. They sold a good number of that 2nd gen CTS, personally I thought it was a great looking car as well, I loved all the angles. Then the car that replaced it went up about 10-15k in price, stayed the same size, has a boring exterior look, and has a way fussier/harder to use/half baked center screen(the CUE system). Main thing is they priced it wrong(and also made the base engine a course/rough 4 cylinder instead of the previous standard smooth as silk v6). They decided to charge you more $$$$ for less car, you can see how well the 3rd gen CTS has sold.

gengar

If they had priced the ATS right, I think it would have sold well too. When de Nysschen first announced his intention to price Cadillac as if it were one of its established luxury competitors, I remember many of us on here predicted that it would be a disaster.

IMO dropping the ATS/CTS/XTS and replacing with the CT5 will only further erode Cadillac's brand, which is already one of the weakest among luxury marques (just take loyalty as an example - Cadillac's customer retention is awful compared to luxury competitors). I wouldn't trust de Nysschen at all - it'll be really interesting to see what happens in the next couple years.

I see you're working hard to keep your master of the non sequitur title.

mmarshall

I would beg to differ, at least on the non-sequitur part.


On that, you and I can probably agree. I wouldn't trust anybody in GM management except maybe (Marry) Barra herself. A shame, too, since GM does (mostly) very nice products.

gengar

Give it a rest. I wasn't talking at all about engineering in my post.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

just heard that gm sales in u.s. are now 80% trucks/suvs and 20% sedans. no wonder they're looking to axe some sedans.

mmarshall

Given GM's size, though, 20% of sales, sedans or not, is still a LOT of vehicles. Drop the sedans, and what will happen?......those 20% of potential potential buyers (most of whom probably favor American nameplates) will simply go down the street to the Ford/Lincoln shop.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

no one said gm will drop ALL sedans but if they have huge inventory and end up selling the excess at a loss, then clearly they have too many models or too much production or both.