MattyG

The only consolation prize in that is that the sales of those CUV's allowed Porsche to fund further developments and tech in the real cars that those engineers and Porsche purists really love. Sell the SUV to the punters, but get real and keep the sports cars for the core customers who know better.

mmarshall

It actually did both. Porsche DID expand its sales-appeal (and profits) by bringing out the Cayenne, Panamera, and Macan, but, at the same time, also diminished its reputation with the purists. MattyG also makes a good point about the SUVs being a cash-cow for further sports-car development.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

SUVs "diminished its reputation with purists" - same joke we hear about all changes... stick shifts to faster automatics, driven wheels, turbos vs. NA vs. hybrid, etc., pushrods vs overhead cams... EVERY new gen of Corvette for example "outrages" the "traditionalists" yet somehow corvette shows go on all over the country, year after year. but the handful of complainers are good for exaggerated fake news.

back to porsche, porsche is building the best cars it has ever built, by miles. the expanded range has expanded the appeal. sales of sports cars overall are struggling, not just at porsche.

back to lotus - it will be interesting to see if they take an "elise" approach to an suv... light, fast, incredibly noisy.

mmarshall

With all due respect, you (apparently) read only half of my post. I was agreeing with Sulu that the so-called "bastardization" of the Porsche brand with purists also provided more sales (and income) for the money to be put into sports-car development. And, as far as the Corvette goes, we'll see how the faithful accept the new mid-engine version...that still remains to be seen.

......just as dear Colin would have it LOL.

Gojirra99

I will tell you this though. when I was just at the AMG performance tour, they divide the cars in groups of three, and us drivers take turns driving the 3 cars in each group and try to follow each other when we go around the track.
One particular group has a GLE63S together with a E63S and C63S(IIRC). The GLE63S had a hell of a difficult time keeping up with the other two by all the drivers. To be expected, but It is so cumbersome to drive I would never want to drive it again, never mind buy one. Performance SUVs are a total waste of time IMHO.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

yeah an suv on a track is a bit dumb. gravity wins

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

please don't assume what i did or didn't read, thanks ... my comment was just only about the part i quoted, no need to quote it all.

as always, there will be 'outrage' that will be 'news' but the new corvette will no doubt be better than all before, bringing in new buyers and enthusiasts.

Aron9000

Porsche built the Cayenne because they wanted to remain an independent company, they needed a car that would sell in greater volume. Keep in mind the company almost went bankrupt in the early-mid 90's, their sales slowed to a trickle. The Cayenne kept the company healthy financially and independent, at least until they tried to buy VW with debt and creative financing. Economy collapsed, Porsche's IMO recklessly risky plan imploded, leaving the company with more debt than assets, VW turned around and bought Porsche out.

Anyways, I guess my point is that Lotus is not financially independent, its not a huge company like Porsche. I'd compare it more to a niche maker like Aston Martin, Ariel, with limited resources. It needs to find its niche in the sports car world and focus on making those, it doesn't have the capital, manpower or expertise to do both sports cars and an SUV, or at least do both well.

Sulu

It looks like the business case for introducing crossover SUVs is better than we on Car Chat will admit to. Crossovers are great moneymakers right now, and despite bastardizing a "pure" brand, they do attract buyers to the brand, allowing the brand to retain its base and they bring in new funds, allowing the automaker to invest in the pure models that made the brand.

Lotus is now under the control of Geely, the same Chinese company that owns Volvo. Lotus will have the money to invest in creating a new crossover.

Hoppean

Missed out on that fact, this does kinda change things tbh.

UDel

Who do they plan to market a Lotus SUV to? Lotus is a very small company with a very small footprint in the industry, it is purely a enthusiasts sports car company with limited offerings and limited knowledge it even exists from the general public so there is basically no desire for a SUV from current Lotus owners or the public. It is probably the last company that should be doing a SUV and it will likely flop and take money and resources from other projects. They need a new Espirit or some kind of GT car before they need this pointless SUV.

MattyG

Maybe Geely is thinking that a CUV would be a life boat for Lotus. The sales numbers for the brand are mighty low, but that's expected for a niche sports car manufacturer like Lotus. Too bad they never stuck with the Esprit (James Bond submarine car). An updated modernized version would have been interesting. I too agree that unless you can answer the question, "who's going to buy our crossover?", there's some doubt about how much potential there is for good sales figures.

mmarshall

Yeah, the GLE can be tipsy enough, but, even with stability control, I sure wouldn't want to try and throw a G63 Gelandewagen around a corner. THAT's where the Lotus SUV will probably shine...it will probably handle circles around a lot of today's big SUVs.

Aron9000

Excellent point. There is no brand recognition with Lotus among the general population. Porsche built its brand on sports cars and racing, but IMO what really allowed the Cayenne to succeed was the wide spread snob appeal of the Porsche badge.

Everybody knew what a Porsche was before the Cayenne, they were already selling automatic 911's, 928's(great cruiser, not really a sports car IMO), 944's, Boxters(1st gen Boxter was such a crap car IMO) just based on the Porsche badge, not because they were the best sports cars you could buy IMO.

Lotus has none of that brand recognition/snob appeal that Porsche had before their SUV. Really what Lotus needs IMO is a return to basics and some fresh product. The Elise dates back to the late 1990's, its older than dirt. The Evora never really caught on either.

What I think Lotus needs now is a revival of the Elan, the classic front engine, RWD British roadster. Who else is selling one of those, besides Mazda??? This needs to be a kind of Miata Maximus, ie more power, more grip, more brakes, but around the same weight. I know this a tall order, but make it tall guy friendly as well, I feel that the cramped cockpit and horridly difficult ingress/egress of the old Elise killed a lot of sales before the test drive. At the price this would sell for(50-80k???), the people who can afford it and want it might have a beer gut or a bad back, don't repeat the same mistake of the Elise, that you have to be thin and limber to get into it.

MattyG

Only because it's Halloween and a little trick is more fun than a sugary treat For fans of CUV's at premium brands, you can have a Corvette SUV. A little dilution of a storied car isn't so bad is it? Lol.



http://www.detroitnews.com/story/opi...-suv/99676442/



https://www.corvetteforum.com/articl...ss-sedan-2020/