Sulu

My educated guess is that the Accord's turbocharged 4-cylinder engine has a very flat (table flat?) torque curve, whereas the Camry's V6 is very peaky. In the Camry, at each gear change, the rpm drops and with it, the torque, but in the Accord, torque is maintained at each gear change. The Accord loses no momentum at gear changes but the Camry does.

mmarshall

Wouldn't that depend on which gear you are in, and at what RPM where the peak-torque was found? Some engines have peak torque at fairly low RPMs...on others, it's may be near 5000. As you noted, the flatness of the torque curve itself also makes a difference.

Sulu

As quoted above, the Accord's 2.0-litre turbocharged 4-cylinder engine has torque available from 1500rpm, and I am assuming that, being a turbocharged engine, the torque curve is table-flat from low rpm to high rpm. With a torque curve like that, there really is no need for a multi-speed transmission.

Rhambler

Just another slow Toyota/Lexus car that over promises and under delivers.

It’s funny seeing the Camry commercials with fire breathing out of the cylinders and people getting pushed back into their seats like it’s supposed to be some fast, sporty car.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: all of the new dynamic force engines will be grandpa slow, built for fuel efficiency and nothing else. The ironic thing is that a lot of the competitors can achieve parity in fuel efficiency yet still move like it has a pulse, unlike these cars...

Toys4RJill

Well obviously the Camry is not on the same level as a GS. I would still rather have a new Camry over a used GS.

plex

iTrader: (11)

This is the best looking Camry to date imo. I have a 17 Camry XLE (Company Car) I missed getting a 18 by a few months but it's a free car either way so no complaints. I like how aggressive it looks, the 3.5 V6 is no slouch yes it's FWD but it's a solid motor. Other than work car all my cars are old lol, 2000 GS4 and 95 Supra. I recently rented a 17/18 Corolla SE and was surprised by the amount of Tech it had radar cruise, lane departure, auto high beams etc...I'm a fan of the Accord too even though I like the 17 more than the 18 not a fan of the new Hatch style Accord but solid car.

UDel

Even a used GS F Sport or with a luxury package?

oldcajun

That would depend on how "used" the GS is. A 2 yr old lease return with 25K miles would make the GS my choice. If the GS had over 50K miles, the Camry would win.
Steve

Toys4RJill

Not a fan of used. Just figure a new platform with a new tech out weighs the GS.

mmarshall

I'm with Jill. In most cases (not necessarily all), there is simply nothing like a brand-new car.

EZZ

I would rather get a well balanced RWD GS that's used vs the wrong wheel drive Camcord. Those cars make me hate driving.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

I have a 2016 GS F in the garage. I rented a new (2018) Camry twice in the last 2 months. Camry is just Camry and no amount of "new tech" displaces a proper RWD platform that doesn't fight your hands for control when you step on the gas. I would take the used GS over the Camry based on direct experience any day.

And all these pointless discussions about torque this and torque that - nobody cares about engine torque. The only torque that matters happens at the wheel. That's why we have gearing. I couldn't care less about engine torque as long as I can get to peak power as quickly as possible. No, torque does not get you to peak power, gearing does. Average power and the ability to stay near the peak means everything. See attachment, and prepare to have all your torque myths destroyed.

mmarshall

Well, I certainly respect your view....and, from a purely high-performance factor, no, of course, a brand-new Camry is not going to compete with a GS-F....you're talking about a car that, in full-F version (not just the F-Sport) costs well over twice what the average Camry does brand-new. But, again, it gets back to one's priorities...and preferences. People like me and Jill, while, in general, not opposed to high-performance vehicles by any means, see little need to own one for daily driving. That's just not our forte....and, in my area, the sheer amount of stop-and-go driving alone generally precludes real high-performance driving. For us, and for many others like us, a brand-new Camry, with a full-warranty, no wear and tear on it, that nice new-car smell, maximum reliability, and the (likely) lower insurance-rate of a Camry vs. a GS-F would probably make far more day-to-day sense.

You may be overlooking the factor of the actual torque curve itself, though. Yes, short gearing, especially on transmissions with many gears, certainly does increase the amount of torque actually available at the wheels. But if the torque curve is peaky, and little is available at low RPMs (typical of many non-turbo fours), the transmission (and final-drive-dearing in the differential) is still going to have only a limited effect, no matter how many times you downshift. Theoretically, the only transmissions that can continually adjust for that are the CVTs, with an infinite number of gear ratios....but, of course, as you know, they have other limitations, such as drive-belt durability and the amount of actual torque that can safely handle. That's why you don't usually see them on true high-performance vehicles.

np20412

Yes agreed, but OP posted this in the GS forum so my post was written in that context as a GS owner.

That's exactly what I did. Bought a 3 year old 1 owner lease return with 26k miles. Loving it way more than I think I would a 2018 Camry given the price point.

UDel

It depends on the used and new car. Many people would rather have a good used luxury car any day over a brand new econo box or mid size mainstream sedan.