Lexus LS500/LS500h
12-24-17, 02:37 PM
#691
Lexus Test Driver
In some respects, the LS 500 could be considered as a Japanese Panamera, particularly with it's sleek all new radically designed exterior. However, the missing ingredient is a optional/standard V8 engine which is why Lexus should have offered both the TT V6 & V8 (from the LC500) as the V8 would have allowed Lexus to move the LS slightly upmarket along with possibly adding some different features, trim levels or options unique to the V8 model.
Except it’s not. That’s what I don’t get. They copied the look (or tried to) without any of the attributes that actually makes the panamera so unique and great.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
12-24-17, 02:46 PM
#692
Lexus Fanatic
Except it’s not. That’s what I don’t get. They copied the look (or tried to) without any of the attributes that actually makes the panamera so unique and great.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
I think they have a taken a good chance with this new LS. It's not the same as the last one or the ones before it. They has gone away from their formula of playing it safe. I will wait till I see in person, I have a feeling I am going to like it when I see it blending in with the stuff out there
12-24-17, 03:02 PM
#693
Except it’s not. That’s what I don’t get. They copied the look (or tried to) without any of the attributes that actually makes the panamera so unique and great.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
You can feel that conservative company, keeping that foot in the shallow end. They should have just dove off the deep end and went all in.
And from a styling perspective, I'm glad it's not as the LS 500 is futuristic & elegant while the Panamera looks like an elongated, bulbous frog.
12-24-17, 03:04 PM
#694
I think they have a taken a good chance with this new LS. It's not the same as the last one or the ones before it. They has gone away from their formula of playing it safe. I will wait till I see in person, I have a feeling I am going to like it when I see it blending in with the stuff out there
12-24-17, 04:24 PM
#695
Lexus Test Driver
Lets not even put these 2 in the same league. Lexus can only dream of making a car as dynamic as the Panamera.
Lexus had a loyal base with LS, it took them 3+ yrs longer than normal to bring out the new model and now that its here it doesn't live up to what the LS is about. Offering V6 only is a big negative, add the new sporty ride, less room, higher price and weird styling = formula for potential failure.
LS was a strong point in Lexus lineup - it just needed more of what it already had. It was doing well in sales until they did another refresh and not a brand new model. Plus now you have solid alternatives from G90, S90, Model S, A8, CT6, Continental etc.
Lexus had a loyal base with LS, it took them 3+ yrs longer than normal to bring out the new model and now that its here it doesn't live up to what the LS is about. Offering V6 only is a big negative, add the new sporty ride, less room, higher price and weird styling = formula for potential failure.
LS was a strong point in Lexus lineup - it just needed more of what it already had. It was doing well in sales until they did another refresh and not a brand new model. Plus now you have solid alternatives from G90, S90, Model S, A8, CT6, Continental etc.
Last edited by RNM GS3; 12-24-17 at 04:27 PM.
12-24-17, 05:34 PM
#696
Lead Lap
"LS 500 could be considered as a Japanese Panamera"
I know Lexus is on the up and up with the whole performance game, but I dont think its going to happen over night and in this segment and of course not with the 5 LS.
The LS moniker was designed to go after the status quo monikers S-class, A8, and the 7 series. Since the 1st gen, I think Lexus has made huge inroads into attracting clientele from the flag bearers, however no one really thinks of the LS as the flagship that comes to mind when going for a full size sedan, since its more of a logical choice. Its value proposition has been paramount to its success. Same thing is evident here as well. The LS is probably cutting edge and on or above the level of tech that the magical 3 have in their current gens. However without attractive leasing schemes, or trunk money the LS isnt going to move after the first wave of buyers have driven off the lot. Its a tough time to launch a sedan in a primarily SUV/Crossover hungry market.
I know Lexus is on the up and up with the whole performance game, but I dont think its going to happen over night and in this segment and of course not with the 5 LS.
The LS moniker was designed to go after the status quo monikers S-class, A8, and the 7 series. Since the 1st gen, I think Lexus has made huge inroads into attracting clientele from the flag bearers, however no one really thinks of the LS as the flagship that comes to mind when going for a full size sedan, since its more of a logical choice. Its value proposition has been paramount to its success. Same thing is evident here as well. The LS is probably cutting edge and on or above the level of tech that the magical 3 have in their current gens. However without attractive leasing schemes, or trunk money the LS isnt going to move after the first wave of buyers have driven off the lot. Its a tough time to launch a sedan in a primarily SUV/Crossover hungry market.
12-24-17, 07:48 PM
#698
Lexus Test Driver
Umm i dont need to drive it - plenty of tests out there.If u just look at raw perf data 0-60, 1/4 mile, top speed, braking, slalom etc.Panamera is a monster plus it offers a bunch of versions for all types of potential buyers.
12-24-17, 08:23 PM
#699
Lets not even put these 2 in the same league. Lexus can only dream of making a car as dynamic as the Panamera.
Lexus had a loyal base with LS, it took them 3+ yrs longer than normal to bring out the new model and now that its here it doesn't live up to what the LS is about. Offering V6 only is a big negative, add the new sporty ride, less room, higher price and weird styling = formula for potential failure.
LS was a strong point in Lexus lineup - it just needed more of what it already had. It was doing well in sales until they did another refresh and not a brand new model. Plus now you have solid alternatives from G90, S90, Model S, A8, CT6, Continental etc.
Lexus had a loyal base with LS, it took them 3+ yrs longer than normal to bring out the new model and now that its here it doesn't live up to what the LS is about. Offering V6 only is a big negative, add the new sporty ride, less room, higher price and weird styling = formula for potential failure.
LS was a strong point in Lexus lineup - it just needed more of what it already had. It was doing well in sales until they did another refresh and not a brand new model. Plus now you have solid alternatives from G90, S90, Model S, A8, CT6, Continental etc.
President Akio should not "niche" to his own tastes, nor the personal tastes of people like Rhambler and their zest for HP & 0-60.
President Akio should learn to design the LS for full size luxury market tastes...
12-24-17, 08:26 PM
#701
I'm very curious to know if you've actually driven the car or seen the numbers to make these exaggerated Trump-isms?
12-24-17, 08:57 PM
#703
So coming from somebody that actually drove the car and a seasoned automotive reviewer. He is drawing almost polar opposite conclusions than some of you in this thread that haven't been behind the wheel of the 5LS.
"really nipping at the heels of the S class"
"blown away"
"fun to drive"
"even more BMW than a BMW"
"its got the grunt of a v8, torque comes in at 1600rpm"
"I would argue, at least on par for #2 spot in this segment, meaning its as good if not inches out the 7 series"
So while some of you guys (who have not spent even a second driving the 5LS) are busy comparing it to a G90, experts are comparing it to the S Class. Something must be lost in translation. Probably all the hate.
"really nipping at the heels of the S class"
"blown away"
"fun to drive"
"even more BMW than a BMW"
"its got the grunt of a v8, torque comes in at 1600rpm"
"I would argue, at least on par for #2 spot in this segment, meaning its as good if not inches out the 7 series"
So while some of you guys (who have not spent even a second driving the 5LS) are busy comparing it to a G90, experts are comparing it to the S Class. Something must be lost in translation. Probably all the hate.
Last edited by G Star; 12-25-17 at 03:22 AM.
12-25-17, 01:46 AM
#704
Furthermore, I'm not that enamored with the Panamera, as I find it's overall appearance hideous plus the Panamera's main calling card is performance & handling as it's more of a large sports sedan than a reserved luxury sedan.
These are valid criticisms, particularly the TT V6 as the sole engine choice, which was a big mistake on the part of Lexus. And my interpretation of the ride quality based on many of the reviews is not so much "sporty" but a less floaty, more buttoned down ride. Also one must take into consideration that the firmer ride mentioned in reviews of the LS & LS F-Sport models is primarily due to 20 inch wheels and run flat tires.
The $2,000 - $3,000 difference in MSRP (base model) from a 2017 LS 460 to 2018 LS 500 is more than justified, especially considering all the new features, technology, craftsmanship & upgraded interior with better materials.
Opinion. You may consider the LS 500 styling to be "weird", but for me it's stunning & cutting edge.
True, but I think the unique new design language along with Lexus reliability, quality & potential excellent resale value will make the LS 500 a major player in the large luxury sedan segment.
Last edited by bjjones; 12-25-17 at 02:28 AM.
12-25-17, 02:04 AM
#705
I was discussing the LS 500 "as a Japanese Panamera" based on some of it's exterior styling elements, not from a performance & handling standpoint.